Snootch

iTrader: (3)

Okay, now before any of you chime in, I know- i'm stupid.

Last night, 6 inches of rain fell within 2 hours in south tampa. I got out of work, and barely got off base without stalling the motor. I got onto Dale mabry av heading north when I ran into cops who had the damn road blocked off because of flooding. So I decided to go around the roadblock through a neighborhood, and made it about 2 blocks when a came upon an intersection that was flodded. A minivan was in front of me, and made it through the water with little problems- I followed behind (mind you i'm lowered about 1-1/2" on DMS springs) and made it about 3/4 of the way through the intersection until the motor started missing on a few cylinders and finally stalled, even though I was trying to keep the RPM's up around 3K and feathering the clutch. I immediately tried to start it again, and was rewarded with a strange pop/crunch sound, then when I turned the key again- a whirring electric motor sound. I figured the starter got wet and gave out, and the bendix on it was not engaging. So, I stepped out into about 12" of water and pushed my TA out of the intersection.
This morning I went back, and it still would not start, only the starter whirring noise. So I push started it, and it started right up on the first pop of the clutch. It sputtered a good bit, and was idling after a good minute of blowing white steam out the exhaust. It semed to be running fine, albeit a slight tapping sound, and not being able to start. So later on that day, I got it up on a lift with a new starter in hand ready to replace it. This is what I saw:





The red circle is where the mounting bolt broke the cast metal bracket off on the starter. (bolt still in block)
The nice yellow circle is where the starter broke the other starter mounting point off the block. There is still a nice chunk of aluminum still attached to the starter.

There is water/oil tan residue on the inside of the oil filler neck, and I can see it in the oil. I'm going to call the ins. company tomorrow to have it towed and an estimate done. A good friend of mine told me to get it fixed right i'm gonna have to insist they replace the block, especially since there is water in the oil. He said they may be able to weld a mounting point back on the block, but it will never be the same and still may have problems. There may also be water in the rearend as well. This sucks- The car has 80K on it, and the KBB value is $10,130 (private party price) Is there a chance the ins. co. could total it?

Beasst8

iTrader: (1)

From Experience, you are lucky you didnt hydro lock your motor!! My wife did that to our honda. That was a motor swap. The motor was seized, but yes, they can total it. We got it towed back and then came out the next day. DEAD. Just tell the insureance that you dont know what happened. The honda dealer pulled over a gallon of water outta the oil pan. hehe. Cold air intake and 24+inches of water is not good. That sucks and good luck man

Snootch

iTrader: (3)

Does anyone know what constitutes a "total" by most insurance companies? 60% of the KBB value?

Beasst8

iTrader: (1)

I think it varies. That stupid honda was in 3 separate incidents. Togther totalled 31K in checks paid to me. I bought it for 23K BRAND NEW. THey NEVER totaled it. But as a rule of thumb, I think 60% is good. Good luck

TooSlow02

It varies by state and by insurance company, but the ones I deal with (and holy **** do I deal with a lot of them) draw the line at 70-75% of book value when reviewing the INITIAL ESTIMATE. Once they start having your car repaired they will almost never total it, since they've already spent money that they won't be able to recover if they do total it.

It sounds like you did hydrolock the engine, I wouldn't be surprised if you have a bent rod or two. I've seen the starter thing happen before, though. The engine was locked up by water and the starter tried to spin and couldn't, and the torque put out by the starter motor tore it right off the block. Depending on your insurance company they may try to get you a used (read:junkyard) engine to replace yours before they total the car. A new engine installed with labor will be close to getting your car declared a total loss, especially if you insurance company goes by wholesale book value.

KENS_SS_4

Yo, that sucks!

keliente

iTrader: (22)

Like the others said - different insurance companies follow different %'s. But they don't just go by KBB value...oftentimes they will do a small bit of research and find what the car would be selling for in your area, etc. For instance when my '01 Z got wrecked it only blue booked around $13k, but I got $14,500 from insurance because they adjusted the price for market value.

Your situation sounds like a nightmare. Don't take this the wrong way but I hope they total your car. I really doubt an insurance co would spring for a new engine, they'd be pulling some random junk from a scrap yard and who knows how many miles are really on it or how good of an engine it is or hell even what year the engine is. Not to mention they'll probably forget to reconnect some ground wire when they put it in and it will be problems, problems, problems.

Snootch

iTrader: (3)

I just called the ins. co. and they said I can have it taken anywhere I want to. I told them I want it taken to a GM dealer, because I know they probably won't try to weld it, they will probably replace the block. If they want to replace the engine with a used one, I guess that's alright as long as it has less than 80K on it. Or do you think this is a bad idea?
Edit: also, If I have an option of either junkyard motor or totaling the car, What would be better?
1- Take the money, put a downpayment on another vehicle, or
2- Get the car fixed with the junkyard motor; then sell it
3- Keep the car fixed with the junkyard motor.

christsbane

find out if you are going to be issued a salvage title, that completely ***** a cars value
if you are, either keep it and never sell it or have them total it

BeachZ

iTrader: (2)

How about a crate engine?

keliente

iTrader: (22)

If it were my car? I'd take the money and put it towards a nice new shortblock, maybe even forged, with a nice set of heads. I mean if you are going to swap engines might as well make it worth while...performance stuff is getting more affordable all the time.

I'm not so keen on having an engine with an unknown history put into my car...and trying to sell it right after might look kind of shady.

TooSlow02

Personally I think it's too risky using a junkyard engine; there's just too much chance involved. I've gotten junkyard engines and transmissions that looked to be in worse condition than the ones being replaced, and I've had to re-replace a junkyard part more than a few times to say the least. If it were me I'd take whatever amount the insurance company gave me for the engine itself (not including labor) and pay the difference to get a built longblock and have that sent to the repair shop to install. Either that or let them total it and pick up another one.

BORN2LOSE

I had the same thing happen a few years back with the FTRA. They drained the cylinders and tig welded the starter back on. Mine stalled out quickly as I was at a low RPM when I hit the water. The total bill was $1300. USAA picked up the bill minus my deductable. I have had zero problems since and the cars runs just as good as it did before. The starter comes off the block because the cylinders can not compress the water that is inside them. Good luck.

98BanditWS6

That sucks man, sounds like the motor is ruined.

I'd take it to the GM dealer, and have them replace the engine with an LS6, and just pay the difference over the cost of a replacement LS1. Avoid getting a used motor if you can, new is always better.

Snootch

iTrader: (3)

Dropped the car off at the chevrolet dealer today. As they were about to push the car away, I handed one of the techs there the starter. The look on his face was priceless. He said "this part is off the block" pointing to the aluminum hanging off the bolt. I shrugged and said "yeah". The State Farm estimator should be there tomorrow to have a look at it. Man, I really hope they don't total it. I've got too many mods on it to lose it like this. (headers, exhaust, clutch, springs, shocks, brakes, wheels, touchscreen, PC, stereo system)

I really wish I could afford it. I'm selling my house right now, and just paid $1300 to fix the AC and roof. What sucks is now is the prime oppurtunity to get some internal mods done (forged internals) but I simply can't afford it.

lo_jack

iTrader: (27)

Yeah too bad Snootch. I hope they don't total her, that pc alone was incredible manhours by itself. I can only imagine the guy's face when he realized "hey this is supposed to be on the car." haha. GL with it man.

BORN2LOSE

Did you read my post? It might not be that bad.

Snootch

iTrader: (3)

Your post did brighten my day a bit though. I hope your outcome happens to me. I was just saying that this is an opprtune time to do an upgrade.

LittleSlow1

The engine may be hurt more than you realize. To break the starter off like that you had to of hydro locked it. Trying to fire a Hydro locked motor can bend rods. If you didn't bend a rod I'm sure the rod bearings are hurt. What ever you do make sure that engine get replaced. Or at least a short block.

burnrubr88

iTrader: (2)

has the insurance company gotten back to you yet?? what did they decide to do??