Stripey

Here is the car:

99 Z28, a4 3.73, LS6 intake + LS6 cam, comp 918's, longtubes, ory, Borla cat back.

Planning converter (Yank 3200) + cam swap.

Any reason NOT to consider the Torquer 2? Should I go MS3 + 3600 converter? Or 228R TSP???

Car is not a DD, but sees lot's of street miles + occasional trips to the track.
Would like to be in the 12 flat range on DR's.

Car ran 12.7 @110 on current setup, + dynoed 332 w/ wimpy LS6 cam

orangeapeel

iTrader: (18)

You might want to plan on a 3600-3800 with that MS3 fo sho!
The Tqr v.2 is a great cam and will probably net you some high 11's. Wouldnt think twice about it. Planning on squeezing a 75-100 shot through the motor by any chance? That would probably land you close to a 10.

Rebelord

iTrader: (2)

I have the F14, which is very similar to the Tqr v.2. I'm going to the track in week and half. Its definatly do-able on the street. I DD my car. You will definatly need a bigger stall and some gears to go along with. I'm sure you'll get good times with either cam. Both are tried and true.

Ski

Stripey

Thanks for the replies. Do you think the 3200 will be adequate w/ the Torquer 2 ? I would really like to avoid going to a 3600+ stall as I like the street manners/throttle response of a milder converter.

Anyone else??

TXZ28LS1

iTrader: (5)

i know predator -z was running a 3200 stall and 3.73 with that cam. i think for a daily driver street car 3200 is perfect. i hear about people who cant even hookup with a 2800 so why would you think i can even hook with a 3800 or 4000 stall.. go with a 3200 man..

CraZee ZO6

Do people consider the torquer 2 more livable on a daily basis then a MS3.
Or are both fairly same for a daily driver car?

Stripey

The torquer 2 is definitely milder in terms of specs:

T2 232/234
MS3 237/242

So it should be "friendlier" + a bit easier to tune. My thoughts are that it should make equal power to the MS3 up to about 6300-6400, but I'd like to hear other opinions on that.

CraZee ZO6

yeah me 2.

I went with the ms3 because it works better with spray.
Not installed yet, just having double thoughts of going that big on a street car (not DD but street strip car). I dont want the car to be a dog at 2k rpms. HEARING alot of that talk....

Patrick G

iTrader: (14)

A 3200 is too small with either of those cams.

FWIW, you'd go quicker with a 3600 stall and a 224/228 110LSA cam than a T2 or a MS3 with a 3200 converter. For best ET with either of those TSP cams, you really want more like a 4000 stall. Can you get by with less stall? Sure! But if ET counts, your 60' time is critical and a T2 or MS3 coupled with a 3200 stall converter is going to be lazier than with the proper converter.

Relativelyfast

So lets say I have a 3400 stall converter and I replaced my stock cam with an MS3, would I loose low end as opposed to stock at 3000 RPM or would it stay similar?

Patrick G

iTrader: (14)

The stock cam probably has 30 more lb ft of torque at 3000 rpm than the MS3. That big cam doesn't pass up the stock cam until close to 4000 rpm, then it leaves it in the dust! That's why a 4000 stall works so well with the MS3 (and other cams of that size).

Like I said: smaller cam + 3600 stall > big cam + 3200 stall

Stripey

Patrick thanks for your responses. Can you apply this comment to the Torquer2 instead of the MS3? I would think the torque at 3K would be alot closer to stock w/ the Torquer 2, yes?? I have pretty much ruled out the MS3 for my application, debating between Torquer2 + something smaller.

Also, I may well spray this thing lightly in the future, just a 125 shot appx. How should that affect my torque converter selection, if at all.

Thanks in advance, more responses from all please!!!

TXZ28LS1

iTrader: (5)

yeah PATRICK is right on about the stall. but i didnt see the part where you said your car isnt a DD and more track. in that case yeah go with a bigger stall. a 3600 would be good. im still doing more research my self on a 3200 or 3600 but my car is a DD though and never will see the track.

Relativelyfast

I wouldn't be afraid of going with a 4000 or more even. As long as it is a lockup converter, it isn't much of an issue. I have around a 3400 and it isn't that big IMO.

Relativelyfast

Also, I'm not seeing the torque advantage on these graphs from TSP. Someone care to explain?

Stripey

Excellent point, I don't get it either. Unless I'm reading it wrong, the Torquer 2 offers no advantage in low end torque over the MS3. Makes no sense. Any of the resident TSP employees care to comment?

Patrick G

iTrader: (14)

If you're looking for a torque advantage, you need to raise dynamic compression and close the intake valve earlier. That's why I mentioned my Torque Cam as an example. Please note, you'll want a little less duration, more lift, and a narrower LSA with little to no advance. See, you advance a cam that's too big, you retard a cam that's too small and you put one in straight up that's just right. A 232/234 cam is a little big to run straight up if you're trying to maximize the area under the curve. This cam would be better if advanced +4 with a tight converter. If you had a 4000+ stall, then you could get away with +2 or even +0.

By making the duration smaller, like 224, you can run little to no advance. This will put you overlap closer to TDC which will allow you to carry power further past peak hp. Advancing the cam will make the motor more exhaust-biased and it will run out of breath faster. It's a balancing act. That's why I recommended a torquey cam like mine:
224/228 110LSA +0 for most average power
224/228 110LSA +2 for even more torque down low with a small sacrifice in peak HP. This might be best if you want to stick with the 3200 stall. It would also work great with the nitrous since your converter would already be fairly tight. A loose-*** converter is not good for a big shot of spray.

92zcamaroperson

iTrader: (18)

just out of curiousity what would happen if you put your torque cam or any of the other cams mentioned with a stock converter? With a large amount of low torque would it compensate for the small stall speed? For a person who isnt looking to do huge launches at the track except for maybe once a year or so and the car is pretty much just for the street would it make a huge difference?

Just hypothetically....dont yell at me....

Patrick G

iTrader: (14)

Anytime you can significantly raise dynamic compression, you will have an easier time launching with a tight converter. For the stock converter though, you'd want to go with something that likes a lower idle speed and even more low-end torque. Something like a 210/218 110LSA +0.

Stripey

Patrick you really like small LSA's - like 110 - most of the popular cams are available, at least "off the shelf" , w/ 112-114 LSA's - why don't the manufacturers "agree" w/ your thinking w/ regard to cams?
Just looking to learn + make the best selection this time!!!!