BBK 80mm Throttle Body ?
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From: Chi-Town, IL
BBK 80mm Throttle Body ? I currently have a heads/cam car, and with the way things are looking right now I am probably putting an ATI D-1SC on my car in the spring time, I heard these throttle bodies are good when you start to up the airflow, I'm still running around on my stock (unported) throttle body, I have an 85mm SLP MAF...should I port the one I got now or step up to the BBK 80mm??
Re: BBK 80mm Throttle Body ? It should help with the D-1SC, but i had one and it didnt help, ported stock one felt better.
Got one for sale if you want it $100
P.S. its so cheap cause i got it off the summit clearance rack for $150 PM me if interested.
Got one for sale if you want it $100
P.S. its so cheap cause i got it off the summit clearance rack for $150 PM me if interested.
Re: BBK 80mm Throttle Body ? </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by DevilBird:
<strong>I still think the BBKs are too big in any application, but maybe stroker motors.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I don't get where are these people are running around saying "an 80mm TB is not going to help....it will only hurt because you lower air velocity....". Their mentality is all wrong. They are thinking of what happens when you mount an 850 CFM Holley on a bone stock 289......its going to bog BIG TIME down low. Fuel injection does not have that problem because the fuel supply does not rely on velocity through the TB.
It actually works in reverse. The larger TB makes it easier for the pistions to pull air throught the intake, down the ports, and into the cylinders. An engine is a pump and the less resistance to flow (in and out), the better it will "pump".
To me, it is definately worth the $429. I happened to find a guy who was selling his for about $250 so it was an even better buy but I can say 100% that if I was starting over, I would not be upset at all about paying full price. It really seemed to open up the intake system and made the engine pull much harder at high (3000 and up) RPM. It did not hurt low (3000 and down) RPM, I just could not feel a lot of increase down there (still was some).
<strong>I still think the BBKs are too big in any application, but maybe stroker motors.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I don't get where are these people are running around saying "an 80mm TB is not going to help....it will only hurt because you lower air velocity....". Their mentality is all wrong. They are thinking of what happens when you mount an 850 CFM Holley on a bone stock 289......its going to bog BIG TIME down low. Fuel injection does not have that problem because the fuel supply does not rely on velocity through the TB.
It actually works in reverse. The larger TB makes it easier for the pistions to pull air throught the intake, down the ports, and into the cylinders. An engine is a pump and the less resistance to flow (in and out), the better it will "pump".
To me, it is definately worth the $429. I happened to find a guy who was selling his for about $250 so it was an even better buy but I can say 100% that if I was starting over, I would not be upset at all about paying full price. It really seemed to open up the intake system and made the engine pull much harder at high (3000 and up) RPM. It did not hurt low (3000 and down) RPM, I just could not feel a lot of increase down there (still was some).
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From: Troy, AL
Re: BBK 80mm Throttle Body ? I don't know who has said that the reason the BBK doesn't show gains is because of reduced velocity. Certianly wasn't me.
The reason the BBK gives ZERO gains with an LS1 or LS6 intake manifold compared to a ported stock throttlebody is because a ported stock throttle body already flows as much air as the inlet of the intake manifold. The only way around this is to use a different intake manifold with a bigger inlet. Think about it. What good is an 80mm hole bolted directly to a 73mm hole? Nothing. You'd be just as well off with a 75mm hole bolted up to a 73mm hole. It's only going to flow as well as the smallest oriface. Kinda like a big chain with one small link in the middle. Only going to be as strong as the weakest link. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
The reason the BBK gives ZERO gains with an LS1 or LS6 intake manifold compared to a ported stock throttlebody is because a ported stock throttle body already flows as much air as the inlet of the intake manifold. The only way around this is to use a different intake manifold with a bigger inlet. Think about it. What good is an 80mm hole bolted directly to a 73mm hole? Nothing. You'd be just as well off with a 75mm hole bolted up to a 73mm hole. It's only going to flow as well as the smallest oriface. Kinda like a big chain with one small link in the middle. Only going to be as strong as the weakest link. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
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From: Troy, AL
Re: BBK 80mm Throttle Body ? "It really seemed to open up the intake system and made the engine pull much harder at high (3000 and up) RPM."
Dyno it with a well ported stocker and then the BBK. I think you'll see the same power with either (within normal dyno variance.)
This is assuming you're using an LS1 or LS6 intake manifold and that the conditions are well controlled.
Dyno it with a well ported stocker and then the BBK. I think you'll see the same power with either (within normal dyno variance.)
This is assuming you're using an LS1 or LS6 intake manifold and that the conditions are well controlled.
On The Tree
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From: Manhattan KS
Re: BBK 80mm Throttle Body ? I'd have to agree with colonel. If the intake hole is smaller than the Throttle body, it won't help, as the intake manifold is going to be the restricting factor,not the TB.
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Re: BBK 80mm Throttle Body ? </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Colonel:
<strong>I don't know who has said that the reason the BBK doesn't show gains is because of reduced velocity. Certianly wasn't me.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Not saying it was you.....we are cool... <img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_cheers.gif" /> ...I just know I heard this statement a number of times before and its nuts.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Colonel:
<strong>You'd be just as well off with a 75mm hole bolted up to a 73mm hole.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I ported out that stupid 73mm hole all the way out to the gasket edge. It is a little smaller than the 80mm TB but its close. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
I agree that the 73mm hole is the limiting factor BUT.....an 80mm TB has less resistance to flow than a 75mm. The result is a decrease in resistance as air moves through the TB (not sure if I said that right... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> ).
As I said before, an engine is a pump and the less resistance to flow (in and out), the better it will "pump". <img border="0" alt="[Camaro]" title="" src="graemlins/camaro.gif" />
<small>[ December 04, 2002, 04:37 PM: Message edited by: 2001CamaroGuy ]</small>
<strong>I don't know who has said that the reason the BBK doesn't show gains is because of reduced velocity. Certianly wasn't me.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Not saying it was you.....we are cool... <img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_cheers.gif" /> ...I just know I heard this statement a number of times before and its nuts.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Colonel:
<strong>You'd be just as well off with a 75mm hole bolted up to a 73mm hole.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I ported out that stupid 73mm hole all the way out to the gasket edge. It is a little smaller than the 80mm TB but its close. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
I agree that the 73mm hole is the limiting factor BUT.....an 80mm TB has less resistance to flow than a 75mm. The result is a decrease in resistance as air moves through the TB (not sure if I said that right... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> ).
As I said before, an engine is a pump and the less resistance to flow (in and out), the better it will "pump". <img border="0" alt="[Camaro]" title="" src="graemlins/camaro.gif" />
<small>[ December 04, 2002, 04:37 PM: Message edited by: 2001CamaroGuy ]</small>
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From: Chi-Town, IL
Re: BBK 80mm Throttle Body ? Alright, thanks guys, looks like I will give my self a little project on porting the one thats on the car..
Any how to tips and pics would be appreciated...
Any how to tips and pics would be appreciated...
Re: BBK 80mm Throttle Body ? On a stock intake I believe you will make more hp with a WELL ported stock TB then with the bbk 80mm. For one main reason, you have air flowing through a big hole(80mm) and then some of it hitting a stright wall(73mm intake hole size) causing turbulance. On a ported TB its flowing the max air SMOOTHLY into a 73mm hole without any obstructions.
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From: Chi-Town, IL
Re: BBK 80mm Throttle Body ? Does anyone have any pics of a stock vs. ported TB, also will a charger powered dremel do the trick, It spins 15,000 rpms....how tough is the metal to get off...and what areas am I looking to get off...and whats the deal with the epoxy...
Does anyone have any How to's on this?
I don't want to go ruining a good throttle body..
<small>[ December 04, 2002, 09:51 PM: Message edited by: BIGBOS ]</small>
Does anyone have any How to's on this?
I don't want to go ruining a good throttle body..
<small>[ December 04, 2002, 09:51 PM: Message edited by: BIGBOS ]</small>
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Re: BBK 80mm Throttle Body ? </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by BIGBOS:
<strong>Does anyone have any pics of a stock vs. ported TB, also will a charger powered dremel do the trick, It spins 15,000 rpms....how tough is the metal to get off...and what areas am I looking to get off...and whats the deal with the apoxy...
Does anyone have any How to's on this?
I don't want to go ruining a good throttle body..</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Try clicking on "BAUER" advertiser banner at the right of the screen. There are some pics of ported, epoxied TB's. Click on the purple one.
<strong>Does anyone have any pics of a stock vs. ported TB, also will a charger powered dremel do the trick, It spins 15,000 rpms....how tough is the metal to get off...and what areas am I looking to get off...and whats the deal with the apoxy...
Does anyone have any How to's on this?
I don't want to go ruining a good throttle body..</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Try clicking on "BAUER" advertiser banner at the right of the screen. There are some pics of ported, epoxied TB's. Click on the purple one.
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From: Chi-Town, IL
Re: BBK 80mm Throttle Body ? Does anyone have a pic of a stock TB...(the inside)
Sometime this week I plan on doing this...will a dremel tool take car of the problem...and why is the epoxy only in certain areas...some TB's have it in the one spot where the return area is, and some have it there and on the side?
<small>[ December 04, 2002, 09:52 PM: Message edited by: BIGBOS ]</small>
Sometime this week I plan on doing this...will a dremel tool take car of the problem...and why is the epoxy only in certain areas...some TB's have it in the one spot where the return area is, and some have it there and on the side?
<small>[ December 04, 2002, 09:52 PM: Message edited by: BIGBOS ]</small>
Re: BBK 80mm Throttle Body ? </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by BIGBOS:
<strong>...and why is the epoxy only in certain areas...some TB's have it in the one spot where the return area is, and some have it there and on the side?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">The reason the epoxy is only on one side is because on our TB we have this huge piece of the TB machined out with 2 holes(for sensors). People like to epoxy this and make it smooth so the air flows better. After the epoxy is dry you drill two holes out witch are way smaller than the stock holes.
<strong>...and why is the epoxy only in certain areas...some TB's have it in the one spot where the return area is, and some have it there and on the side?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">The reason the epoxy is only on one side is because on our TB we have this huge piece of the TB machined out with 2 holes(for sensors). People like to epoxy this and make it smooth so the air flows better. After the epoxy is dry you drill two holes out witch are way smaller than the stock holes.