Mustang guys getting scared...
TECH Apprentice
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 314
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From: Bessemer City NC
Amazingly enough, that performance made the Cobalt SS 0.3 second quicker than the 300-hp Ford Mustang GT. The Mustang was actually a couple mph quicker than the Cobalt on the straightaways, but the Ford suffered from weak brakes and a floppy chassis. After only two laps, the brakes started to give ground and the soft suspension allowed the car to move around too much to go quickly through the high-speed esses of Sector Two. The Cobalt averaged 4.7 mph faster through that part of the track.
Staging Lane
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 51
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From: Austin, Tejas
The quote above is not from an article testing the 2010 Mustang GT but previous model. Many suspension changes were made to bring the handling to .93g and it now runs the slalom at the same mph as the GT500 KR. Not sure about the brakes though, they probably still suck.
I'll stay out of your "mustang guys are scared" post now. Sorry to intrude and start talking about mustangs.
I'll stay out of your "mustang guys are scared" post now. Sorry to intrude and start talking about mustangs.
TECH Apprentice
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 314
Likes: 0
From: Bessemer City NC
The quote above is not from an article testing the 2010 Mustang GT but previous model. Many suspension changes were made to bring the handling to .93g and it now runs the slalom at the same mph as the GT500 KR. Not sure about the brakes though, they probably still suck.
Overall, I think the Camaro's suspension is better. Better ride quality, better handling on non-perfect surfaces and similar numbers on the track.
A better comparison is base V8 suspension vs base V8 suspension. The SS suspension and base GT suspension are both made to offer a balance of handling and ride quality - the Camaro just does it better.
Yea, it fell very short in one particular category...........weight. The only "numbers" where the Camaro dominated was in acceleration (0-60, 1/4 mile). The GT was neck n neck with it in braking tests........some mags had the GT coming out ahead, others did better with the Camaro. The GT put up the better skid pad numbers, and the GT and Camaro were neck n neck again for slalom passes. Those are the only "numbers" that these test listed results for. Everything else was about driving impressions of the three. The Challenger was the softest, most cruiser like. The Mustang was the most raw, old school like. And the Camaro was the most balanced overall in performance, comfort, etc.
I've read/watched just about all the 3 way comparisons that I could find on the net....and the results are usually along these same lines.
The only "numbers" where the Camaro dominated was in acceleration (0-60, 1/4 mile). The GT was neck n neck with it in braking tests........some mags had the GT coming out ahead, others did better with the Camaro. The GT put up the better skid pad numbers, and the GT and Camaro were neck n neck again for slalom passes. Those are the only "numbers" that these test listed results for. Everything else was about driving impressions of the three. The Challenger was the softest, most cruiser like. The Mustang was the most raw, old school like. And the Camaro was the most balanced overall in performance, comfort, etc.I've read/watched just about all the 3 way comparisons that I could find on the net....and the results are usually along these same lines.
IMO Mustangs will always be designed and catered to the goal of "mass appeal" with an occasional AFFORDABLE "fast street car" (cobra) while the Camaro is without question far more focused on performance and the performance minded. Why else would they have made a v6 that makes nearly as much power as the current GT? Not saying stock for stock is even a race but, the times the 3.6's have been posting the beating GT's is not out of the question
The quote above is not from an article testing the 2010 Mustang GT but previous model. Many suspension changes were made to bring the handling to .93g and it now runs the slalom at the same mph as the GT500 KR. Not sure about the brakes though, they probably still suck.
I'll stay out of your "mustang guys are scared" post now. Sorry to intrude and start talking about mustangs.
I'll stay out of your "mustang guys are scared" post now. Sorry to intrude and start talking about mustangs.
GT500 according to edmunds is not all that impressive in the slalom, granted it is matched up with a Vette!
Link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WIPBP-9TUnQ
TECH Apprentice
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 314
Likes: 0
From: Bessemer City NC
From what I've seen...
V6 Camaro = 99 mph traps
Mustang GT = 102-103 traps
So yeah, the V6 Camaro and GT are closer than the GT and SS.
Without the track pack, most mags will have the GT at 13.7 or 13.8 and they'll have the V6 Camaro at 14.2 or 14.3.
Considering the V6 Camaro has IRS, better handling, better ride quality, much better gas mileage (28mpg) and a cheaper price tag, I can see why someone would buy the V6 Camaro over the GT.
Add exhaust/intake to the V6 Camaro and it will likely run right beside a Mustang GT.
V6 Camaro = 99 mph traps
Mustang GT = 102-103 traps
So yeah, the V6 Camaro and GT are closer than the GT and SS.
Without the track pack, most mags will have the GT at 13.7 or 13.8 and they'll have the V6 Camaro at 14.2 or 14.3.
Considering the V6 Camaro has IRS, better handling, better ride quality, much better gas mileage (28mpg) and a cheaper price tag, I can see why someone would buy the V6 Camaro over the GT.
Add exhaust/intake to the V6 Camaro and it will likely run right beside a Mustang GT.
Staging Lane
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 70
Likes: 0
From: MN
when motor trend tested the camaro the ss (m6) ran a 13.0 with no hook and 20 inch rims. easily on the 12s with a good driver on a stock car. never seen a mustang do that
Last edited by hotpocket; Mar 30, 2009 at 12:24 PM.
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Verdad Gallardo Has anyone seen a dyno chart of a SS camaro, since the GT500 is only making 447 according to the above Top gear video, I'd like to see how closely these two really stack up. I can't wait to see a road test gt500 shelby vs Camaro SS, my money is on the camaro
TECH Enthusiast
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 700
Likes: 0
From: Louisiana, USA
"The lightweight, Track Pack-enhanced Mustang GT posts the defining stats on the handling tests. Maximum grip is a neck-wrenching 0.95 g, and the GT circled our figure eight in just 25.5 sec (at a 0.70g average). The Camaro SS was nearly there, churning out a max lat of 0.90 g and running the ocho cones in 25.8 sec (at 0.80 average g). "
One braking test where the GT faired better: (from Edmunds test):
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...mktid=cj260233
"Thanks to the SS-standard summer-only Pirellis and 14-inch brake discs grabbed by four-piston Brembo calipers, the Camaro halts from 60 mph in 109 feet, nearly matching the impressive performance of the 2010 Mustang GT of 107 feet and embarrassing the Challenger R/T (128 feet)."
Again from Motortrend's test:
About the Mustang's handling:
"Indeed, the Mustang GT left all of us astounded at what magic Ford's engineers have achieved with this seemingly antiquated architecture. "That GT turns in like a race car," was our communal opinion after our mountain romps. Only when the road surface deteriorates does the Mustang GT begin to lose its poise. But, man, the incredible bite of the front end is the stuff test drivers write poetry about. Astonishing."
About the Camaro's handling:
"Just off-center it picks up nicely, though still not as sharp as the Ford's. Far less body motion on the road than in the Challenger, but the front end seems to sashay side to side more than the Ford's when I make mid-corner corrections. Otherwise, once set in a corner, the Camaro feels exceptionally planted."
"During our post-drive discussions, our consensus was that the Mustang rules for steering feel and responsiveness, but the Camaro feels more mature and refined. You'd be giddy pushing either of these two through a mountain pass, and if the road were smooth the Mustang GT might have an edge. But for all-around prowess and stability, the Camaro SS has the advantage. Frankly, though, we're amazed at how close the real-world-handling comparison turned out. Sorry, Hatfields and McCoys: No huge winner here. Both Mustang GT and Camaro SS tackle mountain roads superbly."
Doesn't sound like the Camaro owned the GT in handling.....only riding refinement. Which is what an IRS DOES give you. It does not, however, guarantee the best handling performance by default.....which was my whole point.
Why else would they have made a v6 that makes nearly as much power as the current GT? Not saying stock for stock is even a race but, the times the 3.6's have been posting the beating GT's is not out of the question
You can't go by old tests and numbers. Ford has done alot of work on the 2010 GT500's suspension and chassis....plus it's now pushing 540 hp right off the factory floor, not 500. Only thing that could possibly hold the upcoming Shelby back is shitty tires....which really held the 07-09's back so much from the factory.
Last edited by ThisBlood147; Mar 30, 2009 at 06:08 PM.
i'd be scared too if the gt only puts down 315 and the ss m6 has 422. thats almost no comparison, i thought ford would step it up with the challenger already having 345, and now the v6 camaro having 300. stock to stock an ss would destroy the gt, same thing mod for mod. the 4.6 is to small to compete with a 6.0 without some sort of an advantage. If the gt isn't boosted or shooting nitrous a stock ss will kill it in the 1/4. if they both have the same mods the larger engine will probably benefit from the mod more, so even with both having true duals and long tubes the camaro would pick up more power than the 4.6 would. I guess thats why ford is just catching up to the 4th gen ls1 powered cars now. a 2002 ss was underrated at 325hp, a 2010 gt mustang is rated at 315.
Mustangs are made to sell in mass while camaros are made to go fast!
Mustangs are made to sell in mass while camaros are made to go fast!
On The Tree
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 172
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From: McDonough, Ga, U.S.A.
i'd be scared too if the gt only puts down 315 and the ss m6 has 422. thats almost no comparison, i thought ford would step it up with the challenger already having 345, and now the v6 camaro having 300. stock to stock an ss would destroy the gt, same thing mod for mod. the 4.6 is to small to compete with a 6.0 without some sort of an advantage. If the gt isn't boosted or shooting nitrous a stock ss will kill it in the 1/4. if they both have the same mods the larger engine will probably benefit from the mod more, so even with both having true duals and long tubes the camaro would pick up more power than the 4.6 would. I guess thats why ford is just catching up to the 4th gen ls1 powered cars now. a 2002 ss was underrated at 325hp, a 2010 gt mustang is rated at 315.
Mustangs are made to sell in mass while camaros are made to go fast!
Mustangs are made to sell in mass while camaros are made to go fast!
Mustang's original and current purpose is to have mass appeal. With the current situation in the automotive world (Every manufacturer better understand this concept!!!) I will be the first to admit that GM especially from the LT1 to current LS9 has offered some impressive drivetrains. "Now" saying this i would hope that Ford would offer higher performing n/a V-8's of equal displacement to the current market. I am a member of several forums and often laugh at things stated by so called fan boys (enthusiast with biased outlooks and sometimes irrational observations.) About mustang owners being scared: IMO and from fellow Ford fans, maybe a little concern that maybe Ford should at least be a little closer in rated power and performance.
Rumor mill says improvements are on the way so time will tell. 
I am the only one who laughs whenever the Mustang's suspension is praised?
Weird, GM offered the same suspension for 20 years on the 3rd and 4th gen Fbodies! It was only when GM quit making Fbodies that Ford took the suspension design and put it in the new Mustangs. Anyone recall the stellar quad shock Ford handling prowess? Right, cause they were garbage!
It's funny that when the Camaro had the Tq-Arm/Panhard Rod suspension and the Cobra had independant, the same arguement raged on.
Anyway, enough bashing...each to their own - Mustangs are cheap, thus affordable. You will always be able to buy a used Mustang cheaper than any other pony car, and that will equal more ownership. I don't like driving in a vehicle that I see so many of everyday, so now you know that I will NEVER own a Mustang!
Weird, GM offered the same suspension for 20 years on the 3rd and 4th gen Fbodies! It was only when GM quit making Fbodies that Ford took the suspension design and put it in the new Mustangs. Anyone recall the stellar quad shock Ford handling prowess? Right, cause they were garbage!
It's funny that when the Camaro had the Tq-Arm/Panhard Rod suspension and the Cobra had independant, the same arguement raged on.
Anyway, enough bashing...each to their own - Mustangs are cheap, thus affordable. You will always be able to buy a used Mustang cheaper than any other pony car, and that will equal more ownership. I don't like driving in a vehicle that I see so many of everyday, so now you know that I will NEVER own a Mustang!
I really wonder why "car guys" still incessantly argue the stock timeslips etc. Once the modding starts, it's all useless.... a cammed LS3 in the camaro will be a force to be reckoned with, just like a GT500 pushing 15 lbs of boost and a GT with 150 shot of nitrous. All running the same timeslips after modification. Yet they still argue and argue about stock timeslips. 
they go off what they read or what one of there pals told em'
TECH Enthusiast
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 700
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From: Louisiana, USA
Ford was supposed to stay uncompetitive in the handling department?
It's funny that when the Camaro had the Tq-Arm/Panhard Rod suspension and the Cobra had independant, the same arguement raged on.
I don't like driving in a vehicle that I see so many of everyday, so now you know that I will NEVER own a Mustang!
