Y vs. X vs. H
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From: Lafayette/West Lafayette, IN
Y vs. X vs. H I'm trying to decide what to do right now with my exhaust. I have an ORY, but am going to be changing to an X or H here very soon, so I would like to know what you guys think about the power of the three. separating the rpms into like 3 general area, for example 500-2500, 2500-4500, and 4500-6500(even though my car shifts at 5500... 
), how do those pipes compare for torque in each one? I know the X is supposed to have to overall HP advantage, but I would like to know numbers for different areas on the rpm band. How much better would an X or an H be in each area, tq wise and hp wise? Thanks 
), how do those pipes compare for torque in each one? I know the X is supposed to have to overall HP advantage, but I would like to know numbers for different areas on the rpm band. How much better would an X or an H be in each area, tq wise and hp wise? Thanks
Originally Posted by Tainted
I *think* the x pipe wont actually "loose" any low end power, but will mvoe the torque peak up. either way the X should out-perform the H pipe.
i lost a little low end with my o/r x.
Originally Posted by Tainted
it wasnt much though was it? and did you have tq higher in the rpm band?
i could feel the low end loss.. but when my car reached 3K RPMs pulled like a rapped ape
It's been stated that an X will outperform an H, but that has been disproven a number of times. The power loss or gain will be minimal, so base it on sound not power. I have an H pipe and a guy I know has an X pipe with the same mufflers. Mine is definitely deeper, but the volume is the same for both of us. There is a slight sound difference but not much.
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Originally Posted by 99Hawk262
It's been stated that an X will outperform an H, but that has been disproven a number of times. The power loss or gain will be minimal, so base it on sound not power. I have an H pipe and a guy I know has an X pipe with the same mufflers. Mine is definitely deeper, but the volume is the same for both of us. There is a slight sound difference but not much.
ooh do you ahve sound clip of the H and ST mufflers.. i have the X and MagnPacks and i am not digging that sound.. see sig
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From: Lafayette/West Lafayette, IN
Yes I looked at the stickies, and no, they didn't answer my question. I'm looking for some personal experiences with this stuff from more than one of you guys right now. The stickies are more like guides, I like actually talking to people about it interactively. Isn't that what the boards are for?
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You'll never get any form of straight or even useful answer. This is because so few people try all setups. And when others are compared there are ALWAYS other factors to consider which are not.
And to be honest, unless you are going for an all out race motor where every single HP is required you are not likely to see any noticable difference between ANY good setup, reagrdless of Y, X or H.
Each setup has been proven to work and work well. And yes even the Y pipe. The only limitation is tubing diameter. A 3" pipe becomes a restriciton on a boosted car quite quickly, but many people have made over 650rwhp using Y pipes and they are race proven.
X and H have potential to flow better, but it may not always be needed. they will sound different. Biggest downside is fitting and location. Espcially if you plan on running a body mounted torque arm.
And as for torque reading at different rpm. Well that will vary with EVRYONES setup.
BTW - Why is your car shifting at 5500rpm? Stock auto's should shift at 5850rpm. If you plan on big power and a cam you'll need to be looking at upping the shift point anyhow.
But as it stands at present, a regular 3" Y pipe and good catback would serve as well as any other setup.
And to be honest, unless you are going for an all out race motor where every single HP is required you are not likely to see any noticable difference between ANY good setup, reagrdless of Y, X or H.
Each setup has been proven to work and work well. And yes even the Y pipe. The only limitation is tubing diameter. A 3" pipe becomes a restriciton on a boosted car quite quickly, but many people have made over 650rwhp using Y pipes and they are race proven.
X and H have potential to flow better, but it may not always be needed. they will sound different. Biggest downside is fitting and location. Espcially if you plan on running a body mounted torque arm.
And as for torque reading at different rpm. Well that will vary with EVRYONES setup.
BTW - Why is your car shifting at 5500rpm? Stock auto's should shift at 5850rpm. If you plan on big power and a cam you'll need to be looking at upping the shift point anyhow.
But as it stands at present, a regular 3" Y pipe and good catback would serve as well as any other setup.
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From: Lafayette/West Lafayette, IN
Well I was just curious. I actually am planning on changing from a Y to an X or H because of sound reasons. I hate the rasp that I have with mine. Other people don't seem to have any with LTs/ORY/Hooker so I didn't think I would, but I do, and I hate it. So thats why I was asking about performance. If I'm going to have to make a choice I might as well make the right one. I'm just trying to get all the info i can before I do this. All out total power isn't even really what I'm trying to do here, I would just like to know exactly what I'm choosing. It gives me much more of a sense of control. If there was a big difference, like say 10-15 hp between an H and an X it would probably help me decide. If its somehting like 5, then it probably wouldn't.
I have no idea why my car would shift at 5500, but it does. Nothing has ever been done to it or anything, but it does shift as soon as it touches the yellow on the tachometer. I always thought it seemed low since I've heard about manual guys shifting around 6000 or even above, so I knew the engine could take it.
Another question would be this. With a lid, LTs, ls6 intake, ported TB, and *maybe* someday a cam/heads(not a real huge one though), will I really need anything bigger than 2.5" inches? Thats what the local shop told me they could do, but some other local guy said "I wouldn't get anything but 3", so I don't know. I don't figure I really need bigger than 2.5", since 2x2.5" pipes can hold so much more than 1x3" already.
I have no idea why my car would shift at 5500, but it does. Nothing has ever been done to it or anything, but it does shift as soon as it touches the yellow on the tachometer. I always thought it seemed low since I've heard about manual guys shifting around 6000 or even above, so I knew the engine could take it.
Another question would be this. With a lid, LTs, ls6 intake, ported TB, and *maybe* someday a cam/heads(not a real huge one though), will I really need anything bigger than 2.5" inches? Thats what the local shop told me they could do, but some other local guy said "I wouldn't get anything but 3", so I don't know. I don't figure I really need bigger than 2.5", since 2x2.5" pipes can hold so much more than 1x3" already.
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If it's purley for sound I'd go H pipe duals and chambered mufflers (Stainless Works, Powerstick or maybe even Flowmaster 10 Series).
As for flow, well 2.5" duals should be fine for zero loss on about 500bhp. That's a pretty stout h/c setup. And once you go beyond that limit HP won't suddenly drop. There will just be some restriction, but it may be only 2HP or so. It really depends.
A lot of HP can be lost thru an efficent design, but most good setups are fine.
You don't really need 3" duals unless you are going FI or maybe have a very stout large displacement motor, ~600bhp.
As for flow, well 2.5" duals should be fine for zero loss on about 500bhp. That's a pretty stout h/c setup. And once you go beyond that limit HP won't suddenly drop. There will just be some restriction, but it may be only 2HP or so. It really depends.
A lot of HP can be lost thru an efficent design, but most good setups are fine.
You don't really need 3" duals unless you are going FI or maybe have a very stout large displacement motor, ~600bhp.
My friend runs a 98 with the same bolt on's as I have with my 02 T/A, both autos, and I have more lowend torque and can pull more off the line, but he pulles harder up top. He runs an LT's with X-pipe and dumps, and I run LT's with ORY through a magnaflow cat back. Funny thing is his car as a slightly more aggressive cam than my car stock but, I do have the LS6 intake. I make about 12hp more than he does.
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Originally Posted by orangeapeel
This is apples to oranges to bananas....Anyone look at the stickies anymore?
I've learned from seeing, reading and asking the best builders in the country, that for all practical purposes of street driven cars, there is NOTHING better than a properly sized and fitted "Y" and cat back. Otherwise, build what you want for the sound you want.
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From: Lafayette/West Lafayette, IN
After paying extra special attention to the exhaust of my car over the last few days I have come to a few conclusions about it. I would like to make more power, but I don't need it, so a Y or X or H doesn't really matter to me because I'm not going to be making huge power anyway. I don't even know for sure I'll even be getting a cam - maybe just end with the full exhaust and lid, ls6 intake, and ported TB. As for the sound, I would like it deeper if possible, but it's not necessary. I would also like it a little louder, but not much. I think I might wait until I get my other mods to see what it sounds like then. I'm planning on probably getting a torque converter sometime, so that could possibly take away the rasp and make it a little louder(or so I've heard). The reason i would wait and not just get the X/H now is that I might like the sound of those now over what I have, but then once I get my other mods it may make it too loud for what I want. So I don't know what you guys think, but thats what I think right now anyway.
you are aware that you can NOT change from a Y pipe to a H or X pipe without getting true duels. Y pipe has 2 inlets 1 outlet, where as H and X pipes have 2 inlets and outlets, and ALOT of the performance of them is going to depend on what is behind them
. 