So yesterday was my first time to track in over a decade. Also first time with and automatic. Also first time with car making over 400hp lol. So needless to say it was a fun day.

anyways onto the goods. I got 4 runs in. I have no cage Nd I knew I would get kicked out after a full run. So I tech in at 11.50. Car weighs 3590 on their scale. I have a UCC $1750 converter with 38-4000 stall. Car made 702 on 18psi with the manual trans, it’s now got an built th400 with brake. 305-45-17 MT et streets tires at 12psi.







my first time up I use the brake pedal and gas moment before the green because car pushes through the brakes. Car hooked whole time, what a feeling. I go through first and into 2nd then let off. Car does a 1.6 60’ and a 6.8 1/8 mile. Mind you I let off before the 1/8.

at this point I’m super excited car hooked, I wire in the trans brake. Go to line, with 2step set to 4000rpm making 7psi. Super nervous at this time cause never used a brake before and I’m going all out at 7psi launch like dummy. I did nice burnout, wait till light turns green so I can take my time. Sit on brake for a second till boost, let off brake and car spins hard, in place practically. I let off gas almost entirely and then re gas, car of course hooks and i do 1st, almost all of 2nd then let off and brake through the quarter. Car did 1.78 60’ with 7.x 1/8 mile, 10.5 1000’, and 13.8 finish... this leads me to believe I can easily hit a 9 in the car. No idea how I got 1000’ 10.5 with such a **** start and braking through the end. Video below you can see I start at line spinning and let off to then start. Also can see how early I let off. Idk how did 10.5 to 1000’ when I let off wayyy before.


run 3 - lower 2step to 3000rpm and leave off brake at 1psi. Spin off the line, I slightly pedal it and just give car everything, I hit limiter at each shift and car did 1.8 60’ 7.x 1/8 mile and my first full pass of 10.88 at 133, actually did a 9.20 1000’ here too.


run 4, final - I foot brake car, leave pretty good. I pedaled are first thinking I was spin cause went up to stall but got fully into it quick. Shifted clean into 2nd and hit limiter slightly for 3rd. Did 10.55 @135, below is video of run from mid track and end track, as well as draggy which shows slightly diff from the time slip but I don’t have slips with me now.


ok here’s where my problem is, other than not having a 15” rear tire setup to actually use the trans brake. Look at the G of this video near mph, my 3rd has no damn pull like 1st and 2nd gear. I need to have more power. Cars going to tuner for 18 now to 22psi.

 

Definitely need to work on making it hook off the line, with something good to control boost through 1st gear so you're not getting all of it. I was in the 9s at 135 mph.

 

I’ll try find a 15” setup for next year. And hope the brake works then.i had no issue hooking from a roll out entire time. It’s the initial shock with brake that spins them up and then it’ll just keep spinning lol

 

With your horsepower and weight you can run 9s all day everyday. What’s your suspension setup ?? I also agree a 15 tire is a must

 

I have powertrix coilovers. Dunno spring rate but I have it on softest out of 16 settings.

 

Nice passes! Steep learning curve, huh? This is where shocks, suspension, tires and track condition/prep will come into play. Guys are running pretty damn fast on the same tire you're using. So maybe try to get the suspension and shocks figured out before changing tires out. I'm unfamiliar with the suspension on a 300. So little help there. Get a good video of the car leaving from down low and from the rear corner so we can see the suspension in action. For a first time out, it ran great. And came home in one piece!

 

thanks man! It ran with 0 issues. Only problem was siting at staging for ages with car on and off climbs the IAT but once do burnout the m1 sprays and cools right down.

i wish my friends took better videos but oh well. Atleast I was able to start draggy at the line quickly. Another guy who runs 8.50s in this chassis with same tires said I need adjust my camber and stiffen you suspension as much possible so it doesn’t camber in when squats, losing tire contact. Also said he does 16psi before burnout in this tire.

i was disappoint for the passes at first cause I really thoughT could get more mph out of it but 🤷🏻‍♂️ What going to do... I just wanna know why I’m losing the “pull” after 100mph.

 

A 1.6 60' Is probably semi safe and decent for leaving soft off the TB. Do you have the anti squat 300zx bar things? We ran very similar on the RX7 IRS stuff for drag racing. Basically bars that limit the squat. I even ran an adjustable pinion snubber deal that I adjusted so it was up against the housing at the track.

https://conceptzperformance.com/mega...80_p_12672.php

IMO you'll have to decide between a kick *** 60' and making the rear live. If you can stiffen it up I'd bet 1.5x 60's would be manage able which would knock 2 tenths off your ET. With a 3600lb car I think it will start breaking things if you launch much harder. I ran the factory IRS in my mazda for years and years at the 1.6x range. Once you put a trans brake on and start being mean they shell out pretty quick. That's not to say you can't setup the trans-brake to launch more consistently. (esp. for the street) Just don't get greedy if you want it to live a long life! I actually tame my T brake launch WAY down so that I can pull 20* out of the hit over 4 seconds on the street and not spin. If I just foot brake it, it will spin.

If it's sagging in 3rd the converter is probably too tight for your gearing. (or the converter guy will say it needs more power ) what kind of RPM does it drop from 2nd to 3rd? Boost by speed and time based timing retard are pretty handy.

Good luck! congrats on the first outing!


Mine would still squat a bit, but it was night/day for consistent 1.5-1.6 60's.

 

I would have to look into more anti squat stuff. So my buddy keeps telling me I want squat and soft back end. However other guy telling me you want stifff and all the weight into the tire to push tire to ground. I’m going again next Friday for a regular day and no event. Turn boost down and try see how I can do with consistent 11.5-11.60s to have some fun without braking and slowing down etc.

as for 3rd gear shift, pretty sure when I go into third the converter hangs at 5200ish and it sits on converter whole time to finish quarter. You can hear in the draggy that the rpm stays steady all of 3rd gear.

I did my 1.6 with foot brake. The trans brake was not able to get traction even with leaving at 1psi.
here my time slips. Keep in mind the 1st 2 passes I let off before the 1/8 mile. Last 2 passes I stayed in. 3rd pass has the trans brake at 1psi and last pass was no trans brake.

 

What ever you did on your first pass launch wise... do that! lol. Foot brake is fine and "gentle" on things. 2 tenths off your 60' is usually 4 tenths off your ET. So you'd be at 10.1 ET wise with your 1.6x 60'.

On the street a little squat may help, but its basically eating power and giving you a softer launch w/ less tire patch contact. You want all that energy throwing the tire towards the pavement if possible. With a sticky track and your power levels, you defiantly don't want squat at the track.

The hanging converter is from too tight of a converter mixed with the tall gear. You'll likely need a looser converter or a TON more power if you want to fix that. As I mentioned in the converter thread before, not many companies have it down. At your weight a 135 trap puts you around 675 hp. If you had them spec the converter around that power level and they had your gearing info... it shouldn't hang like that. I know it sucks, but I'd pull it and have them loosen it up. They should foot the bill since they got it wrong. Most converter companies give a free re-stall.

5200 is too low, its a lot more likely to munch a ring land or bend a rod there. What are you shifting at? Might try shifting quite a bit higher. Shouldn't be shifting below 7k.

 

I shift 65-6700rpms but converter grabs around 5200ish I think after the shift. Also I told UCC that it needs retune I’ll be going up another 3-4psi in boost. So he said the converter is VERY low side power wise. He would recommend a weaker converter normally but because he knew I was going up in power he gave me this one. So he said I’ll never break that thing and I can send it back if decide to go 6.0 later or change it up after the tune.

as for he first pass. All I did was foot brake it lol. Should’ve stayed in it. They didn’t kicked me out on either of my 133-135 passes for no cage.

 

I was in a similar boat my first track outings. A lot lighter car... but prob similar power and setup w a super tall gear. The datalog of RPM looked like a table top. It'd just hang at 5600 or so and my MPH would continue to rise, but the nasty pull in low gear wasn't there in high gear. 1500rpm on the shift drop isn't great, but I'd have guessed more. 900-1000 is was what I was told to shoot for, but that can vary.

I know your dyno maps peaked early, but the power should still carry past the peak. Might try shifting higher. Sounds weird but its easier on things to rev it out if the motor will do it. Higher you go in the early gears, the better it couples, and the easier it is on the converter in high gear. So it *might* not hang so bad on the 2-3. Or hopefully it will be at a higher RPM than 5200. Its fighting to couple... and is likely cooking the fluid a bit trying to do so. Might put a temp gauge on it if you don't have one and look at/smell your fluid. Not instantly going to destroy anything, don't get me wrong. Just not ideal and something to watch. I enjoyed my car that way a full season was still "fast". (to me anyway!) It did cook the fluid every 15-20 passes. I'll say every time I raised the shift RPM i gained. Unfortunately my setups didn't "pull" much past 7000 or I'd have kept going.

Anyway... not trying to tell you what to do! Just feel I went down this same road 9 years ago and wish someone had pointed out a few of these things to me early in the game. I struggled with the converter thing awhile! As well as the motor not pulling at higher RPM. I feel they were all tied together a bit. Only so much you can do with X HP and Y gear.

 

your not telling me what to do at all! I appreciate the help. It sounds like you know the exact feeling I’m missing out on in 3rd and it’s my biggest issue with car. I’m going to push more power to it first then see how it reacts and then send it out to redo whatever’s needed after that. I’m much more confident that I can obtain that G feeling in 3rd gear thanks to your post though.

also I have trans temp setup. It never went above 185 after a run. Going to line it was 175. Going to get my slip it was 185-ish but below 190. This first time converter and trans was ever used. Brand new install 2 nights prior. Just drove to gas station and then to trailer for track.

on a side note, do you think I would hurt myself with going 6.0? I have 700ish on gen3 motor 5.3 now. However I NEED more power clearly. I wanna be a 9.50s-9.70 car with my 3.37 gear. So it would need another 4-5psi (150hp ish) to get there I would assume... I have a gen 3.5 6.0 motor sitting around that I was going get new bearings,rings,cam and arp rod bolts over the winter. Would I be better suited to push the power I need on the 6.0 and deal with added tq on launching and less rpm afterwards? Would hate to ruin a mint running 5.3 I have now when I could sell it. Also would hate spend $700 on tuning 5.3 to have tune the 6.0 next season if 5.3 blows up right away... I think these turbos have a smidge if lag on the manual setup so I would think they work good on the 6.0, just need a bigger cam cause I was running out of steam early rpm now.

 

Those temps are really good! I'd see around 190-200 at the end of a pass depending on how long I stayed on the TB. Glide probably loads it up a little harder with only 2 gears. I think Rpm will help you more than power in this case... cranking power up with the RPM at 5200 isn't generally good practice, esp. on gen3 stuff. Id say you're pushing it even now! Keep the timing low in that area to help. You're literally riding the converter around PK torque.

Not sure what you mean by hurt yourself? It will make more power earlier and overall. But also be stronger with the better rods. Not sure if it would make enough to get you're RPM up where it should be though. Id want rpm as 5600 or more after the shift. Higher the better really. If you can't change the gear, a MUCH looser converter would be the best bet IMO. Get his suggestion... then tell him to go 200rpm higher in the stall from what he suggests. Maybe save up for an aftermarket ECU instead of getting stuck with the $700 tuning bill? THose add up quick! Terminator X or MS3 isn't far off from that. You can tune at the track.

Other thing to consider is everyone wants 6.0's. May be better off selling it and picking up a gen4 5.3 (alum block preferably). I see them pop up for $500-800 occasionally. And you can usually turn around and sell the 243/799 heads for 400-450. Last set of 706's I picked up for $50. Decent valve job and hope port job, they are a great head for the $.

 

I just meant money wise. Wouldn’t be wise to keep pushing this motor when it’s worth money right now.

So at the moment this tune has 15* timing from 3-16psi then 16+psi it’s goes to 14* timing. I also have the M1 spraying whole time. So my IAT is 60 or less. when I shift im at 18psi so 14* timing.

my scare with the 6.0 is the turbos needing be changed. They are t4 with the .68 hot sides and I had some lag so don’t think 6.0 would hurt it. Think my btr stage 2 cam right now was alittle small and that’s why I was falling off uptop. Not really sure honestly.

thinking if I sold this 5.3 block (together running with fresh Arp parts & cam) and just built another 5.3 with bigger internals, found some heads that flow better to keep my psi at 19-22-ish and still make 850, bigger cam. If I called UCC and loosened up stall some car could keep that pull in 3rd. So not drastically higher in power but does have more kick, I keep 5.3 for turbos, loosen converter some for that pull in 3rd I should be able do 9s consistent.

if I could get the pull in 3rd that 1-2 has now, I would run a lot better with no more power. So having some extra power doesn’t seem to bad with the new tune and some stronger internals for safety. I have 706s now. With all my btr valvetrain/pushrods.

 

Came homes tonight from dyno with car. I didn’t go for Hp numbers. I went to do some DIAG now that it’s auto. Anyways let me give some details of what we tested. First and most importantly, my car was only on 14psi which was around 500hp and super rich. Apparently my boost controller reset cause the disconnect switch I wired into car for track safety 🤦. I didn’t even get to see what car could do at the 700hp level at the 18psi.

the guy at the dyno thinks I have a 59-6100 stall because on the trans break the car jumps to 5900-6100rpm right away. The stall SHOULD be 38-4000rpm. No idea if this is an indication that the stall is that high or not. Start boost 4000 - full boost 5200

Shift 6800 from 2nd- lands at 6200 in 3rd WOT

Shift 6500 from 2nd - lands at 58xx in 3rd WOT

Trans Brake -no 2step = 59-6100rpm
trans brake - 2step 4000rpm = 6-7psi
Trans brake - 2step 3000rpm = 0psi

Sits at 6200 for 3 seconds at shift to 3rd, comes off converter at 140mph.

the graph I attached is ugly and I hope it can help diag my situation for the car having a garbage 3rd gear. Also I assume the graph is showing my stall being 4000 like should be?
Guy at dyno said my converter is super loose and that’s why it’s hanging out in 3rd gear for 3 whole seconds when doing a WOT 2nd into 3rd and holding it till it finally comes off the converter.

 

This is the kind of thing I was talking about as far as getting the converter right and going to a company that specializes in drag racing converters for turbo LS vehicles. Sounds like they don't have it right. Which is a bummer because they aren't cheap and now you'll have to chase the converter until it's right, or walk away and lose a bunch of $. By keeping the converter it may take them 5-6 re-stall's to get the thing right.... or they may never get it right. Some thing goes with the tuner. If they don't own/ tune turbo drag cars specifically, I don't let them tune turbo drag cars. Big difference between street stuff and drag stuff. Not talking bad about the company or your tuner, they may both be very familiar with turbo drag cars.

I don't know what is in that converter, but PTC can "tune" the low end (spool area) and top end. Sounds like they have them both wrong. IMO 6100 is way to high of a flash point for what your doing... though it may be perfect for an 8000rpm all out SBE setup. Then as seen on the dyno and felt, the converter is trying to couple for 3 full seconds. The power curve should trend upwards not fall off like that. This means you either need a ton more power/RPM/gear to make it work... or the converter is just spec'd wrong. Now the fact that you turned it down may be part of the issue. If you had then set it up for 700hp and you're only running 500 it is going to act much differently. I believe that's only a small part of the issue. Even if you turn it up, i'm betting you are geared too tall to make it work well and aren't shifting high enough.

Its good that a higher shift carries the RPM out more. It will likely drop more on the street/track as there is more load placed on the motor. This will make it struggle even more to couple. You really need to shift it higher. Maybe try 7200. Unfortunately to get past that area where it hangs you' likely have to shift at 7800 and make 900hp... I don't see you doing that on a gen3. You could play the part of a disgruntled buyer and tell them to take it back and refund you.... then call PTC. Or take a gamble and try to make their unit work.