Generation III Internal Engine 1997-2006 LS1 | LS6
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

Coefficient of discharge 706/799 stock bs ported

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 04-22-2020, 01:23 PM
  #1  
Teching In
Thread Starter
 
CPFIREBIRD74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 23
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default Coefficient of discharge 706/799 stock bs ported

Bear with my I don’t know **** but trying to learn. I’ve seen coefficient of discharge used as an explanation why the 706 heads work as well as they do. By both Brian Tooley and Richard Holdener

In my trying to understand why the 706’s make more power than 243/799’s 99% of the time I’ve started to consider this COD.

I have a set of 799’s and 706’s.
I’m considering having the 706’s Cnc ported but keeping the stock intake valve.

I don’t see the point of the stage 2 setup on the truck heads because if I did go that route I’d have the 799’s ported and save money.

Any of y’all care to talk about coefficient of discharge? What can you tell me?

Old 04-22-2020, 02:28 PM
  #2  
TECH Enthusiast
 
Bob570's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Michigan
Posts: 544
Received 230 Likes on 171 Posts
Default

Pretty sure the 706 heads only do better than the 243/799s on a 5.3 is because of the smaller combustion chamber, thus increasing compression.

I'm fairly certain that ported and milled 243s will kill ported 706s in almost every scenario.
The following users liked this post:
64post (04-24-2020)
Old 04-22-2020, 03:09 PM
  #3  
TECH Fanatic
iTrader: (12)
 
Cwarta's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Elm Creek, NE
Posts: 1,796
Received 58 Likes on 48 Posts

Default

Originally Posted by Bob570
Pretty sure the 706 heads only do better than the 243/799s on a 5.3 is because of the smaller combustion chamber, thus increasing compression.

I'm fairly certain that ported and milled 243s will kill ported 706s in almost every scenario.
Every scenario except doing the same work to both sets of heads lol.
Old 04-22-2020, 03:44 PM
  #4  
TECH Fanatic
iTrader: (1)
 
gollum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,467
Likes: 0
Received 9 Likes on 8 Posts

Default

When bolting on the smaller chamber 706 heads to a larger 4" bore 6 liter block you will have lots of chamber over hang in bore, so you remove this over hang to unshroud valves. This raises low lift flow numbers, plus smaller chamber raises compression of larger cubic inch motor. Hand porting the 706 chamber and ports and then bolting them to larger bore is a verygood affordable idea. Maybe this is what they mean by coefficient of drag?

Read here: https://www.hotrod.com/articles/ls-e...-chamber-work/


...

Last edited by gollum; 04-22-2020 at 03:51 PM.
Old 04-22-2020, 04:07 PM
  #5  
8 Second Club
iTrader: (3)
 
RonSSNova's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 4,613
Received 711 Likes on 445 Posts
LS1Tech 10 Year
Default

So they used the 706 to gain compression, then enlarged the chamber in the unshrouding process and didn’t mention the new chamber size. Interesting.

I’ve got a pair I’ve been messing with for possible use on an LS1. Maybe I’ll do that mod and measure the CC before and after.
Old 04-22-2020, 05:49 PM
  #6  
Teching In
Thread Starter
 
CPFIREBIRD74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 23
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by gollum
When bolting on the smaller chamber 706 heads to a larger 4" bore 6 liter block you will have lots of chamber over hang in bore, so you remove this over hang to unshroud valves. This raises low lift flow numbers, plus smaller chamber raises compression of larger cubic inch motor. Hand porting the 706 chamber and ports and then bolting them to larger bore is a verygood affordable idea. Maybe this is what they mean by coefficient of drag?

Read here: https://www.hotrod.com/articles/ls-e...-chamber-work/


...
i haven’t seen this yet. I’ll check it out tonight
Old 04-22-2020, 05:50 PM
  #7  
Teching In
Thread Starter
 
CPFIREBIRD74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 23
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default

If those heads gained power then maybe there IS more to it than just chamber size and compression
Old 04-22-2020, 08:07 PM
  #8  
TECH Senior Member
iTrader: (4)
 
99 Black Bird T/A's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 8,604
Received 1,456 Likes on 1,010 Posts
LS1Tech 20 Year Member
Default

This maybe of interest there a lot of good info on the site below. Also several charts with flow data etc. I think the 706's sort of fell out of favor as the 243 castings became plentiful. The 706 stuff can rick in many applications. Definitely a fan of the TEA 706/5.3's Stage 2's I ran.

Advanced Induction - info on 706 & 799 and other LS heads

AI mentions 500+ whp with fully ported 243/799's on 3.9 bore. AI says the 706's require more work (cost) and on 3.9 bore capabilities for 480 whp.

Per AI's site on 706 - Note: Over the years we have found these castings tend to require more time in regard to quality checks/corrections on our end. They also must be run with a larger aftermarket intake valve. Due to this, the cost is higher when using them as a base for work compared to the more common GM 243 etc.

Old 04-23-2020, 11:30 PM
  #9  
Launching!
 
Lsbmer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Illinois
Posts: 201
Likes: 0
Received 43 Likes on 35 Posts
Default

The 706 stuff can rick in many applications. Definitely a fan of the TEA 706/5.3's Stage 2's I ran..

I just flowed a set of those. They where nice. They where the 2" ones tho.





706s besides a little lore comp .also have a more compact chamber, bigger squish pad.
this increaes the squish velocity. Forget about shrouding. Look at the red circle.
that is a stock 706 . That's terrible.
because lack of a valve job,because its seat % is so big . Sometimes a pic is worth a 1000 words. But also think about reversion.
You can throw chamber shape into that vj term if u want to . I think thats a 243 next to it in pick. Idk.cant remember.

Make sure your 799s have a top cut. Some dont.


Old 04-24-2020, 10:16 AM
  #10  
TECH Apprentice
 
SoCalDave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: California
Posts: 337
Received 114 Likes on 89 Posts
Default

I have a set of 799 heads on my '01 Camaro and I'm porting a set of 243 heads for a C5 while I also have a set of 862 heads in my garage. The 862 heads I use to try new things as far as porting. That should give you an idea of how I see 706/862 castings.
Old 04-24-2020, 10:19 AM
  #11  
Teching In
Thread Starter
 
CPFIREBIRD74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 23
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default

I’ve tried to find a place to weld up the chambers on the 799’s to reduce them down to around 55-56cc but no luck

I definitely wouldn’t pay to have a 2” valve put in the 706’s. The removes the coefficient of discharge advantage

Old 04-24-2020, 10:39 AM
  #12  
TECH Senior Member
 
G Atsma's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Central Cal.
Posts: 21,481
Received 3,261 Likes on 2,538 Posts
Default

West Coast Cylinder Heads doesn't go bigger than 1.95 intake on 706's
The following users liked this post:
CPFIREBIRD74 (04-24-2020)
Old 04-24-2020, 11:42 AM
  #13  
Launching!
 
Lsbmer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Illinois
Posts: 201
Likes: 0
Received 43 Likes on 35 Posts
Default

In that article the 706s went 237cfm I think

Discharge coefficient of a
1.89 valve @ 237 cfm is better than a 2"
valve at 250 cfm .

But 706s dont flow 237. Never seen it. Even with huge radius inlet they dont
in that article they did. Maybe he had a leak. Idk . The 250cfm on there 799 seems right.
down at 220cfm where most 706s flow the discharge coefficient is worse than the 799s. The tea's that where here went exactly to the cfm they advertise. Lots of variables.
regardless, neither of those heads in that test, the coefficients are not that good.
Old 04-24-2020, 12:14 PM
  #14  
10 Second Club
 
big hammer's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: over dere
Posts: 3,427
Received 186 Likes on 131 Posts
LS1Tech 10 Year
Default

CoD is meaningless imo
The following users liked this post:
Bob570 (04-26-2020)
Old 04-24-2020, 01:00 PM
  #15  
TECH Fanatic
iTrader: (12)
 
Cwarta's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Elm Creek, NE
Posts: 1,796
Received 58 Likes on 48 Posts

Default

Originally Posted by big hammer
CoD is meaningless imo

Agreed. Numbers in this thread and real life are showing two different things.
Old 04-24-2020, 01:33 PM
  #16  
TECH Fanatic
iTrader: (5)
 
64post's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Sonoma Co. Ca.
Posts: 1,694
Received 226 Likes on 179 Posts
LS1Tech 10 Year
Default

Use 862’s, 706 are kinda of a weaker casting. If you can afford it? Go aftermarket.
Old 04-24-2020, 04:17 PM
  #17  
Launching!
 
Lsbmer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Illinois
Posts: 201
Likes: 0
Received 43 Likes on 35 Posts
Default

[QUOTE=big hammer;20238716]CoD is meaningless

I agree , he asked .
Old 04-24-2020, 07:21 PM
  #18  
ModSquad
iTrader: (6)
 
Che70velle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Dawsonville Ga.
Posts: 6,645
Received 3,739 Likes on 2,270 Posts
LS1Tech 10 Year
Default

Originally Posted by big hammer
CoD is meaningless imo
Thank you!
Old 04-25-2020, 09:34 AM
  #19  
10 Second Club
 
big hammer's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: over dere
Posts: 3,427
Received 186 Likes on 131 Posts
LS1Tech 10 Year
Default

Originally Posted by Cwarta
Agreed. Numbers in this thread and real life are showing two different things.
it’s like hp\L
The following users liked this post:
Bob570 (04-26-2020)
Old 04-26-2020, 12:11 PM
  #20  
TECH Fanatic
iTrader: (7)
 
omc8's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: columbus,ohio
Posts: 1,539
Received 26 Likes on 22 Posts

Default

Originally Posted by gollum
When bolting on the smaller chamber 706 heads to a larger 4" bore 6 liter block you will have lots of chamber over hang in bore, so you remove this over hang to unshroud valves. This raises low lift flow numbers, plus smaller chamber raises compression of larger cubic inch motor. Hand porting the 706 chamber and ports and then bolting them to larger bore is a verygood affordable idea. Maybe this is what they mean by coefficient of drag?

Read here: https://www.hotrod.com/articles/ls-e...-chamber-work/


...
Where in the article does it talk about c.o.d. , don't see it .


Quick Reply: Coefficient of discharge 706/799 stock bs ported



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:07 AM.