L33 / 4l65e
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Oct 2018
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L33 / 4l65e I'm putting a 2005 L33 into my 98 S10 step-side and want to use a 4L65E. I've been reading up on the 4L65E and know it is basically an updated 4l60e...20% stronger. Will any 4L65E be a bolt up to my 2005 L33 or should I look for a specific year/model?
TECH Junkie
Joined: Nov 2013
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From: White Bear, Mn
4l60e vs 4l65e strength differences are small. 4l65e has a tit stronger input and output shaft.
Hardened sunshell
One extra friction clutch (7) in the 3-4 clutch pack
5 pinion planets (not stronger) vs 4 pinion in the 4l60e
Once either is rebuilt there are no advantages from one to the other.
Hardened sunshell
One extra friction clutch (7) in the 3-4 clutch pack
5 pinion planets (not stronger) vs 4 pinion in the 4l60e
Once either is rebuilt there are no advantages from one to the other.
TECH Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2016
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From: Central Cal.
4l60e vs 4l65e strength differences are small. 4l65e has a tit stronger input and output shaft.
Hardened sunshell
One extra friction clutch (7) in the 3-4 clutch pack
5 pinion planets (not stronger) vs 4 pinion in the 4l60e
Once either is rebuilt there are no advantages from one to the other.
Hardened sunshell
One extra friction clutch (7) in the 3-4 clutch pack
5 pinion planets (not stronger) vs 4 pinion in the 4l60e
Once either is rebuilt there are no advantages from one to the other.
I've heard that any late 4L60E can be rebuilt into the equivalent of the 4L65E. True?
TECH Junkie
Joined: Nov 2013
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From: White Bear, Mn
If you have a 4l60e you would not upgrade to a 5 pinion planets. Keep the 4.
The hardened sunshell is stronger in the 4l65e but if rebuilding a 4l60e you would replace it anyways to a gm hardened sunshell or a sonnax sunshell.
The 4l60e has a 6 clutch stack in the 3-4 and the 4l65e has a 7 clutch setup both of which would be changed to a different clutch stack and clearances for a performance application.
In the end if you are rebuilding a 4l60e it can easily be built to the same specs as a 4l65e but one would not do that because it's not a big difference over the 4l60e. You would build it over and above stock specs of either for a performance application.
- tighter clearances in the 3-4 clutch pack (I run .030" and 8 clutches)
- stronger return springs for the 3-4 clutch pack so it releases faster during a 3-2 downshift.
- pump mods
- tighter 2-4 band clearances with a new reverse input drum and a wider band.
- valve body mods
- drilling the separator plate to different specs. ect.
The list goes on, hope that helps. You would do those mods to a 4l65e also.
TECH Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2016
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From: Central Cal.
It helps a lot, and thank you! As I suspected, using aftermarket parts (didn't realize Sonnax was such a major player!) would actually outdo the 4L65E pieces.
OK, another question. Compared to these, what is the 4L70E? I've heard of it, but not very much.
OK, another question. Compared to these, what is the 4L70E? I've heard of it, but not very much.
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TECH Junkie
Joined: Nov 2013
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From: White Bear, Mn
Internally it is very similar to the 60e and 65e but the wiring is very different. It is not plug and play like a 60e or a 65e.
- the vss is on the input shaft
- different output shaft
- different valve body (it does not use the 3-2 downshift solenoid or valve) I myself have these blocked off in my 4l60e.
- different harnesses plug
Those are the big differences as to why you can not use a 70e in a vehicle originally equipped with a 60e or 65e.
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Sonnax is massive in the automatic department.
Internally it is very similar to the 60e and 65e but the wiring is very different. It is not plug and play like a 60e or a 65e.
- the vss is on the input shaft
- different output shaft
- different valve body (it does not use the 3-2 downshift solenoid or valve) I myself have these blocked off in my 4l60e.
- different harnesses plug
Those are the big differences as to why you can not use a 70e in a vehicle originally equipped with a 60e or 65e.
Internally it is very similar to the 60e and 65e but the wiring is very different. It is not plug and play like a 60e or a 65e.
- the vss is on the input shaft
- different output shaft
- different valve body (it does not use the 3-2 downshift solenoid or valve) I myself have these blocked off in my 4l60e.
- different harnesses plug
Those are the big differences as to why you can not use a 70e in a vehicle originally equipped with a 60e or 65e.
They use the same case. The main plug should be the same but you may have to rewire depending on application. Also it changed to black or blue depending on application.
Rather than copy and past, I will put this informational link here that explains some of it. https://www.700r4transmissionhq.com/...issions/4l70e/
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 86
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On The Tree
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 108
Likes: 1
I kinda have a build thread, I didnt really keep up on much, its all just in my phone lol but ... https://ls1tech.com/forums/conversio...onoma-s10.html
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 86
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Looks Great, I'll be checking your progress. I probably won't do much to the engine other than maybe a different intake manifold and the Z06 cam and of course exhaust work. This will be a slow build for me, I'm new to LS engines and 4L60-65 trans. but learning quick. I'm doing this build by myself, going slow and trying not to make costly mistakes. I may be tapping your brain for info seeing as our builds or similar....thanks for your input!
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 86
Likes: 5
Found a 4L65E / converter.at the salvage yard, 82,000 out of a wrecked vehicle $550+ tax...can't pick it up until Weds. This is supposed to be a plug and play. I have the L33 engine Z06 cam, 8.6 / 3:42 rear end disc brakes. Building a daily driver, not a race truck, I want to be able to get in and drive it anywhere though it will probably never leave Florida.