L99 and LS3
Whats not the same? I know the motors aren't the same but they still have the same issue of TM and skip shift. Both are something a good tune can get rid of. Skip shift can be avoided but TM is a bitch.
Last edited by HPT BANDIT; Jul 21, 2008 at 12:46 PM.
In the end, my real issue is with the fact that GM isn't using the same engine in both the A6 and M6 cars. If the M6s also received an L99 engine I wouldn't be exactly happy either, but not nearly as pissed. The fact that us auto guys are getting screwed out of the good motor is what really burns.
But the L99 will still be a good motor; they are so close and the power difference will be easily made up. We're only talking a difference of 22hp. The L99 will probably have more to gain from a tune than an LS3, evening out the playing field. What if the differences were the same as they are now, but they still called the A6 cars engine an LS3; would you still be as pissed? I think you should wait for the technical info to come out on the L99 before you make your decision. But to each thier own.
Last edited by SS#1531; Jul 21, 2008 at 06:25 PM.
you answered my question also...LOL.
what exactly am I ignorant about? you are bein a crybaby and you are whining because you are not getting what you want...exactly like a spoiled little rich boy.
dont buy one...see if I give a damn.
keep crying me that river
what exactly am I ignorant about? you are bein a crybaby and you are whining because you are not getting what you want...exactly like a spoiled little rich boy.
dont buy one...see if I give a damn.
keep crying me that river
Teching In
Joined: May 2007
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So whos dick do you gotta suck to get a picture with the hood popped? I thought they were supposed to reveal this bitch but I cant find any motor shots? Either way I cant wait to see how this car stacks up, any problems and whatnot. Ill definatly either be buying the SS or the new G8 GXP before this time next year.
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 34,647
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From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
Apperently you do give a damn, otherwise you never would have replied. 
I think you're a whining baby because you seem to be having a fit over the fact that I disagree with you. Remember, you attacked me first (post #20). You remind me of a 10 year old.
BTW, feel free to continue replying. All it proves is that you need to get the last word in, like a little kid. Your attacks certainly aren't hurting me any.
I think you're a whining baby because you seem to be having a fit over the fact that I disagree with you. Remember, you attacked me first (post #20). You remind me of a 10 year old.
BTW, feel free to continue replying. All it proves is that you need to get the last word in, like a little kid. Your attacks certainly aren't hurting me any.
Teching In
Joined: May 2007
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I dont see how DoD is that big of a deal, if you dont like it get rid of it. Wouldnt be a problem for me because I wouldnt even consider buying an automatic sports car or muscle car for that matter. Grow a pair and shift your own. You wont be disappointed, and you'd get alot more out of it anyways. Or go buy a Buick.
But to each his own, If you dont like it dont buy it. Problem solved.
But to each his own, If you dont like it dont buy it. Problem solved.
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Verdad Gallardo Joined: Nov 2001
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From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
Agreed. I would never buy a manual trans in anything but a dump truck or a semi. To each their own. I just don't understand what's so much fun about playing with a stick? 
Either way, you guys still don't seem to understand my point. M6 gets an LS3. A6 gets an inferior (power-wise) L99. All I'm asking for is the same base V8 engine with either trans type. Hardly seems unreasonable to me. In this section we've got a ton of people bashing the car for it's weight, appearance, interior, time to market, etc. They are just looking to hate this car. On the other hand, I really wanted to love it, but it's a huge let down that GM won't step up to the plate with the same LS3/A6 combo you can order in a base Corvette.
Either way, you guys still don't seem to understand my point. M6 gets an LS3. A6 gets an inferior (power-wise) L99. All I'm asking for is the same base V8 engine with either trans type. Hardly seems unreasonable to me. In this section we've got a ton of people bashing the car for it's weight, appearance, interior, time to market, etc. They are just looking to hate this car. On the other hand, I really wanted to love it, but it's a huge let down that GM won't step up to the plate with the same LS3/A6 combo you can order in a base Corvette.
TECH Senior Member
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 5,798
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From: St.Charles MO
A conventional auto will shift to the highest gear when you are not on the gas, and then the lowest when WOT, thats really great for balance coming out of a corner.
Before you say "but you can shift manually", thats only half true. The shift itself takes a second for the computer to do, and once again the car will be shifting down automatically when you come to low speeds, even if you don't want it to, it wont hold a gear. I honestly don't see a point in buying an automatic performance car unless the car is for drag racing only, and rarely driven on the street. And if thats the case why even buy a Camaro SS when its been specifically tuned for track handling and braking when your not even going to use it?
Either way, you guys still don't seem to understand my point. M6 gets an LS3. A6 gets an inferior (power-wise) L99. All I'm asking for is the same base V8 engine with either trans type. Hardly seems unreasonable to me
Please.... Joined: Nov 2001
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From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
JD_AMG, I'd like to start by saying that I respect your opinion. Although we've never agreed on the auto vs. manual thing, I truly appreciate the fact that you're a mature adult during these debates. It's refreshing on this site, and I just wanted to recognize that. 
Personally, I don't see a point in buying a manual unless the car is for autoX only. How often will you be pushing the limits of cornering and handling while living/driving in the big city? Only thing I ever get around here is the occasional open straight, flat road....which is great for a quick WOT run in a auto.
That just doesn't make sense to me at all, considering GM has never done this to us in the F-bodies before. In the Corvette? Sure. LT4, LT5, LS6, LS7....all were manual only. But looking at F-bodies historically, the top regular production engine has usually been offered with an auto trans, especially in the last 20+ years (only exceptions being LT4 Camaro SS/Firehawk, and the '91-'92 Firehawk, both of which received their engine upgrades at SLP post-assembly line). As a matter of fact, in the 3rd gen years the top performing engine was *only* offered with an A4 (TPI 350 and the turbo 3.8L in '89 TTAs).
GM sold plenty of A4 LS1s, and they sell plenty of A6 LS3 C6s. So the market is there.
GM sold plenty of A4 LS1s, and they sell plenty of A6 LS3 C6s. So the market is there.
True but in the third gen cars the reasoning was supposedly that the T5 wouldn't take the abuse of the 5.7. Which is funny cause I've seen people and I'm sure most of us have, use said T5 with 300+at the crank, let alone the 245 the TPI motor was putting out at the crank.
TECH Senior Member
Joined: Jan 2004
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From: St.Charles MO
).
Personally, I don't see a point in buying a manual unless the car is for autoX only. How often will you be pushing the limits of cornering and handling while living/driving in the big city? Only thing I ever get around here is the occasional open straight, flat road....which is great for a quick WOT run in a auto.
I often am pushing the car around turns (don't have to be pushing to the limit, or even near it to see the advantage of a manual).
Joined: Nov 2001
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From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
Only time I'd like a manual is for those rare occasions when I'm on the expressway in the middle of the night going into one of the very few "decent" curves we have around here. But that scenario happens so rarely that the M6 just doesn't really make sense to me.
I just feel like GM has basically flipped off those of us that prefer the auto but still want an LS3. I mean, anyone buying a V8 Camaro can't possibily be very concerned with MPG. That's what the V6 car is supposed to be for....all the style withouth the MPG penalty of V8 power.
I still really like the car, in every way except for the L99 engine. I know, it could be converted to an LS3 with a cam and tuning, etc., but the point is I'd hate to buy a brand new car just to tear it apart and void the warranty, just to start with an equal engine as the M6 cars. I would have felt the same way had GM done this during the 4th gen years.
I think it sucks that the manual is going to have "launch control". Why would I drive a manual if I wanted the car to take care of things like this for me? I honestly can't drive stick worth a damn, but I enjoy it, and even if I can't shift, I can certainly take off from a stop on a hill without rolling backwards.
I'm hoping that this is able to be tuned out. I would assume it would be... FWIW, I bought my '96 because I was terrified that the LS1 would be the end of musclecars as we knew them ha ha ha. In a way, I wish I would have held out for an LS1 SS.
I'm hoping that this is able to be tuned out. I would assume it would be... FWIW, I bought my '96 because I was terrified that the LS1 would be the end of musclecars as we knew them ha ha ha. In a way, I wish I would have held out for an LS1 SS.
As for why GM has Included DOD and Launch Control, I can only figure that they're trying to stay competitive....and the competition either has these features if they're heavy (Dodge) or they don't if they're light (Ford). It's a crappy reason in my book, but from a corporate perspective, it makes sense. (doesn't mean I'm gonna buy one, either)
TECH Regular
Joined: Aug 2006
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this discusiion is stupid what a cry baby geeezzz the dod will not come on WOT anyway I'm sure there will be 6 speed so stop ur crying and even if they did not ..then it sounds like this guy is full of **** anyway.....somebody that truely loves the camaro will not let something as little as that stop them......i have that in my RT Magnum and u can never feel it.....this guy has never driven a car with it............i jate all these losers that are not real camaro owners that come on here and cry about stupid ****......when the car comes out it will be the best bang for the buck overall preformer like it has always been....i would not change a thing on it
Last edited by davidadavila; Jul 22, 2008 at 02:58 PM.
I think the point is, the amount of fuel that DOD is going to save is so insanely negligible, it may not save any with the way some people drive... Yet it adds cost and complexity, and puts out less horsepower. (400 vs. 422) So why not make it an option for those people who are gung-ho about that kind of thing, rather than forcing it and it's inherent costs and compromises on the rest of us?
