Is there a summary of all the testing. The video seems to have some portions, then there's pics on different forums. Any where is the data consolidated?

 

I was thinking about this more and more since I have a 1.89" Valve on top of 376 ci, What do the cams look like they are specing for these heads with the smaller valve? Or are they just doing it because most of the shelf stuff has too much intake duration?

 

On kind of an off topic similar note. I have a new 370 short block in a crate in my garage. Gonna go into my 02 SS M6 thats gonna be a true daily. Before I start tearing into it. I need to decide on cam and heads. I have a pair 799s, 706s, and 241s. Kind of 50/50 on those or finding an LS3 top end.

 

On a 364 to 376 cubic inch motor max valve size i would go would be 2.08 on the intake. I juat made 480 rwhp on a 4.000 inch bore with a 2.055 ferrea valve in a hand ported 799 casting. Before that the LS3 heads only made 435 hp at the rear tire on the same exact dyno. Cam with the LS3 heads was a 229/244 BTR cam.

 

Shout out to GPI doing so well with their cam grind. They provided the cam for my 5th gen (10.90@125.5 1.47 h/c/converter/gear/slick/skinnies on pump gas)... 475rwhp locked.

 

This table is pretty good, it's got the durations, valve events, overlap, and peak/average power/torque for each cam. Click the image:

It would be interesting to see dyno plots too of course, but I haven't stumbled on those yet.

Yeah, that one stood out to me as well. As someone who wants a streetable car, it was the most interesting cam in the list.

Second place in 3 of the 4 categories, but down 10hp in peak power, so 13th place in that category... but almost certainly the most streetable of the top 5.

 

In the pic you posted, I'm seeing the 12* overlap as 9th place for peak HP (down ~15hp), and 6th for peak torque and average hp. Then tied for 5th on average torque. ?

Edit: I see the "Joe Carol" with 25* overlap looks to have the rankings you mentioned. Regardless still a good showing for the OP Mustang variant considering how close all these cams are together.

For the OP Mustang, a very streetable camshaft and almost stealthy in a 454 compared to most of the others. The BTR #1 with 15* doesn't look too shabby either again looking at how close all these were.

 

Optimum Performance Racing
I think is OP Mustang from the little bit of research I could find.

 

Yeah, major brain fail there, my bad. Thanks.

 

what are the full cam specs?

 

It would be nice to see the torque value at 4k, just to get an idea of where it starts to come in.

 

This was an AWESOME contest and we're looking forward to the next one. The day after I heard Eric's challenge, it shipped out of our Texas warehouse. It was the first one he received, so definitely not a ringer. We (I) thought about it what cam to submit. We wanted to submit a stocking cam...not a custom. Looking at it now, we had three choices.

1.) We have single-plane cams, but that line hasn't really been developed in my time here. The best of those is SUM-8703. It's a 240/252 106 + 0 .569 Lift. 13 I/O, 47 E/C, 52 E/C and 20 E/C. 33 Degrees of overlap! so not a super great seller and requires pistons with valve reliefs. The events are pretty good and similar to the top contenders. It's Achilles heal is the 59-degree lobe intensity and relatively low lift. From what I can tell, it was originally designed to run 24-hour races at high rpm with very low spring pressures. Think Lemans. To put this in perspective, most Pro LS cams are in the 50 Degree range. Much greater lobe intensity helps power and the valvetrain remains happy with the springs we use. With better events but lower intensity and lift, it didn't feel like a good choice.

2.) SUM-8721R1 would have been a better choice outright and better for the peak HP number. Specs are 247/255 115 + 5. 15 I/O, 52 I/C, 66 E/O, 9 E/C and about 24 degrees of overlap. Looks like a contender right!?! It IS when it's in stock - but it's not (wasn't) popular. The first problem is it requires valve reliefs. The other issue is it has 24 degrees of overlap. That's great with open headers BUT most Pro LS customers are running a full exhaust system. This makes it a little soggy in the midrange and doesn't tune as easy. This led us to sending in SUM-8730R1.

3.) SUM-8730R1 is a 242/251 116 +6. It looks a little wonky like a turbo cam and for the same reason. It's designed for full-length exhaust systems. It sounds big but only has 15 degrees of overlap so it's not as sensitive to reversion. The customer for this cam doesn't want fuel smell and wants it to tune well with less dip in the midrange. Valve events are 11 I/O, 51 I/C, 67 E/O, and 4! E/C. Why didn't it work here? The throttle plate and header have a 1:1 pressure ratio. 14.7 lbs. at each. SUM-8730R1 didn't take advantage of overlap to wash the residual charge out of the chamber with fresh air fuel. SUM-8709R1 (239/246 113+ 3 9 I/O, 49 I/C, 59 E/O, 7 E/C 15 overlap) would have been a better choice for average power than SUM-8721R1. Versus SUM-8709R1, we were leaning toward winning the peak part of this particular contest with 8730's later I/O and earlier E/C.

WRONG CAM! CouldaWouldaShoulda. We're now developing a line of Single-Plane cams for bracket and circle-track racing. They will require valve reliefs. They will be sold with the stipulation they are designed for open headers. One of the larger cams looks like SUM-8721R1 except much later exhaust closing. We'll keep lift to .625 to work with stock rockers. We'll also keep the intensity in check. Winning a contest is good. Breaking customer's valve springs bad. Does it hurt to lose a contest? Yeah, it stinks. We get BETTER through experiences like these though and looking forward to the next contests. We'll also have a better handle on the scoring, and this will help guide our decision making too.

Brian N

 

Someone sent in an 8710r1 and it made real good power.

 

TTT

This is awesome data guys People are picking it apart and trying to make every sense of it right or wrong the debate still goes on for some. Regardless of the argument I'm just trying to learn something ! I've watched a few videos on YouTube from some math nuts like myself who have interpreted the data it's really interesting stuff to think about

I appreciate everyone who's commented in the thread especially anyone who has participated in the contest or has data to contribute, It's got my mind on cam events again.

Brian N. Do you have any hints on what would be different about the new cams? Tighter LSA ,more advance, wider split, lift #'s?

Has anybody bought a new cam since the test or bought the winning cam? I can't see how it wouldn't make power. Somebody on here should try it in a 6.0 and see what happens!?

 

Did you post that info on facebook a while back? That's weird that ported 799's made so much more hp. Goes to show the size of the port is only part of the equation.

 

They'd have to be running open headers as Brian eluded to, otherwise it's not going to make the same power in the upper rpm range. The cams that have earlier E/C would fair better with a full exhaust,

Actually that would be a really good test; to run it again but long 3" with mufflers to simulate a complete exhaust. I would not be surprised if the top 2/10 would drop down towards the bottom of the top 10. Which is still fantastic (save for maybe 1 or 2 the entire lineup are all closely clustered together), just not as optimal.

 

Sum-8730R1's valve events were 11 I/O, 51 I/C, 67 E/O and 4 E/C. This makes it a 242/251 116 + 6. If we had "at least" made the overlap triangle centered with 11 I/O and 11 E/C, this would have made it a 242/258 114 +4. That 51 I/C is something we use to crutch a long runner factory intake to make higher rpm power, With the shorter runner single plane, the top guys were roughly 48 I/C. Making that additional change would result in a 239/258 113 + 5. That cam would have had 22 degrees of overlap and would definitely run pretty hard HOWEVER if we throw idle quality out the window and opened the intake at 20 I/O (results in the valve physically being open farther all the way down the piston's downstroke on the Intake stroke), this would have resulted in a 248/258 111 + 7 (31 overlap). If we once again squared up our overlap triangle to 20 E/C, this would have made it a 248/267 109 + 5.

As you can see, everything we've done there has turned this LSA into what people normally perceive as a "single plane" LSA. Our 67 E/O was a few degrees earlier than most (63 E/O). This final change would have made the cam a 248/263 108 + 4.

So the test could have run a full exhaust and been limited in overlap to what a lot of people use in the real world, but we all knew the combination going in. We could have done a custom, but who does that benefit? As it sits now, our customers are going to benefit with great new single plane cams coming soon! THAT was our purpose for entering the contest all along.

 

Airspeed. My Mamo 235's are "small" by some peoples standards on a 400+ci engine but they have a ton of airspeed and that really fills the cylinders. Nothing wrong with LS3 ports but they are "slow" compared to good cathedral ports from everything I have read.

 

Why dont you hush telling all my speed secrets.

Big valves and big runners means a faster engine

 

Don't you hate when that happens?? LOL!!