Reverse torquer cam (the other side of the coin)
04-03-2009, 06:50 AM
#222
Well, we are always looking for innovative ways of making more power. The usual tendency is to go as large as the motor can take.
Still though those lifts are not for everyone and there are limits to everything.
After all why use a lift that goes beyond what a head can flow, like throwing stones at a wall.
For exemple:
232/228, .595/.588 108-1 LSA (108LSA/109 ICL)
So there it is for perusal and discussion.
Still though those lifts are not for everyone and there are limits to everything.
After all why use a lift that goes beyond what a head can flow, like throwing stones at a wall.
For exemple:
232/228, .595/.588 108-1 LSA (108LSA/109 ICL)
So there it is for perusal and discussion.
That cam you recommend better not have the slightest bit of exh restriction, what so ever. Should lay down real quick after peak also. Seen stuff like that tried, even with open header picking up 25+ hp, still only make what good normal 228-232 stuff does
04-03-2009, 09:56 AM
#223
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Thread Starter
That was why it was opened for discussion. BTW it would not fall on its face rapidly after peak, due to the equidistance of IVO and EVC from TDC, meaning it is not an exhaust biased cam.
The graph above is proof. look at the trq curve from 3 K to 6.5K, that grind is doing exactly what it was designed to do;cam only,with minimum mods to support.
The graph above is proof. look at the trq curve from 3 K to 6.5K, that grind is doing exactly what it was designed to do;cam only,with minimum mods to support.
04-07-2009, 09:03 PM
#225
That was why it was opened for discussion. BTW it would not fall on its face rapidly after peak, due to the equidistance of IVO and EVC from TDC, meaning it is not an exhaust biased cam.
The graph above is proof. look at the trq curve from 3 K to 6.5K, that grind is doing exactly what it was designed to do;cam only,with minimum mods to support.
The graph above is proof. look at the trq curve from 3 K to 6.5K, that grind is doing exactly what it was designed to do;cam only,with minimum mods to support.
The graph above looks like a cliff at 64-6500 a hundred or two after peak?
04-08-2009, 01:36 AM
#226
TECH Senior Member
Thread Starter
I've used those cams into the 10's, cam only. Not bad for 230 duration. 
It is all relative to what you want to do and your goals. Look at the trq output below the curve.
Yes it requires free flowing exhaust but that is a common trait amongst all reverse split.
The benefit is trq, what accelerates a car is trq.
It is all relative to what you want to do and your goals. Look at the trq output below the curve.
Yes it requires free flowing exhaust but that is a common trait amongst all reverse split.
The benefit is trq, what accelerates a car is trq.
04-19-2009, 04:10 PM
#228
TECH Senior Member
Thread Starter
As the saga continues.... 230/228 .612/.588 110-1 LSA
This is a graph of the same car, with heads and 92/92 added.
Look at how it a carries after peak and the trq curve
Feedback by owner in this thread:
https://ls1tech.com/forums/generatio...-do-heads.html
To see is to believe
This is a graph of the same car, with heads and 92/92 added.
Look at how it a carries after peak and the trq curve
Feedback by owner in this thread:
https://ls1tech.com/forums/generatio...-do-heads.html
To see is to believe
04-19-2009, 04:27 PM
#229
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This is my car.
Predator spec'd the cam for me at the beginning, and I have been in contact with him from the start since I decided to add heads, Fast, etc.
He pretty much spec'd out what I wanted the car to do. I have ARP head studs, but everything else is untouched. That is why we stopped the pull at the RPM we did as I want to be safe.
But this setup showed no signs of dropping off and actually surprised me. Every pull made while tuning the car did this. I don't know how much more it would have carried past the rev limiter, but I was extremely happy.
And because of the small overlap, the car drives and idles smooth as can be. In fact, I am even thinking about putting the Z06 TI catback on. It would be one hell of a sleeper.
Predator spec'd the cam for me at the beginning, and I have been in contact with him from the start since I decided to add heads, Fast, etc.
He pretty much spec'd out what I wanted the car to do. I have ARP head studs, but everything else is untouched. That is why we stopped the pull at the RPM we did as I want to be safe.
But this setup showed no signs of dropping off and actually surprised me. Every pull made while tuning the car did this. I don't know how much more it would have carried past the rev limiter, but I was extremely happy.
And because of the small overlap, the car drives and idles smooth as can be. In fact, I am even thinking about putting the Z06 TI catback on. It would be one hell of a sleeper.
04-19-2009, 05:18 PM
#231
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Something like 238/234, 605/.598 109-1 (109LSA and 110 ICL)
.050 VEs
9>IVO
49>IVC
45>EVO
9>EVC
108>ECL
18* Overlap
This with 2cc reliefs, 59cc heads, .040 gasket will net you 11.5:1 SCR and ~8.48 DCR
The reason i wouldn't go bigger than that is no point too much more lift on unported heads (not that big of a gain VS valvetrain instability)
I would run the lightest valvetrain you can put in with 918 springs.
Like (hollow valves, 918's, Tit. retainers, locks)
Again with LS6 intake, >>6300/6400 rpm peak, will carry and carry past that to neverland with a very flat peak. with proper gearing and suspension + hook this is a serious mid 10's setup (maybe less depending on car weight)
.050 VEs
9>IVO
49>IVC
45>EVO
9>EVC
108>ECL
18* Overlap
This with 2cc reliefs, 59cc heads, .040 gasket will net you 11.5:1 SCR and ~8.48 DCR
The reason i wouldn't go bigger than that is no point too much more lift on unported heads (not that big of a gain VS valvetrain instability)
I would run the lightest valvetrain you can put in with 918 springs.
Like (hollow valves, 918's, Tit. retainers, locks)
Again with LS6 intake, >>6300/6400 rpm peak, will carry and carry past that to neverland with a very flat peak. with proper gearing and suspension + hook this is a serious mid 10's setup (maybe less depending on car weight)
04-20-2009, 12:54 AM
#233
TECH Senior Member
Thread Starter
In cam specs you always play a tug of war. Reverse will have awsome trq below curve but that is traded by a few Hp on top. Basicaly they are intake biased cams. This is one of the reasons "El Toro" and derivatives are proving successfull, they dance on the line, play a bit on both sides if you will.
that comes from using dual lobes.
Vengeance is one shop playing that tune, they use combos of XE-R/XE (high lift), and their grinds are very successfull.
04-20-2009, 12:13 PM
#235
TECH Senior Member
Thread Starter
That is just XE-R and that cam would need flycuting, too big for cam only. The biggest you can fit in cam only at those LSA/ICL would be 230>232 range on a 110-1,
Last edited by PREDATOR-Z; 04-20-2009 at 12:18 PM.
04-20-2009, 01:48 PM
#236
I read this whole thread last night. Some of it twice. I remember PredatorZ or someone else saying that the futral f13 or f14 is a reverse split below .200 but I cant find it. I assume that is why alot of people say futral cams make the best under the curve power when compared to other off the shelf cams. Wouldn't this be an ideal situation for a car with a good intake (single plane GMPP) and good exhaust (lt's with dumped true duals) and a moderately worked head (243 with mild cleanup)? At low lift where the head needs help its a reverse split and then at higher lift it reverts back to a traditional split. Sorry if this seems like a stupid question. I always thought I had a good handle on camshaft tech but your knowledge far surpasses mine.
04-20-2009, 02:23 PM
#237
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is there any way u could make it fit by changing both those like to a 111 lsa and not affect the performance of the cam much? cause that cam really caught my eye not to big not to small
04-20-2009, 02:31 PM
#238
TECH Senior Member
Thread Starter
236/234 .615/.598 111-1 LSA
Still I would advise to check PTVC (so no surprises)
13* overlap, 6300 rpm peak minimum, needs LT/X/dual exhaust, and Ram air a plus.
That baby will need to breath.
Still I would advise to check PTVC (so no surprises)
13* overlap, 6300 rpm peak minimum, needs LT/X/dual exhaust, and Ram air a plus.
That baby will need to breath.