Cam Help.. Newb Questions!!
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Originally Posted by The1N_only
the +2 means that the cam has 2 degrees advance ground in it
ok, sorry to sound dumb, but in english that means what compared to a regular 112??
CheaTR - 214/230 - .601/.578 - 117 lsa
TR224 - 224/224 .563/.563 - 112 lsa
MS3 - 237/242 - .603/.609 - 112-114 lsa
TRex - 242/248 - .608/.612 - 110 lsa
Of those, the TR224 comes closest to meeting your needs. If you look at their dyno graph tho, it still hasn't peaked at 6000 rpm. If I were you, and you wanted to maintain a 6000 rpm shift point, and keep all the low & mid-range torque you can, I would consider a custom grind.
I'd look at an XE-R grind 220/224 on a 112 LSA, installed +2 or +4 advanced. At +4, it gives you a 38* ABDC intake valve closing point, and an excellent (for stock unmodified heads) 8.41:1 DCR. That cam would give you the best all around power and meet all of your goals.
You could also have it ground on a 110 LSA and install it +2 for the same IVC point and gain a bit more low end torque for very little trade off at high rpms.
At the very least, steer clear of anything larger than 224* unless you want to raise your shift points up to 6500+.
TR224 - 224/224 .563/.563 - 112 lsa
MS3 - 237/242 - .603/.609 - 112-114 lsa
TRex - 242/248 - .608/.612 - 110 lsa
Of those, the TR224 comes closest to meeting your needs. If you look at their dyno graph tho, it still hasn't peaked at 6000 rpm. If I were you, and you wanted to maintain a 6000 rpm shift point, and keep all the low & mid-range torque you can, I would consider a custom grind.
I'd look at an XE-R grind 220/224 on a 112 LSA, installed +2 or +4 advanced. At +4, it gives you a 38* ABDC intake valve closing point, and an excellent (for stock unmodified heads) 8.41:1 DCR. That cam would give you the best all around power and meet all of your goals.
You could also have it ground on a 110 LSA and install it +2 for the same IVC point and gain a bit more low end torque for very little trade off at high rpms.
At the very least, steer clear of anything larger than 224* unless you want to raise your shift points up to 6500+.
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From: Chicago
Originally Posted by hammertime
CheaTR - 214/230 - .601/.578 - 117 lsa
TR224 - 224/224 .563/.563 - 112 lsa
MS3 - 237/242 - .603/.609 - 112-114 lsa
TRex - 242/248 - .608/.612 - 110 lsa
Of those, the TR224 comes closest to meeting your needs. If you look at their dyno graph tho, it still hasn't peaked at 6000 rpm. If I were you, and you wanted to maintain a 6000 rpm shift point, and keep all the low & mid-range torque you can, I would consider a custom grind.
I'd look at an XE-R grind 220/224 on a 112 LSA, installed +2 or +4 advanced. At +4, it gives you a 38* ABDC intake valve closing point, and an excellent (for stock unmodified heads) 8.41:1 DCR. That cam would give you the best all around power and meet all of your goals.
You could also have it ground on a 110 LSA and install it +2 for the same IVC point and gain a bit more low end torque for very little trade off at high rpms.
At the very least, steer clear of anything larger than 224* unless you want to raise your shift points up to 6500+.
TR224 - 224/224 .563/.563 - 112 lsa
MS3 - 237/242 - .603/.609 - 112-114 lsa
TRex - 242/248 - .608/.612 - 110 lsa
Of those, the TR224 comes closest to meeting your needs. If you look at their dyno graph tho, it still hasn't peaked at 6000 rpm. If I were you, and you wanted to maintain a 6000 rpm shift point, and keep all the low & mid-range torque you can, I would consider a custom grind.
I'd look at an XE-R grind 220/224 on a 112 LSA, installed +2 or +4 advanced. At +4, it gives you a 38* ABDC intake valve closing point, and an excellent (for stock unmodified heads) 8.41:1 DCR. That cam would give you the best all around power and meet all of your goals.
You could also have it ground on a 110 LSA and install it +2 for the same IVC point and gain a bit more low end torque for very little trade off at high rpms.
At the very least, steer clear of anything larger than 224* unless you want to raise your shift points up to 6500+.
Patriot 226/226 Dur. @.050 .585"/.585" Lift 112 LSA 109icl XE-R lobes .....$279.50
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_il6...elated&search=
7.425 pushrods
918 spring kit
You will need a spring compressor https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...wpost&t=317675
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_il6...elated&search=
7.425 pushrods
918 spring kit
You will need a spring compressor https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...wpost&t=317675
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From: Chicago
Originally Posted by cws T/A
Patriot 226/226 Dur. @.050 .585"/.585" Lift 112 LSA 109icl XE-R lobes .....$279.50
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_il6...elated&search=
7.425 pushrods
918 spring kit
You will need a spring compressor https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...wpost&t=317675
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_il6...elated&search=
7.425 pushrods
918 spring kit
You will need a spring compressor https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...wpost&t=317675
WOW
thanks for your HELP!!!!!!!!!!!
ok i what is so good about that cam? Where can it bought from? And my original post would that be good for my application?
2nd thing, i maybe looking into the MS3???
I know that the 7.4" Chromolly rods should be fine for the 224/224 and the MS3?
But from what i have been reading anything over .600 will need 921 springs?? or will 918s still get the job done??
Another question, what are the specs on the Futura cam??
Thanks again.. you have been helping alot
You claim to want low-mid range power, and are still considering a MS3? That isn't what you want for that kinda power...the MS3 is all top end. The one car I've driven with an MS3 was very soft down low (cruising around town). It pulled like a **** up top though...
My advice: call a sponsor and have them custom grind you a cam. Tell them what you want, and let them decide on the numbers...and don't get hung up on the numbers. Otherwise, you'll always be wondering "What IF I went a little bigger?"
With as many exhausts as you have been through, you strike me as a person that is gonna go through a few cams as well.
My advice: call a sponsor and have them custom grind you a cam. Tell them what you want, and let them decide on the numbers...and don't get hung up on the numbers. Otherwise, you'll always be wondering "What IF I went a little bigger?"
With as many exhausts as you have been through, you strike me as a person that is gonna go through a few cams as well.
Originally Posted by TORCHD 02 TA
seems a little high to me on stock heads. i wan to get all out the cam with my stock non P&P heads
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From: Chicago
Originally Posted by MeentSS02
You claim to want low-mid range power, and are still considering a MS3? That isn't what you want for that kinda power...the MS3 is all top end. The one car I've driven with an MS3 was very soft down low (cruising around town). It pulled like a **** up top though...
My advice: call a sponsor and have them custom grind you a cam. Tell them what you want, and let them decide on the numbers...and don't get hung up on the numbers. Otherwise, you'll always be wondering "What IF I went a little bigger?"
With as many exhausts as you have been through, you strike me as a person that is gonna go through a few cams as well.
My advice: call a sponsor and have them custom grind you a cam. Tell them what you want, and let them decide on the numbers...and don't get hung up on the numbers. Otherwise, you'll always be wondering "What IF I went a little bigger?"
With as many exhausts as you have been through, you strike me as a person that is gonna go through a few cams as well.
i a monly doing a cam once. exhaust were a lot easier to do
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From: Chicago
so from talking to people and reading here is my thought process
TR224, LS2 chain, comp 918s, chromolly 7.4" rods, SVO 30# injectors, upgraded oil pump and.
Now do i need anything else? What about retainers and lifter?
Also the only other thing that i do not have a grasp on is +2 or +4 degrees of timing. How does that work? can not seem to grab that concept?
Any other info would be great
TR224, LS2 chain, comp 918s, chromolly 7.4" rods, SVO 30# injectors, upgraded oil pump and.
Now do i need anything else? What about retainers and lifter?
Also the only other thing that i do not have a grasp on is +2 or +4 degrees of timing. How does that work? can not seem to grab that concept?
Any other info would be great
Originally Posted by TORCHD 02 TA
so from talking to people and reading here is my thought process
TR224, LS2 chain, comp 918s, chromolly 7.4" rods, SVO 30# injectors, upgraded oil pump and.
Now do i need anything else? What about retainers and lifter?
Also the only other thing that i do not have a grasp on is +2 or +4 degrees of timing. How does that work? can not seem to grab that concept?
Any other info would be great
TR224, LS2 chain, comp 918s, chromolly 7.4" rods, SVO 30# injectors, upgraded oil pump and.
Now do i need anything else? What about retainers and lifter?
Also the only other thing that i do not have a grasp on is +2 or +4 degrees of timing. How does that work? can not seem to grab that concept?
Any other info would be great
The advancing thing isnt very difficult. What it does is allows you to take your cam and instead of intsalling it with the dots lined up you can advance the cams valve events. What this does is advances the intake valves closing, which means that the intake valve will close earlier after bottom dead center which will allow compression of the mixture to start earlier, which in turn will raise your dynamic compression, which then will give you back some of the low end grunt that you otherwise wouldnt have with that same came not advanced.
What advancing the cam also does is allows you to control where your cams overlap will occur, a good place for most of the cams overlap to occur is when the piston is at top dead center. Advancing does not change the amount of overlap, it just changes where the overlap occurs in reference to the piston.
Some cams already have the advance ground into them so if you have a 112 LSA with 2 degrees of advance ground in your cams intake centerline would be 110 degrees.
You can play with the DCR calculator thats in this forum and you can see what the effects of advancing the cam are.
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Originally Posted by brad8266
I would get some 42 lb injectors, they work well and leave you plenty of room for future projects. You dont really need lifters, but you can get em if you want.
The advancing thing isnt very difficult. What it does is allows you to take your cam and instead of intsalling it with the dots lined up you can advance the cams valve events. What this does is advances the intake valves closing, which means that the intake valve will close earlier after bottom dead center which will allow compression of the mixture to start earlier, which in turn will raise your dynamic compression, which then will give you back some of the low end grunt that you otherwise wouldnt have with that same came not advanced.
What advancing the cam also does is allows you to control where your cams overlap will occur, a good place for most of the cams overlap to occur is when the piston is at top dead center. Advancing does not change the amount of overlap, it just changes where the overlap occurs in reference to the piston.
Some cams already have the advance ground into them so if you have a 112 LSA with 2 degrees of advance ground in your cams intake centerline would be 110 degrees.
You can play with the DCR calculator thats in this forum and you can see what the effects of advancing the cam are.
The advancing thing isnt very difficult. What it does is allows you to take your cam and instead of intsalling it with the dots lined up you can advance the cams valve events. What this does is advances the intake valves closing, which means that the intake valve will close earlier after bottom dead center which will allow compression of the mixture to start earlier, which in turn will raise your dynamic compression, which then will give you back some of the low end grunt that you otherwise wouldnt have with that same came not advanced.
What advancing the cam also does is allows you to control where your cams overlap will occur, a good place for most of the cams overlap to occur is when the piston is at top dead center. Advancing does not change the amount of overlap, it just changes where the overlap occurs in reference to the piston.
Some cams already have the advance ground into them so if you have a 112 LSA with 2 degrees of advance ground in your cams intake centerline would be 110 degrees.
You can play with the DCR calculator thats in this forum and you can see what the effects of advancing the cam are.
So basically what you are saying when degreeing the cam, instead of straight up (dot to dot), degreeing lets the valves return TDC quicker hence it been advanced? When the valves close earlier, compression comes faster in the chambers making more power. What is dynamic compression?
Also has far overlapping what is that when talking about the relation to the valve? It just seems that when degreeing the cam, it alows the pistion to return TDC quicker too??
SO if i were to go with the 224 and advance the timing +2, does that really mean the the LSA is 110*
Seems that the TR224 is a good application for my set up. low end tq throught the powerband? LIke i said roll racing. but not to much pull up top? That is why i wll get 3.73s down the line. i think that a 4.10 will pull through the powerband to quick?
Again i am soooo sorry for the questions. i am going to read the cam guide again. to sink it in more
Thanks again and where can i find the DCR calc?
Originally Posted by TORCHD 02 TA
With the 42# injectors would need a bigger fuel pump then? Here is the thing. After the cam i am done modding the car. So that is why i was thinking 30#s. Plus i heard that the 30# on the LS1 were really about 35#s????? True or False? Again what about a bigger oil pump? Would is recommended for my application? i dont know too much about oil pumps. And retainers. what is their purpose?
So basically what you are saying when degreeing the cam, instead of straight up (dot to dot), degreeing lets the valves return TDC quicker hence it been advanced? When the valves close earlier, compression comes faster in the chambers making more power. What is dynamic compression?
Also has far overlapping what is that when talking about the relation to the valve? It just seems that when degreeing the cam, it alows the pistion to return TDC quicker too??
SO if i were to go with the 224 and advance the timing +2, does that really mean the the LSA is 110*
Seems that the TR224 is a good application for my set up. low end tq throught the powerband? LIke i said roll racing. but not to much pull up top? That is why i wll get 3.73s down the line. i think that a 4.10 will pull through the powerband to quick?
Again i am soooo sorry for the questions. i am going to read the cam guide again. to sink it in more
Thanks again and where can i find the DCR calc?
So basically what you are saying when degreeing the cam, instead of straight up (dot to dot), degreeing lets the valves return TDC quicker hence it been advanced? When the valves close earlier, compression comes faster in the chambers making more power. What is dynamic compression?
Also has far overlapping what is that when talking about the relation to the valve? It just seems that when degreeing the cam, it alows the pistion to return TDC quicker too??
SO if i were to go with the 224 and advance the timing +2, does that really mean the the LSA is 110*
Seems that the TR224 is a good application for my set up. low end tq throught the powerband? LIke i said roll racing. but not to much pull up top? That is why i wll get 3.73s down the line. i think that a 4.10 will pull through the powerband to quick?
Again i am soooo sorry for the questions. i am going to read the cam guide again. to sink it in more
Thanks again and where can i find the DCR calc?
Advancing the cam on install will move all of the valve events up earlier in relation to the piston position. The main concern is when the closing of the intake valve happens because this is what determines your dynamic compression ratio(DCR). DCR is your compression just with the intake valve closing taken into account. It is exteremly important in determining your low end power in cammed applications since the bigger you go the more low end you usually lose as a result of losing dynamic compression.
Overlap is just the amount of time (in degress) that both the intake and exhaust valves are open at the same time. This is the main cause for the choppy idle that comes with a big cam. You can move the overlap period around just by advancing the cam upon install. It does not determine valve opening and closing really, thats what duration is for. It is good to center this period over TDC.
If you take a 224 114 LSA + 2 advance you still have a 114 LSA, but you have an Intake Centerline(ICL) of 112 (114 + 2 advance= 112)
A 224 is a good all around DD cam, and it gets better with good gears. i have a friend with a 228 cam and it sounds so mean with his flowmaster mufflers, nice deep throaty rumble.
No problem with the questions, I am still learning too some stuff too
DCR Calc: https://ls1tech.com/forums/generation-iii-internal-engine/630637-my-dcr-calculator-if-you-have-comp-grind-doesn-t-get-any-easier-than.html
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Hey Brad i was able to fill out that sheet no problem. All i entered was 224 224 .581 .581 112 and 0* and it filled it out perfectly. But all that info was not in english lol. I really need to talk to someone in person on the phone like you or some one else who can walk me through this.
Brad what is your take on these cams:
The one i am looking at: 224/224 .563/.563 112 LSA
Thunder Racing Custom "Reverse Split" Camshaft - 227/224 .569/.563 114 LSA
Thunder Racing Custom "Reverse Split" Camshaft - 230/224 .575/.563 111 LSA
The first number is the INTAKE DURATION right? and the second number is the EXHAUST DURATION?? it is my understainding that you want the EXHAUST TO BE BIGGER????
The second two cams both made 400+ HP i jsut do not like the 114 LSA
i jsut need to talk to some one LOL
Brad what is your take on these cams:
The one i am looking at: 224/224 .563/.563 112 LSA
Thunder Racing Custom "Reverse Split" Camshaft - 227/224 .569/.563 114 LSA
Thunder Racing Custom "Reverse Split" Camshaft - 230/224 .575/.563 111 LSA
The first number is the INTAKE DURATION right? and the second number is the EXHAUST DURATION?? it is my understainding that you want the EXHAUST TO BE BIGGER????
The second two cams both made 400+ HP i jsut do not like the 114 LSA
i jsut need to talk to some one LOL
A traditional split has more intake duration than exhaust.
A reverse split has more exhaust duration than intake.
There are varying opinions on both, but from what I've gathered the idea is this: With low to moderate intake durations, a good exhaust system can properly evacuate the cylinder without an excessive amount of duration required. An efficient exhaust does not need the extra duration, so shortening the duration reduces overlap and improves idle quality and drivability.
A reverse split has more exhaust duration than intake.
There are varying opinions on both, but from what I've gathered the idea is this: With low to moderate intake durations, a good exhaust system can properly evacuate the cylinder without an excessive amount of duration required. An efficient exhaust does not need the extra duration, so shortening the duration reduces overlap and improves idle quality and drivability.
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From: kentucky
id recomend somthin in the 220 threw 230 range for some low end grunt and mid range .i went with a Torquer V2 from tsp and its a 232-234 and pulls all the way to 6500 rpm..should be a great lil cam to drive on ..As far as valve train most of the companys you look at on here like thunder racing ,Tsp, will have a complete kit including Springs ,pushrods ,locs reatines ETc. So i would look into getin a kit from one of them and that should get you ready to roll
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From: Chicago
Originally Posted by brad8266
Back from the grave, lol. he already bought his cam. 
lol.. IT IS ALLLLIVE
bought a 228/232 .588/.595 110+4 Got the complete set from TSP. With the exception of locks. i think that the stock locks will be fine
