Track car fuel
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Track car fuel I’m putting together a track only car. Prob will do some Mexico dig runs too. Cars not a daily or street car. Already have a 700hp Tt 5.3 for that.
So I’ve been thinking because it’s only a track car. I don’t need pump fuel or to buy a meth kit to run my M1 with ($950) or IC etc.
6.0 , s480-485, have th400 rmvb built with brake and UCC converter already. 3000-3300 lb car (maybe less once stripped) 275/60/15 tire I can fit.
so what ideas for fuel should I use? I was think straight M1 because i can get local for $3-4 gallon. It’s prob the success behind holding my gen3 5.3 I have now. No need for intercooler. Car will just have a fuel cell in it.
So I’ve been thinking because it’s only a track car. I don’t need pump fuel or to buy a meth kit to run my M1 with ($950) or IC etc.
6.0 , s480-485, have th400 rmvb built with brake and UCC converter already. 3000-3300 lb car (maybe less once stripped) 275/60/15 tire I can fit.
so what ideas for fuel should I use? I was think straight M1 because i can get local for $3-4 gallon. It’s prob the success behind holding my gen3 5.3 I have now. No need for intercooler. Car will just have a fuel cell in it.
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From: Mechanicsburg, PA
Track only, no I/C= M1. Fuel consumption is very high. So if your planning mexico trips, put in a large fuel cell. Build your fuel system for it and enjoy. It's pretty incredible stuff. Use caution though, very flammable and hard to see burning in daylight.
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Thread Starter
TECH Regular
Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 460
Likes: 44
Do I need special fuel lines or large injectors like e85? I need injectors I know but e85 is way higher.
Yes, you will need special fuel line and VERY large injectors. If you think you need larger stuff for E85, Methanol blows that out of the water. Targer AFR can be in the 3's! For a track only car it is definitely the way to go though. I would just go straight into a mechanical fuel pump and two sets of injectors as well.
M1 is great, but is a pain. Yes, you need a ridiculous pump (usually mechanical) and BIG injectors. You' likely need 16 injectors. Check out what 500lb injectors cost and that $900 meth kit is chump change! lol. Methanol is corrosive and hard on things in general. Milks down oil if you go very rich with it, which you would need to do with out an IC. It attracts water... Basically not a user friendly fuel in any way. But it does work well!
What is the power goal? Do you have E85 close? E98 or barrel ethanol blends are another good option.
Straight c16 is great as well. But you won't get the charge and cylinder cooling you would with ethanol. So not as good if you don't want an IC.
Honestly you' prob get a decent ECU if its a drag car. So progressive methanol injection is cheap. E85 or E98 with meth inj would be my pick.
Or run a nice A2W IC with C16.
What is the power goal? Do you have E85 close? E98 or barrel ethanol blends are another good option.
Straight c16 is great as well. But you won't get the charge and cylinder cooling you would with ethanol. So not as good if you don't want an IC.
Honestly you' prob get a decent ECU if its a drag car. So progressive methanol injection is cheap. E85 or E98 with meth inj would be my pick.
Or run a nice A2W IC with C16.
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M1 is great, but is a pain. Yes, you need a ridiculous pump (usually mechanical) and BIG injectors. You' likely need 16 injectors. Check out what 500lb injectors cost and that $900 meth kit is chump change! lol. Methanol is corrosive and hard on things in general. Milks down oil if you go very rich with it, which you would need to do with out an IC. It attracts water... Basically not a user friendly fuel in any way. But it does work well!
What is the power goal? Do you have E85 close? E98 or barrel ethanol blends are another good option.
Straight c16 is great as well. But you won't get the charge and cylinder cooling you would with ethanol. So not as good if you don't want an IC.
Honestly you' prob get a decent ECU if its a drag car. So progressive methanol injection is cheap. E85 or E98 with meth inj would be my pick.
Or run a nice A2W IC with C16.
What is the power goal? Do you have E85 close? E98 or barrel ethanol blends are another good option.
Straight c16 is great as well. But you won't get the charge and cylinder cooling you would with ethanol. So not as good if you don't want an IC.
Honestly you' prob get a decent ECU if its a drag car. So progressive methanol injection is cheap. E85 or E98 with meth inj would be my pick.
Or run a nice A2W IC with C16.
Power goal is 950 wheel through the th400 with the 6.0 motor. Car will have a stand alone 100%. I have no issue with running a FMIC. Just thought doing pure M1 was awesome and easy to guarantee the power.
Because car is being towed around basically, doesn’t matter what fuel as long as I can buy a barrel of it.
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Verdad Gallardo TECH Resident
Joined: Sep 2013
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From: Mechanicsburg, PA
As stated, special lines, pumps, fittings, injectors and lotsa maintenance. But nothing smells better, lol
Currently working with my first methanol fueled car. It's N/A and mechanical injection and still a bunch of work. Very different to tune too. Wide tuning window compared to gas. I think you could pull off a relatively inexpensive methanol fuel system. Blow-thru would be the cheapest and for a race car, work just fine (look up Billy the Kid and their S10). You could get a used mechanical pump (dirt track guys), front mount cell, short lines and spend the money on injectors to do an EFI system.
Currently working with my first methanol fueled car. It's N/A and mechanical injection and still a bunch of work. Very different to tune too. Wide tuning window compared to gas. I think you could pull off a relatively inexpensive methanol fuel system. Blow-thru would be the cheapest and for a race car, work just fine (look up Billy the Kid and their S10). You could get a used mechanical pump (dirt track guys), front mount cell, short lines and spend the money on injectors to do an EFI system.
For 950 wheel I wouldn't bother with anything but E85. C85 or Ignite 112 are good E85 barrel blends. But you could likely drive to a pump somewhere and pump your own for very little $. Many have gone beyond 950whp with no IC on E85.
Honestly for a track only car, intercoolers are the way to go. The A2W stuff is just so hard to beat... But the Ice thing is a hassle.
I like the Idea of twins better for a track car. More economical too. You cam the crap out of them and make a few extra ponies NA, if you size them to keep back pressure at 1:1. You'll make quite a bit more power per pound anyway.
A healthy cam 5.3 with and A2W and twin VSR 78/75s just put down 1000whp at only 20lbs. Something to think about anyway. The VSR Cast 78/75 is like $400. The S366 clones are $380 would prob be a better fit for 950. . The Ebay billet knock off 78/75s are $270 each shipped. And you can get the .68 T4's with them for the same cost.
Honestly for a track only car, intercoolers are the way to go. The A2W stuff is just so hard to beat... But the Ice thing is a hassle.
I like the Idea of twins better for a track car. More economical too. You cam the crap out of them and make a few extra ponies NA, if you size them to keep back pressure at 1:1. You'll make quite a bit more power per pound anyway.
A healthy cam 5.3 with and A2W and twin VSR 78/75s just put down 1000whp at only 20lbs. Something to think about anyway. The VSR Cast 78/75 is like $400. The S366 clones are $380 would prob be a better fit for 950. . The Ebay billet knock off 78/75s are $270 each shipped. And you can get the .68 T4's with them for the same cost.
Last edited by Forcefed86; Nov 17, 2020 at 11:49 AM.
When we are talking the "cheap" S480+ sizes... Have we actually seen a VSR S485-S488 make more power than the standard VSR S480? I haven't. (not saying they don't either). And we all know the Forced Inductions units larger than the S480 really perform well. But they are Big money when compared to mid frame twins, and will always have more back pressure. Guess that was my point. Not that a single won't work fine.
Last edited by Forcefed86; Nov 17, 2020 at 11:49 AM.
For 950 wheel I wouldn't bother with anything but E85. C85 or Ignite 112 are good E85 blends. But you could likely drive to a pump somewhere and pump your own for very little $. Many have gone beyond 950whp with no IC on E85.
Honestly for a track only car, intercoolers are the way to go. The A2W stuff is just so hard to beat... But the Ice thing is a hassle.
I like the Idea of twins better for a track car. More economical too. You cam the crap out of them and make a few extra ponies NA, if you size them to keep back pressure at 1:1. You'll make quite a bit more power per pound anyway.
A healthy cam 5.3 with and A2W and twin VSR 78/75s just put down 1000whp at only 20lbs. Something to think about anyway. The VSR Cast 78/75 is like $400. The S366 clones are $380 would prob be a better fit for 950. . The Ebay billet knock off 78/75s are $270 each shipped. And you can get the .68 T4's with them for the same cost.
Honestly for a track only car, intercoolers are the way to go. The A2W stuff is just so hard to beat... But the Ice thing is a hassle.
I like the Idea of twins better for a track car. More economical too. You cam the crap out of them and make a few extra ponies NA, if you size them to keep back pressure at 1:1. You'll make quite a bit more power per pound anyway.
A healthy cam 5.3 with and A2W and twin VSR 78/75s just put down 1000whp at only 20lbs. Something to think about anyway. The VSR Cast 78/75 is like $400. The S366 clones are $380 would prob be a better fit for 950. . The Ebay billet knock off 78/75s are $270 each shipped. And you can get the .68 T4's with them for the same cost.
When we are talking the "cheap" S480+ sizes... Have we actually seen a VSR S485-S488 make more power than the standard VSR S480? I haven't. (not saying they don't either). And we all know the Forced Inductions units larger than the S480 really perform well. But they are Big money when compared to mid frame twins, and will always have more back pressure. Guess that was my point. Not that a single won't work fine.
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Power goal is 950 wheel through the th400 with the 6.0 motor. Car will have a stand alone 100%. I have no issue with running a FMIC. Just thought doing pure M1 was awesome and easy to guarantee the power.
Because car is being towed around basically, doesn’t matter what fuel as long as I can buy a barrel of it.
Because car is being towed around basically, doesn’t matter what fuel as long as I can buy a barrel of it.
I couldn't fathom the idea of a bigger engine and M1 just to make another 50 HP.
Agree with this for sure. If starting from scratch I would do twin 76-80's on mine rather than a large single. The VSR 85-88's make more with the new larger turbine offerings they have but with the standard 96 I would tend to agree with your assessment of the larger compressor wheels not really doing much. I saw Bewley say that the standard borg 96mm turbine only has the capacity to max out a billet 80mm compressor wheel. Anything larger than that isn't really getting you a whole lot.
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Bewley is a keyboard warrior that uses other's results as his "proof", having done very very very little on his own. Take everything he says with a grain of salt.
He was pretty rude to me as well. But he has still spec'd the cams for some of the fastest cars out there. Record setting SBE cars etc. To say he doesn't know what he is doing is also not true IMO. He is defiantly a "my way or the highway" type though. Pretty close minded. Still... Can't argue that his "spec'd" cams work well in MANY setups. I'll give that to him.
He was pretty rude to me as well. But he has still spec'd the cams for some of the fastest cars out there. Record setting SBE cars etc. To say he doesn't know what he is doing is also not true IMO. He is defiantly a "my way or the highway" type though. Pretty close minded. Still... Can't argue that his "spec'd" cams work well in MANY setups. I'll give that to him.