Help me design a H/C package
Help me design a H/C package I'm given strong consideration to throwing a new cam into my A4 97 vette and need some advice. The car has 128K on the clock and I want to open it up a little without risking engine damage so this will be a conservative build for the moment.
Here's what I'm currently running:
97 LS1 stock heads/bottom end.
1.8 YT rockers
Full CAI intake w/ LS6 manifold
SSAC headers and full exhaust
32lb lucas injectors
This resulted in 328rwhp/327rwtq on the last test (dynojet). Got some valve float on the stock springs above 5000rpm, but I will address that below.
Planned future mods:
- 243 heads w/ 918 springs (will still use the YT 1.8 rockers)
- ASP underdrive pulley
- Cam
I'd like to get most of my gains in the bottom end starting at 2500rpm. My car is a daily driver street car and i'm not looking to set any stip records, just get some more umph. I'd like the car to have a stealthy smooth idle if possible.
What cam specs should I be looking for? What pushrod length to match the cam with the 1.8 rockers?
thanks.
Here's what I'm currently running:
97 LS1 stock heads/bottom end.
1.8 YT rockers
Full CAI intake w/ LS6 manifold
SSAC headers and full exhaust
32lb lucas injectors
This resulted in 328rwhp/327rwtq on the last test (dynojet). Got some valve float on the stock springs above 5000rpm, but I will address that below.
Planned future mods:
- 243 heads w/ 918 springs (will still use the YT 1.8 rockers)
- ASP underdrive pulley
- Cam
I'd like to get most of my gains in the bottom end starting at 2500rpm. My car is a daily driver street car and i'm not looking to set any stip records, just get some more umph. I'd like the car to have a stealthy smooth idle if possible.
What cam specs should I be looking for? What pushrod length to match the cam with the 1.8 rockers?
thanks.
Last edited by radioflyer86; Jul 26, 2009 at 11:28 AM.
New forged 346 shortblock and then use a factory casting 243 head and mill them for 11 to 1 compression and use a 220 or a 224/224 cam at 56x/57x 114 lsa and if you really wanted a little more top end without sacrificing bottom end a 224/228 or even a 228/228 57x/58x 114 lsa would give you 15-20 more hp up top than those first two cams and carry torque nicely with those heads. I could see you getting 40 rwhp from that 228 cam and another 30rwhp with those heads and thats probably being a bit conservative. You could make a solid 410-420 with that combo with nice tq numbers too. An LS6 manifold will work great with any of those cams because the LS6 manifold can use the power those cams make in their each respective powerbands.
I just saw you have 1.8 ratio rockers you might have to bring the lift numbers down on some of those cams specs I threw out there for you to look at since the lift would be higher with 1.8's Those grinds I mentioned would be custom ground pieces any ways so you could get the lift numbers down with no problem just tell the person who grinds it.
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He just wants a bit more ummmf.
If he were to H/C that motor, I would rebuilt first and upgrade. 97s were the worst and LS1 has seen many revisions since.
If he were to H/C that motor, I would rebuilt first and upgrade. 97s were the worst and LS1 has seen many revisions since.
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How much uummphh are you looking for?
You could stick a stock LS6 camshaft in it, with the matching heads and intake make 405ish HP at the crank.
If your looking for more than that, look into what Pred Z and TransAmcoupe recommended.
You could stick a stock LS6 camshaft in it, with the matching heads and intake make 405ish HP at the crank.
If your looking for more than that, look into what Pred Z and TransAmcoupe recommended.
TECH Resident
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 907
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From: NJ
Id do the famous TR224@114 /cam kit, TEA Stage 2 LS6 heads. Youll need a 3200 stall and 3.42s since you have an A4. Autos need more attention to parts detail to make them perform as good as manual heads/cam cars.
OP, id definitely take that^^ to heart. go cam only, or if you want heads, dont spend the big bucks unless you are going to rebuild the motor. what kind of power gains are you looking for? if you arent looking for huge gains, that cam predator z recommended, plus a 3200ish stall and some 3.42s will wake you car up for sure.
I agree 100% even a set of stock 243 casting milled a little for a compression gain would be cheap cost-effective and still produce good numbers. If he wanted a little more power he could go with the TEA Stage 2 LS6 heads, Patriot stage 2 LS6 heads, or for a little more budget go with PRC's stage 1 LS6 heads. That 224@114 is exactly what I would suggest or even a 224/228 on a 114 or 112+2. But remember guys he has 1.8 ratio rocker arms which is going to give him more lift than other guys running the suggested 1.7 arms. To the OP you may want to see if you could sell/trade those YT 1.8 rockers to someone in the classifieds section who may want them and has a set of 1.7's. I think all speed shops suggest using 1.7 RR arms because you could have PTV clearance issues running 1.8's. And a 3200-3600 stall from Yank, Vig, or Circle D would finish out your combo and complement those cams very well. I'd go yank SS3600 if it were me and a 18k B&M tranny cooler, and as eamador said 3.42 gears would be needed if you have the 2.73's from the factory. If you have the 3.23's you could get away without upgrading as long as you have a good 3200-3600 stall with the 3.23's, but the 3.42's will bring the car alive a lot more though.
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Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 14,620
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From: BFE
I agree 100% even a set of stock 243 casting milled a little for a compression gain would be cheap cost-effective and still produce good numbers. If he wanted a little more power he could go with the TEA Stage 2 LS6 heads, Patriot stage 2 LS6 heads, or for a little more budget go with PRC's stage 1 LS6 heads. That 224@114 is exactly what I would suggest or even a 224/228 on a 114 or 112+2. But remember guys he has 1.8 ratio rocker arms which is going to give him more lift than other guys running the suggested 1.7 arms. To the OP you may want to see if you could sell/trade those YT 1.8 rockers to someone in the classifieds section who may want them and has a set of 1.7's. I think all speed shops suggest using 1.7 RR arms because you could have PTV clearance issues running 1.8's. And a 3200-3600 stall from Yank, Vig, or Circle D would finish out your combo and complement those cams very well. I'd go yank SS3600 if it were me and a 18k B&M tranny cooler, and as eamador said 3.42 gears would be needed if you have the 2.73's from the factory. If you have the 3.23's you could get away without upgrading as long as you have a good 3200-3600 stall with the 3.23's, but the 3.42's will bring the car alive a lot more though.
The OP just wants a bit more power, not to build another motor or expensive head/C/ Stall etc....
What he needs (as per his post) is a soft lobe cam with durations under .050 to match his YTs.
That is all
Id do the famous TR224@114 /cam kit, TEA Stage 2 LS6 heads. Youll need a 3200 stall and 3.42s since you have an A4. Autos need more attention to parts detail to make them perform as good as manual heads/cam cars.
Bringing this back up since I finally was able to execute a business project (new C5 corvette fixed headlight design)
Peak gains don't really concern me as much as midrange power. A littlee more cam research showed the 02+ LS6 cam would meet my requirements and have a stealthy idle.
Couple questions:
1) what does and engine rebuild entail? Would it be less expeensive to just get a new LS1/LS6 motor?
2) What is a good budget to allocate for a head/cam swap with all the associated parts?
Peak gains don't really concern me as much as midrange power. A littlee more cam research showed the 02+ LS6 cam would meet my requirements and have a stealthy idle.
Couple questions:
1) what does and engine rebuild entail? Would it be less expeensive to just get a new LS1/LS6 motor?
2) What is a good budget to allocate for a head/cam swap with all the associated parts?
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 873
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From: oakland, ca
if i were u i would get a cam in the 224 range.
A rebuild is usualy more expensive than buying a new forged shortblock especially with the prices TSP is giving out.
I would say you should be prepared to spend at least $2500. ( 243 heads,cam,ported oil pump,tune,valvetrain upgrade)
A rebuild is usualy more expensive than buying a new forged shortblock especially with the prices TSP is giving out.
I would say you should be prepared to spend at least $2500. ( 243 heads,cam,ported oil pump,tune,valvetrain upgrade)
depends on your budget and all. OP listed 243's and 918s in his first post, so he's prolly not wanting to buy TFS or Patriots, and whatever else people have listed, to say the least 1300-2000 in heads...243's would be a hell of an upgrade for him as is, and can be found pretty cheap....
on the cam, id say people are right on, go with something around 224 duration, just watch the lift. id say predator z has got a good cam for you there.
idk about the 2500 bucks either, that sounds pretty steep. i think it could be done a little cheaper, but you might be right on..... i know as far as all my cam stuff i bought recently it was 1200 or so, and i got 1000 in some prc 243's... i guess dont plan to go cheap cheap, cause youll go over your goal easy. with higher miles its for sure not to pass up on some things.
on the cam, id say people are right on, go with something around 224 duration, just watch the lift. id say predator z has got a good cam for you there.
idk about the 2500 bucks either, that sounds pretty steep. i think it could be done a little cheaper, but you might be right on..... i know as far as all my cam stuff i bought recently it was 1200 or so, and i got 1000 in some prc 243's... i guess dont plan to go cheap cheap, cause youll go over your goal easy. with higher miles its for sure not to pass up on some things.
