got the car dyno tuned and im not too impressed

turns out my stock tuning was doing a pretty good job dealing with my cam, so the tuning gains were not what i expected

All numbers are SAE now

pre cam and LS6 intake: 322 HP and 334 ftlbs

after cam: 352 HP and 355 ftlbs

after ls6 intake: 364 HP and 361 ftlbs

after tuning: 367 HP and 362 ftlbs

the gains per item were about right where they should be, about 30 HP for the cam, and about 12 HP from the intake. thats what i expected they would be. tuning was a little disappointing, especialy for the money.

turns out on the baseline pulls, the air/fuel was almost perfect, there was zero knock retard, and i was getting like 28 degrees of timing. i soon as i saw that on the baseline we both knew i wasnt going to get much out of the tune. the air/fuel took very minor adjustments, i was able to bump up the timing 2 degrees before getting detonation.

good points: got my rev limiter raised to 6600 which makes a noticable difference in pull since i dont have to shift as soon, got all the necessary codes deleted so no more SES light, get to sell my o2 simms now, idles much nicer, doesnt stall out when i turn on the air, car pulls much smoother throughout the rpm range.

the guys suggested with long tubes i should see another 10-15 hp, and with a set of pulleys probably another 8-10, which would put me right about where i want to be so i'll have to see what can happen there. he also said if i retard the cam 4 degrees and install it straight up, since it hs 4 degrees of advance ground into it, that i would probably see about 8-10 more peak hp but i would lose some in the midrange, i like the mid range power i have now so im not sure if im gonna do this one, maybe retard it 2 degrees.

im not too worried about the numbers, all the gains per item are where they should be so i know everything is running right and the car has never been big on the dyno. plus she still pulls like a ****

heres the graph

<img src="http://images.cardomain.com/installs/257000-257999/257263_32_full.jpg" alt=" - " />

Mod List Here

quick plug: got the car tuned at Norris Motorsports in Ocoee by the guys with C&S Performance. Top Notch guys. very friendly and helpful. nice shop. guys really seemed to know their stuff. Although my numbers didnt come out as high as i would have liked, it was a result of my stock tuning not being that off. I would definately recommend these guys to anyone.

Now for the big question, what to you guys think? Any suggestions, tips, comments, etc would be greatly appreciated since i definately was looking to get in the high 370 low 380 range and it didnt happen.

ryan

 

nice #'s dude! you just need some heads and you will be over 400
good luck,
Ahmad

 

A ported TB,stage 2 heads and long tubes will put you around 430 rwhp.

 

You stand to gain 30 from longtubes, congrats.

 

Where do you get 30 from fen fen?

 

To Tally TransAm: Do you have any sound clips of the car? Thanks By the way, good numbers for not having longtubes and other minor bolt ons.

 

Ryan, I think like some of the others that with some more bolt-ons (TB, pulleys, and long tubes) you will be around 385 or so.
Numbers look good though. <img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_cheers.gif" />

 

Personally, I think your #'s are not so great.. I would ask for my money back. I know many people that have a similar setup as yours and dyno 20 to 30rwhp more with mail order tuning. I would expect more from dyno tuning using a wideband.. This is just my opinion..

 

ORLLS1,

I don't know who you are but if you are positive there is another 20-30 RWHP there in tuning then feel free to tell everyone exactly what needs to be done. The car has an A/F ratio of ~13.0:1 across the board and the timing advance is at 27.5-28 degrees in the upper end with no KR.

Tim

 

Looks good to me

<small>[ February 18, 2003, 04:40 PM: Message edited by: Tim 98z ]</small>

 

Maybe I was a little too harsh about him asking for his money back.. Explain to me why other cam only cars with Mac headers and no tuning dyno 367rwhp plus..? Please do not say that they have all the bolt on's because I do not have all the bolt ons. Just because the A/F was 13.0 does not mean there is nothing left to gain. Just because the timing is 28 degree's does not mean there is nothing else to gain from stock heads. My current setup is set at 31 degrees and my buddy recorded a dyno run using a Tech 2 and did not see any KR. If there is KR about 28 degrees of timing on stock heads then there is something else going on.. This is just my opinion.. Not fact, but I hope some other cam only cars chime in and tell their dyno 's..

 

I'm running this same cam and had mine dynod on Monday.

My numbers were 370rwhp/357rwtq.

Mods:

Comp Cams XE-R 224/224 Cam
Whisper Lid
Tbyrne Ported MAF Ends
FLP Longtube Headers with Cats & Wide Open Borla
TR55's gapped @ .055 w/Taylor Thundervolt wires
Hypertech 160 tstat

I have some very *BASIC* tuning done with a MAF Translator, but the car is still running rich.

My dyno pulls were also done with 17x11 Chrome ZR1's with 315/35 Nittos @ 19psi.

Hope that helps you out some.

 

i am going to be a good boy and not post what my car gained at norris, oh,i mean lost <img border="0" alt="[bang head]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_banghead.gif" />

 

BlueBalls, you have no right to complain about the power your car supposedly lost on the dyno, your friend who had brought the car in to dyno it told us the car had been ragged on by you!

And by the looks of the car I beleive it.

Your car has a mechanical issue that caused the loss.

Have you checked the compression lately?

How about a leakdown test?

 

I think the dyno numbers are right on for a car with no heads.

As far as the tune, the air fuel looks good, but why is everyone fascinated by adding timing until they get KR?

Power/torque can be found in the timing tables, more often by removing rather than adding.

 

Don't be so worried about dyno #'s, you will never race one! They're so many fantacy dyno numbers out there its a joke. It sounds like the car runs good. be happy. Use the same dyno if you make changes, this way you already have a baseline. There's so many ways to alter dyno numbers. If you use a good shop that will give you the real numbers you will know what you really gain. Use the same dyno everytime. Good luck.

 

We reached a point of diminishing returns with timing at 27 degrees. At 28 degrees we saw no power gains nor KR. I left it at 28 degrees as per Ryan's request. More timing does not always mean more HP. We go one degree at a time when working with timing tables. If the car makes more power we keep going... if it does not we don't keep adding timing just because the knock sensors don't report knock. I see alot of people throwing 4, 5, 6 degrees of timing across the board... we don't tune like that.

As for the A/F ratio it made more power as we leaned it out but we are not in the business of leaning the A/F mixture beyond what we deem as reasonable just for the sake of a few more HP. Without an EGT on each cylinder it just wouldn't make sense to push the A/F ratio.


Blueballs,

If you are going to make comments of that nature then please atleast be fair and point out to everyone that...

1) Your friends drove your car to Orlando... you were not present. None of your "specific" requests were communicated to us by your friends or you at the time.

2) Before we layed a finger on your car it baselined much lower than what your friends claimed it had made in the past. We had absolutely no influence on what it did when we baselined it. Rather than take the time to investigate possible causes/explanations you slammed us on another forum. Your friends told us that your car had been run hard for a very long time. Based off what we had been told we suggested possible things we would check if it were up to us. A leak down test is what we suggested be peformed at some point.

3) You and your friend were not willing to pay for a full dyno tune. For what you were willing to pay we did what we could do. Anything more on our part would have been the effort of a full dyno tune which YOU were not willing to pay for.

4) Mike offered to talk with you directly regarding your disappointment but he never received a call from you. You seem to prefer discussing your issues publically before giving anyone a chance to work with you.

5) If you feel so strongly that we somehow ripped you off we will tune your car for no additional cost. All it will take is a phone call to Mike so this can be discussed verbally rather than on a public form. The shop # is 407-656-2600.

Tim

 

I will bring Blue ***** car to Orlando this Saturday. It will be a pewter SS Just hold that free tune thing.. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

<small>[ February 19, 2003, 01:33 PM: Message edited by: VINCE ]</small>

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Richie Carbone:
<strong>And by the looks of the car I beleive it.

</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Nice thing to say Richie.....that car looks damn good for being a 99....what's your point?

Stupid thing to toss in there.....I'd say for a ragged out car, that runs 11.7 on motor and doesn't burn or consume any oil is 'ragged' out?

Everyone jump on the <img border="0" alt="[rainbow]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_rainbow.gif" /> wagon because your replies are just that.

<small>[ February 18, 2003, 10:11 PM: Message edited by: racer88 ]</small>

 

I got 373 hp with no tuning at all, see sig for mods, I need some tuning done and I live in FL so I find this an interesting discussion.