Originally Posted by Nine Ball

Good luck finding any manufacturer or vendor that will cover damages to other components, even if their product has been proven to cause the damage. This is how the performance automotive industry works, like it or not. Most of the warrantys out there are very generic, almost copy/paste of eachother, and 99% of them do not cover related damages.

If your valvespring broke and the valve dropped and put a hole in your piston, would you think the valvespring company would pay for your engine? Nope.

If your timing chain busted, and ruined all your valves and pistons, would the timing chain company pay for your engine? Nope.

They are only responsible for replacing or crediting the part(s) that failed in most cases. Several manufacturers won't even offer a warranty on race-designed parts or parts to be used in performance applications.

Labor charges are typically never recoverable. The only time I've seen labor covered is if a particular shop did the installation of a component, and the installation was found to be faulty afterwards. Lets say MTI installed the engine, and something was very wrong with the installation, they might opt to pay a shop up in MO to fix it, if it is cheaper than sending the car back. Thats about the only time I've ever seen labor recovered.

This is an expensive hobby, and you have to take many risks on your own. I'd never recommend anyone going into their own engines and doing major upgrades unless they can accept that risk if something happens.

Originally Posted by DOC OTIS

Trust me I know this is an expensive hobby. The examples you gave are you referring to brand new parts? Everything I have is brand new. The parts all worked properly on the first motor except for the block leaking coolant. This combo has been built before so its not this is something new. The velve train is about as basic as you can get and the cam Im running is off the shelf. The reason for this thread was mainly to see if anyone else has even heard of a problem like this and to see what others would expect in my situation. MTI has been fair to me so far except for some communication problems. This is NOT a flame at them.

Originally Posted by Pro Stock John

That's weird you have bent exhaust valves, are they lower?

I have known of your problems for a while, I hope you are on the road soon.

Really one of Tony's posts nailed it, at the most it's just a matter of trying to get some goodwill from some of the companies involved in your longblock. Did you pressure test the heads or have them checked for leaks?

Originally Posted by CANNIBAL

DOC, the Darton MID blocks are decked after the sleeves are installed. This would move your valves closer to your pistons if the amount removed during the decking process was not compensated for on the install of the heads/valvetrain.

This is just a possibility, though. The amount removed is MINIMAL, about 0.005" I believe.

When you installed the heads, did you turn the crank over by hand to see if there was an contact b/w the valves/pistons?

Originally Posted by DOC OTIS

Trust me I've already thought of that. This was the first thing I asked MTI was about the deck height. Even if it was decked .005 more than my original block I still would have plenty of clearence.

Originally Posted by DenzSS

Hey Doc,

I still can't imagine an exhaust valve warping from contact with the coolant. A 1300 degree exhaust valve getting quenched in a 200+ degree coolant/water mix isn't going to warp the valves. It just isn't possible within what metallurgy I know.

In one way or another you have had piston to valve contact. You may not have found it yet, but it must have happened. There is no way to take out your exhaust valves and exhaust rockers with a coolant bath. Out of all of the things I can think of occurring when a sleeve drops, this just isn't one of them.

I've dealt with a couple of dropped sleeve MTI engines, and neither had this issue. One engine had two cylinders repeatedly filled with coolant as we tested per MTI's requests. I know two cylinders were filled with coolant at least 3 times before the engine was shipped back to MTI. Sitting on top of this mess was a really nice set of Stage III LS6 heads and they were never damaged in the process. They are currently sitting on the new engine and pumping out a detuned 750hp.

Denzil

Originally Posted by CANNIBAL

You didn't mention it in your intial post that's why I mentioned it. I'm not trying to point a finger, just bringing about suggestions.

Originally Posted by CANNIBAL

Doc, I wonder if it's the YTs. Are you sure they're installed correctly? Were the valves hung open b/c the YT exhaust rocker arms were seized up (you said they were very hard to move)? I'm not familiar with the YT's design, hence my questions.

That's odd that all 8 would be open. If the valves were clearing when you bumped it over then I don't think you had PV contact and I believe it to be something with the rockers. Did you pull an exhaust valve out to check it for trueness?

Originally Posted by DOC OTIS

hmm..... well I have no clue whats going on then. When I first called MTI they told me it was possible the coolant bent the valves. It sounds odd to me also but I am pretty confident the valves didnt make contact with the pistons (if they did there are no marks on the pistons or valves) therefore leaving the coolant as the only other possibility.

Originally Posted by Nine Ball

I really can't see coolant bending all 8 exhaust valves unless you dropped all 8 sleeves or blew a head gasket in every cylinder. That is a uniform failure if all of them are screwed up, and dropped sleeves/bad gaskets are an isolated cylinder issue.

Maybe the valvesprings were weak and the engine was over-revved? Maybe the pushrods were too long on the exhaust side? Its got to be a mechanical issue.

Originally Posted by Nine Ball

Oh yeah, and to answer your question about coolant making the valves/rockers warp, I've never heard of anything like that ever happening before. If that were the case, anytime someone had a head gasket leak, they would have to replace the valves. We all know head gaskets have been blowing for decades. I've had two sleeved blocks fail, and seen several others fail/drop, and nobody has had this problem before.

If something physically bent the valves/rocker arms, I'd have to say there was mechanical contact. I'd also find that highly unlikely since you only have the exhaust valves/rockers damaged, typically it is the larger diameter intake valves which contact the pistons, not the exhaust valves. Besides, if you did drop a sleeve, and you claim the coolant warped the valves, then you would have had to drop all 8 sleeves if all 8 exhaust valves got bent. Since all of them were bent, I'd highly suspect clearance issues. If you had a sleeve or two drop, only the cylinders adjacent to the dropped sleeve should have suffered any damage based on your idea.

Could the heads have lower seats in the exhaust valve bowls? maybe they are positioned lower than normal in the heads?

Originally Posted by Nick Agostino

I agree, I have never seen anything in over 20 years of engine building like this. Check closer for some type of mechanical interf. between the valves and pistons. I have seen heads with tight valve guides do the same thing, they destroy the rockers, hang the valves open and the piston doesn't need much to bend them out of the way. If the valve relief is on the exact angle of the valve and it hits square, it may not leave a very evident mark in the piston; also look at the back of the valve relief where the radiuis in the cutter was as it can be a great hiding place for valve contact.

Sounds like MTI is doing a good job working things out, hang tight and good luck.