LS1LT1

iTrader: (16)

I too love GNs (and turbo T-types) and I agree that they could've sold them all well into the late '80s if they chose to keep building them but the turbo Regals did not exactly decimate the Corvette, they merely beat it (in a straight line).
An '86/'87 Corvette was a solid low 14 second car in stock trim with stock turbo Regals only slightly ahead running high 13s in the same weather conditions.
Once the modding starts of course the Regal pulls WAY ahead.

TriShield

No it wasn't, the plan to switch from FWD to RWD was set years prior to 1987. They cranked out all the Grand Nationals they could prior to the planned switchover. Once the decision and investment is made years in advance it's difficult and costly to reverse it which is why it seldom ever happens.

TriShield

It was always a four door family car too, the Grand National model was the exception not the rule. It had nothing to do with Chevrolet either, it had everything to do with GM's decision to not redesign the G-body chassis and replace it with the W-body chassis in 1987. That also killed all the other brand flavors of the RWD G-body, not just the Grand National.

BLUE OVAL TURBO

The GN/T-Type's/SS Monte Carlo/Hurst Olds, could have been saved . People forget on two occations the F-bodies were going to be FWD but due to enthusiast outrage it didn't happen. The mustang was going to have the same fate also in the late eighties but due to people writing in etc, the Ford Probe was created instead. I observe things that a lot of people don't think about(IE) The updated n/a 3.8 L made 200 h.p. the same rating as the '85 GN . Imagine possibly what would be done today with better ignition/turbo's/ intercooling/etc.

Fraxum

iTrader: (2)

Doh, I meant GT500.

I came up with a price comparison comparing a not highly optioned SS at say $33K and an average 2006 GTO at $18K. Fair numbers?

And comparing the GTO and SS is not quite fair to the new SS in price since the GTO is now 3 years old and has miles on it, but is the new SS going to be worth $15K+ more?

Maybe not to me. I just wish the Camaro being smaller would be 200 - 300 lbs lighter then the GTO (with comparable options). Then I could see a significant advantage. LS2 versus LS3? Not a huge difference. The handling difference? You might notice only at the track (IMO), the round kind.

But that $15K will buy 100 HP and a Pedders suspension, easy, with change left over and better performance every where. And maybe you get some of these mods for free on the GTO.

Which leaves looks. GTO - boring, but is a bit of a Q ship just like the original GTO. Camaro - I like it better, but beautiful in way the 1970 and 1993 Camaros seemed at the time? No, the SS is not a beauty.

The GTO just makes more sense. But then the new SS is more exciting. I guess it depends on which brain is doing the thinking.

But wait, what if I just drop an LS3 in my WS6?

Fraxum

iTrader: (2)

Hmmm let me think this over.

Assuming my WS6 is worth $7.5K and the '06 GTO $18K. For the $11.5K difference could I drop in a new LS3 and upgrade to a smoother better handling suspension?

Then my WS6 would out perform both the GTO and the Camaro SS.

As fars as looks go the WS6 attracts more attention already than a GTO but maybe does not fare so well against an SS Camaro. But if the Camaro becomes popular people will stop noticing these as much too.

But then what is that $18K LS3 WS6 worth? $10K? The $18K GTO is still worth $18K at first but droping fast. In 2-3 years both cars may be worth about the same.

The $25K modded GTO will not be worth much more that the stock GTO in the long run.

In that same time period the $33K SS will be worth say $23K.

Ok so let's compare the cost of the 4 options:

Car:...................Cost .......After 3 years...Diff
'97 LS3 WS6......- $18K...........$10K?.........$8K
'06 GTO Stock... - $18K .........$11K ..........$7K
'06 GTO Modded - $25K .........$12K ..........$13K
'10 Camaro SS... - $33K..........$23K...........$10K

These number are all just not so wild guesses. Feel free to rip me for them.

Which of the options would be the most fun? The LS3 WS6?

But looking at it this way the SS is not so expensive compared to the others. If we extend this train of thought over more years the SS will continue to drop and the other cars will bottom out. But who knows what will be happening then? Will we all be living in trailers?

The lesson here seems to be: Buy your cars pre-modded.

LS1LT1

iTrader: (16)

Very true, I remember that well.
The FWD Probe was originally slated to replace the RWD Mustang and I think the Beretta was going to do the same to the Camaro but the public outcry was well received and the Pony cars were spared. Thank God.

LS1LT1

iTrader: (16)

I hear ya on this one, it IS a tough call. The Camaro will likely be the overall better (and better performing) car but will it be $15k+ better? I'm not sure.
They're both great cars and ya can't go wrong either way.

I also like your LS3 WS6 idea, lighter, cheaper, FASTER.

hc8719

Stop comparing the GTO and the Camaro.

They are not the same car, not even the same platform, even if the V-body and Zeta have some similarities.

I wouldn't go as far as saying at they are basically with same thing, as the OP did, just because they are RWD, IRS, V8 coupes.

enginjoe

iTrader: (11)

They are or will be; however, heavy pigs...

hc8719

You dumbass, have you ever driven a GTO?

enginjoe

iTrader: (11)

I've driven in one and they are very nicely made and handle very well. That's why I'm considering a G8, so I at least get a couple extra doors to go with the weight. My buddy has the 2006 model w/stall and tune. He runs 14.0s very consistently on street tires, LOL!

TriShield

The G8 suspension and steering is light years better. Unlike the GTO it can also fit wide tires up to 305s out back.

hc8719

Exactly. Compare the G8 and the Camaro. Not that the GTO is a bad car, but the V platform it is too different from the Zeta platform, to call the Camaro, a new paneled GTO

GeorgeInNePa

Most of these cars will never see sticky tires and a drag strip.

Many will be used as intended, a sporty, everyday car.

The rear, if the same as the G8 rear will be fine. There are cars running 11s with that rear.

Also, the Aussies have been using the same rear for almost 3 years now, with 6 speed cars.

Fraxum

iTrader: (2)

But why can't we compare them? The Camaro has a few improvements and I do hate the GTO's hacked gas tank, but the cars are very similar. All we can compare the Camaro to is a 4,000 + pound 4 door family car? Now I am not knocking the G8 GT, I like them, but this is rather sad.

It is also sad to see the Mustang winning the lightweight race if only by a little. If they ever put a strong motor in the GT and improve the handling it has a built in advantage.

The Camaro has very little added content over the 4th gen, why couldn't they keep the weight down? The GTO is a little fat too. So if we bought cars like food based on $ per pound, the $18K GTO is running up against its sell by date @ $4.86 per pound and the fresh $33K Camaro is $9.19 per pound.

I might just have to go for the managers special.

GeorgeInNePa

+1

I don't think the reason GM stopped making the F-Body was because they sold too many of them.

GeorgeInNePa

He needs to fire his tuner.

GeorgeInNePa

Take my G8, put it on a lift. Take the new Camaro, put it on a lift next to the G8.

The chassis is the same, save for a few inches of wheelbase. The suspension is virtually identical. Most of the parts can be swapped.

The auto trans? The same.

The diff? The same.

The 2009 GXP will even have the same LS3 and M6 as the 2010 Camaro.

The Camaro will be a few hundred pounds lighter than my family car.

YoungGunLs1

Just thought this was interesting.. All those STILL complaining about how heavy this car is, along with the GTO.

Anyone read the newest Motor Trend with the Corvette ZR1 and 2008 Ferrari 599 GTB Fiorano comparo?

Anyone notice that the $354k Ferrari weighs in at 3,975lbs? That is a 2 seater supercar that costs hundreds of thousands of dollars, so why couldn't they get the weight on that car down?

Facts are simple, cars are getting heavier AND more powerful along with better designed suspensions etc.. so it all equals out

GET OVER IT!