Question About Using Battery Charger
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 62
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From: N.C.
Question About Using Battery Charger I don't know where to put this so I thought I would take a shot.
I have a strange problem when using my Shumacher battery charger on my 2002 WS6. I have to disconnect both the positive and negative terminals (installing charging posts of course) for the battery to charge.
Before you say "what's odd about that", I have a couple of older cars that I use the same charger on. I only disconnect the negative post on those batteries then connect the charger and it works great!
Why won't it work that way on the 2002? I have tried to connect the charger with only the negative cable removed and the charger will not work.
I know the newer cars have some retained power and memory for the radio and such but I always thought that with the negative cable disconnected the car was dead. Apparently I am missing something here.
Anyone have an answer about why my car does this?
Thanks
I have a strange problem when using my Shumacher battery charger on my 2002 WS6. I have to disconnect both the positive and negative terminals (installing charging posts of course) for the battery to charge.
Before you say "what's odd about that", I have a couple of older cars that I use the same charger on. I only disconnect the negative post on those batteries then connect the charger and it works great!
Why won't it work that way on the 2002? I have tried to connect the charger with only the negative cable removed and the charger will not work.
I know the newer cars have some retained power and memory for the radio and such but I always thought that with the negative cable disconnected the car was dead. Apparently I am missing something here.
Anyone have an answer about why my car does this?
Thanks
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 34,629
Likes: 2,551
From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
I'm not sure why you'd be having such a problem. I don't ever disconnect either the positive or negative cable prior to charging, I just clip the charger to the cable posts and it works perfectly. I do this every 3 weeks or so during winter storage, and have done so every year for over a decade. I use an auto/smart charger that doubles as a tender if you choose to use it that way.
There really isn't any need to disconnect the battery prior to charging, and the charger shouldn't care either way.
There really isn't any need to disconnect the battery prior to charging, and the charger shouldn't care either way.
The only thing I can think of is maybe whatever plating is on the factory battery terminals isn't allowing the best connection so that particular charger won't start. Once you add the charging posts it gets a solid connection.
I use a CTEK battery tender on mine and it works fine clipped right on the terminals.
I use a CTEK battery tender on mine and it works fine clipped right on the terminals.
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 62
Likes: 0
From: N.C.
Thanks for all the replies. I connected the charger to the battery with terminals connected and initially the meter did not move but after moving the clamps around a bit (Ah Ha) I did see a little movement. The battery is fully charged so I didn't expect the meter to do much of anything.
I think Z28 6SPD is on to something. It looks like there may well be some corrosion on the bolts, not the white powdery kind but a sort of coating (galvanized?). Can the bolts be replaced without replacing the cables?
Next time I park the car for an extended period, I'm going to connect the maintainer charger (with cables connected) and see what it will do.
Reason I have gotten used to removing the negative cable on my older cars is that I worry about shorts and of course the resulting fire associated with old wiring harnesses. My garage is remote from the house and I don't want to be awoken at night with a garage fire.
I have seen those before.
Thanks again for all the suggestions and help.
I think Z28 6SPD is on to something. It looks like there may well be some corrosion on the bolts, not the white powdery kind but a sort of coating (galvanized?). Can the bolts be replaced without replacing the cables?
Next time I park the car for an extended period, I'm going to connect the maintainer charger (with cables connected) and see what it will do.
Reason I have gotten used to removing the negative cable on my older cars is that I worry about shorts and of course the resulting fire associated with old wiring harnesses. My garage is remote from the house and I don't want to be awoken at night with a garage fire.
I have seen those before.
Thanks again for all the suggestions and help.
Thanks for all the replies. I connected the charger to the battery with terminals connected and initially the meter did not move but after moving the clamps around a bit (Ah Ha) I did see a little movement. The battery is fully charged so I didn't expect the meter to do much of anything.
I think Z28 6SPD is on to something. It looks like there may well be some corrosion on the bolts, not the white powdery kind but a sort of coating (galvanized?). Can the bolts be replaced without replacing the cables?
Next time I park the car for an extended period, I'm going to connect the maintainer charger (with cables connected) and see what it will do.
Reason I have gotten used to removing the negative cable on my older cars is that I worry about shorts and of course the resulting fire associated with old wiring harnesses. My garage is remote from the house and I don't want to be awoken at night with a garage fire.
I have seen those before.
Thanks again for all the suggestions and help.
I think Z28 6SPD is on to something. It looks like there may well be some corrosion on the bolts, not the white powdery kind but a sort of coating (galvanized?). Can the bolts be replaced without replacing the cables?
Next time I park the car for an extended period, I'm going to connect the maintainer charger (with cables connected) and see what it will do.
Reason I have gotten used to removing the negative cable on my older cars is that I worry about shorts and of course the resulting fire associated with old wiring harnesses. My garage is remote from the house and I don't want to be awoken at night with a garage fire.
I have seen those before.
Thanks again for all the suggestions and help.
I called a few places that sell the CTEK Multi US 3300.....its the smart charger that only charges when it needs to, to keep the battery charge topped off.
I also called a couple places in Europe that sell them since I am in France, Germany and England each month...I figured I could pick one up while I'm there and bring it back with me.
Anyhoo.......almost every place I spoke with about chargers says its a good idea to REMOVE the battery from the car, especially for long durations of storage IN CASE something shorts out or goes wrong and the charger doesn't catch the battery on fire, then you lose your whole car and possibly the garage, and possibly the house....and so on....
So my car sits for 6-12 weeks at a time when I leave the USA to go to work. I'll be taking the 2 minutes and removing it and letting it sit on a piece of plywood.......NO WAY in hell am I leaving an electrical source feeding electricity into a battery thats sitting in my car....next to my engine and fuel lines.....
.
I also called a couple places in Europe that sell them since I am in France, Germany and England each month...I figured I could pick one up while I'm there and bring it back with me.
Anyhoo.......almost every place I spoke with about chargers says its a good idea to REMOVE the battery from the car, especially for long durations of storage IN CASE something shorts out or goes wrong and the charger doesn't catch the battery on fire, then you lose your whole car and possibly the garage, and possibly the house....and so on....
So my car sits for 6-12 weeks at a time when I leave the USA to go to work. I'll be taking the 2 minutes and removing it and letting it sit on a piece of plywood.......NO WAY in hell am I leaving an electrical source feeding electricity into a battery thats sitting in my car....next to my engine and fuel lines.....
.
Last edited by LS6427; Mar 23, 2016 at 10:21 PM.
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From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
Reason I have gotten used to removing the negative cable on my older cars is that I worry about shorts and of course the resulting fire associated with old wiring harnesses. My garage is remote from the house and I don't want to be awoken at night with a garage fire.
I have seen those before.
I have seen those before.
I don't ever disconnect the battery for storage or charging on my late model garage queens because this would cause learned parameters in the PCM to be reset. I only drive the '98 about 300-500 miles per year at this point, so it would take quite a while to complete a relearn with such little usage (and would also cause an extra hassle every other year for the OBD-scan emissions test.)
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Staging Lane
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 86
Likes: 4
From: NC
...I don't ever disconnect the battery for storage or charging on my late model garage queens because this would cause learned parameters in the PCM to be reset. I only drive the '98 about 300-500 miles per year at this point, so it would take quite a while to complete a relearn with such little usage (and would also cause an extra hassle every other year for the OBD-scan emissions test.)
Last edited by y2k600f4; Mar 24, 2016 at 03:25 PM.
Launching!
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 223
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From: Apple Maggot Quarantine Zone
Yeah, I've run into that. I had my car in storage for a while, no battery hooked up. Got it together, short drive, and then took it to emissions. They wouldn't pass me because a couple of the self tests were not complete yet.
Ended up having to buy a short term trip permit, and drive it for a couple days before it would pass.
Ended up having to buy a short term trip permit, and drive it for a couple days before it would pass.
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 34,629
Likes: 2,551
From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
Don't mean to hijack this thread but I have been having issues with my 98 going when my battery goes dead. I have had the car 2 yrs and knew the AC delco battery was due for a swap so last year I got a new one (finally died). I drive it very little and normally would use a battery tender but a couple of weeks ago the car barely started (not used for couple of months) and went thru the issue with the idle reving up and down (idle surges) which I am guessing is a PCM learning process. Happened again a week or 2 later (would not start). When I went for my yearly emission test last year (right after the battery swap) they mentioned there was some codes in the computer. I guess I should keep it on a tender for now since I no doubt have been in PCM relearn for the last 2 years due to battery issues which left me with the idle surge scenario on several occasions. I suspect the codes of concern would be related to the emission readiness tests; anybody know how long they take to reset? I suspect I won't be driving the car for more than a few more miles before the next emission's inspection is due.
Idle relearn is another process. This too will eventually take place on its own, but there is an idle relearn process that can be done to expedite.
Sounds like your idle issues are due to the PCM reset occurring with dead batteries. Having said that, a new and fully charged battery should not be depleted to the point of not being able to start the car after just a week or two. Mine still shows 12.3-12.4v consistently even after sitting, connected, in cold weather for three weeks, and that's plenty to start the engine if I wanted to. Sounds like you may have an excessive drain somewhere, or perhaps a weak/faulty new battery. I would first make sure that it receives a proper bench charging - just to rule out any charging system issues with the alternator - if it then still depletes quickly from sitting, I would suspect an excessive drain.
Staging Lane
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 86
Likes: 4
From: NC
The readiness DTCs can be set more quickly if you follow a complete OBD drive cycle. The instructions for this process can be found easily via a search. Some of the steps take a pretty open stretch of road to be able to complete, so it can be a hassle. They will all eventually set on their own, but depending on driving style it might take 50-100 miles.
Idle relearn is another process. This too will eventually take place on its own, but there is an idle relearn process that can be done to expedite.
Sounds like your idle issues are due to the PCM reset occurring with dead batteries. Having said that, a new and fully charged battery should not be depleted to the point of not being able to start the car after just a week or two. Mine still shows 12.3-12.4v consistently even after sitting, connected, in cold weather for three weeks, and that's plenty to start the engine if I wanted to. Sounds like you may have an excessive drain somewhere, or perhaps a weak/faulty new battery. I would first make sure that it receives a proper bench charging - just to rule out any charging system issues with the alternator - if it then still depletes quickly from sitting, I would suspect an excessive drain.
Idle relearn is another process. This too will eventually take place on its own, but there is an idle relearn process that can be done to expedite.
Sounds like your idle issues are due to the PCM reset occurring with dead batteries. Having said that, a new and fully charged battery should not be depleted to the point of not being able to start the car after just a week or two. Mine still shows 12.3-12.4v consistently even after sitting, connected, in cold weather for three weeks, and that's plenty to start the engine if I wanted to. Sounds like you may have an excessive drain somewhere, or perhaps a weak/faulty new battery. I would first make sure that it receives a proper bench charging - just to rule out any charging system issues with the alternator - if it then still depletes quickly from sitting, I would suspect an excessive drain.