OK guys sorry to do this to you, but....
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Teching In
Joined: Dec 2001
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From: Aurora, near Cleveland, Ohio
OK guys sorry to do this to you, but.... ...could someone please explain to me the different choices when doing a new motor. I see all the people talking about strokers vs. all bore, what is that. What about when you increase the cubic inches in the engine? If someone makes a 422, is it the LS1 made bigger? I thought I understood until someone said something about an iron block with their 422, but I thought we had an alluminum block. Could someone explain how this all works? I am a little mixed up about it
Thanks
John
Thanks
John
Re: OK guys sorry to do this to you, but.... i beleive everyone uses an iron block because it is stronger and can handle more power. The actual engine itself is not bigger, i beleive the valve covers might be larger though, not sure why, i think its because or the bigger roller rockers they put on.
TECH Fanatic
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From: Freeland, MD
Re: OK guys sorry to do this to you, but.... The majority of 383s, 422s, and the more rare 427+ CI engines are made by a combination of increasing the bore size and/or increasing the stroke length.
383s can be made either by all bore or all stroke. The all stroke 383 is created by simply replacing the factory crank (and connecting rods) with a stroker crank - the longer piston stroke creates the additional displacement. LS1 results on the stroker 383s do not appear to be as good as the all bore versions.
The 383 all bore, the 416, the 422, and other similar sizes are made by increasing the bore size (usually from 3.9" to 4.1") for the 383, and by increasing both the bore size and the stroke length for the larger displacement engines. Increasing the bore size on LS1s is a tricky business since the stock LS1 block is aluminum, but the cylinder walls are sleeved with a stronger metal (usually iron/magnesium - rumor has it that the next gen LS6s might have ceramic liners!!). To increase the bore size, the old liners have to be punched out, the block overbored, and then new, larger lines placed in.
There are also some iron versions of the LS1 out there that avoid this whole cylinder liner issue - I believe that overbores on those blocks are done in the usual fashion, but I am not sure about that.
Hope this helps!
383s can be made either by all bore or all stroke. The all stroke 383 is created by simply replacing the factory crank (and connecting rods) with a stroker crank - the longer piston stroke creates the additional displacement. LS1 results on the stroker 383s do not appear to be as good as the all bore versions.
The 383 all bore, the 416, the 422, and other similar sizes are made by increasing the bore size (usually from 3.9" to 4.1") for the 383, and by increasing both the bore size and the stroke length for the larger displacement engines. Increasing the bore size on LS1s is a tricky business since the stock LS1 block is aluminum, but the cylinder walls are sleeved with a stronger metal (usually iron/magnesium - rumor has it that the next gen LS6s might have ceramic liners!!). To increase the bore size, the old liners have to be punched out, the block overbored, and then new, larger lines placed in.
There are also some iron versions of the LS1 out there that avoid this whole cylinder liner issue - I believe that overbores on those blocks are done in the usual fashion, but I am not sure about that.
Hope this helps!
Joined: Nov 2001
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From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
Re: OK guys sorry to do this to you, but.... [quote]Originally posted by WeatherGuy:
[QB]There are also some iron versions of the LS1 out there that avoid this whole cylinder liner issue - I believe that overbores on those blocks are done in the usual fashion, but I am not sure about that.
QB]<hr></blockquote>
Just to add some more insight to this part, the iron “LS1s” that are out there actually started life as 5.3L LQ4 truck V8s. They are LS1 “based” motors that are used by many who seek to not only increase cid of the motor, but plan forced induction or N2O (in large quantites). The fact that the block is made of iron makes it better suited to handle a lot of boost or spray. Not to say that the aluminum blocks can’t take the FI, but if your planning A LOT of nitrous or FI then you’d be better off with an iron block if you’re already planning on a larger ci motor anyway.
[QB]There are also some iron versions of the LS1 out there that avoid this whole cylinder liner issue - I believe that overbores on those blocks are done in the usual fashion, but I am not sure about that.
QB]<hr></blockquote>
Just to add some more insight to this part, the iron “LS1s” that are out there actually started life as 5.3L LQ4 truck V8s. They are LS1 “based” motors that are used by many who seek to not only increase cid of the motor, but plan forced induction or N2O (in large quantites). The fact that the block is made of iron makes it better suited to handle a lot of boost or spray. Not to say that the aluminum blocks can’t take the FI, but if your planning A LOT of nitrous or FI then you’d be better off with an iron block if you’re already planning on a larger ci motor anyway.
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From: Nawf Carolina
Re: OK guys sorry to do this to you, but.... Actually most of the big iron block guys use the LQ4 6.0 liter iron block (4.0" bore stock). The 4.8/5.3 L block has a 3.78" bore stock I think.
J.
J.
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From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
Re: OK guys sorry to do this to you, but.... [quote]Originally posted by Crazyquik:
<strong>Actually most of the big iron block guys use the LQ4 6.0 liter iron block (4.0" bore stock). The 4.8/5.3 L block has a 3.78" bore stock I think.
J.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I didn't know there was a bore size difference between the 5.3 and 6.0. I thought it was only stroke? Even if the bore was different, if you're going to bore it out further, then does it really matter? I thought the blocks were the same?
<strong>Actually most of the big iron block guys use the LQ4 6.0 liter iron block (4.0" bore stock). The 4.8/5.3 L block has a 3.78" bore stock I think.
J.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I didn't know there was a bore size difference between the 5.3 and 6.0. I thought it was only stroke? Even if the bore was different, if you're going to bore it out further, then does it really matter? I thought the blocks were the same?
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Joined: Nov 2001
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From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
Re: OK guys sorry to do this to you, but.... [quote]Originally posted by Chris ARE 360:
<strong>It does matter because the cylinder walls are thicker allowing a larger bore to be made. With the iron block even a .060 overbore is pushing it.
Chris</strong><hr></blockquote>
So they are different blocks? I wasn't aware of that...
<strong>It does matter because the cylinder walls are thicker allowing a larger bore to be made. With the iron block even a .060 overbore is pushing it.
Chris</strong><hr></blockquote>
So they are different blocks? I wasn't aware of that...
Re: OK guys sorry to do this to you, but.... [quote]Originally posted by Crazyquik:
<strong>Actually most of the big iron block guys use the LQ4 6.0 liter iron block (4.0" bore stock). The 4.8/5.3 L block has a 3.78" bore stock I think. J.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I have a 6.0 liter LQ4 block that has been bored .060 over by Agostino Racing.
A stock LS1 has a 3.900 bore. I am now at a 4.060 bore as a comparison.
Stock stroke is 3.62 I think. I am at 4.075.
Reason for using the iron block? My reasons? Iron block will handle more detonation, and I plan to use nitrous for the last half of 2002. But I ended up adding 70 additional lbs of weight to the front of the car from the iron block. But the durability is worth it to me.
<strong>Actually most of the big iron block guys use the LQ4 6.0 liter iron block (4.0" bore stock). The 4.8/5.3 L block has a 3.78" bore stock I think. J.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I have a 6.0 liter LQ4 block that has been bored .060 over by Agostino Racing.
A stock LS1 has a 3.900 bore. I am now at a 4.060 bore as a comparison.
Stock stroke is 3.62 I think. I am at 4.075.
Reason for using the iron block? My reasons? Iron block will handle more detonation, and I plan to use nitrous for the last half of 2002. But I ended up adding 70 additional lbs of weight to the front of the car from the iron block. But the durability is worth it to me.
Staging Lane
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From: Frankton, In
Re: OK guys sorry to do this to you, but.... The reasons for using an iron block are that the head studs(or bolts)will have more holding power before the threads pull from the block.It is the weakest link because of only having 4 bolts per cylinder.