Top Fuel

iTrader: (8)

its been about 6 weeks that I've had my heads and cam and the daily driving is starting to become a PITA. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="gr_images/icons/mad.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Sad]" src="gr_sad.gif" />

relevant mods & info:
- GTP Stage 2 5.3L heads 11.1-11.2:1 compression
- Comp single pattern 226 XE-R cam 114 +2
- SVO 30# injectors
- TR6 plugs
- stock descreened maf
- all bolt-ons
- dynoed 401rwhp and 413rwtq unlocked w/ a 12.6-12.8 A/F ratio at WOT
- runs flawless at WOT
- IAC counts are good
- EGR and AIR removed
- idle set at 950rpms

problems:
- smokes heavy at idle and low rpm ranges whether hot or cold and regardless of cats or no cats
- reeks of fuel as well, Ltrims stay around 0 90% of time at idle and cruising
- I need new front O2's, could this be causing the Ltrims to stay near 0?
- does not find idle and bogs and dies on start up until throttle is applied, regardless of cold or warm start.
- when coming to a sudden stop the car dies
- when driving in reverse the car surges and dies 75% of the time
- when coming out of a turn if you don't stay on the gas the car will surge and then most likely die
- getting on the throttle briefly and letting off will sometimes cause to die as well.

Can you guys give me some guidance on what to do, change, or check?
Also, let me know if any of these problems are actually normal

thanks,
Steve

XtraCajunSS

iTrader: (2)

This sounds like oil buildup in the combustion chambers. This fouls the plugs which in turn lets oil and unburned fuel smoke the O2's... Pull the plugs first and check for excessive oil. It could be coming from a variety of sources but you should check the plugs before going any further...

Let us know what you find.

Shane

VINCE

iTrader: (1)

I 2nd what Shane said.. The only other cure would be to swap heads with me. My Flow Technics heads do not have any issues.. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> We all know that GTP heads are junk <img border="0" alt="[bullshit]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_bs.gif" /> and because I like having problems I would love to take them off of your hands. When you want a problem free setup. I will personally come to your house and do this swap myself.. I am available anytime. I will call off from work to help you out.. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="gr_images/icons/cool.gif" />

<small>[ August 27, 2002, 01:02 AM: Message edited by: VINCE ]</small>

jmX

Put your stock injectors back on. Bump up the size of the hole in the throttle body.

<small>[ August 27, 2002, 01:32 AM: Message edited by: jmX ]</small>

Ragtop 99

iTrader: (7)

I would try a new set of front O2 sensors if you're plugs indicate that you are rich, yet your LTRIMs look good. Looks like the sensors are providing bad info and causing you to run pig rich.

CHRISPY

remove the SVO's and run stock injectors. If having problems after that I would be surprised. If so up your idle speed to approx 975. You should DEFINITELY have no idle problems then with that cam.
Cheers,
Chris

Top Fuel

iTrader: (8)

will the stock 00' injectors be enough? or should I get a different model year's injectors?

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

Steve, you need to tackle the driving issues the car has when it's warmed up the MOST.

I would either open up the TB hole or crack the blade a bit.

OR, maybe if you have LS1 Edit or a MAF T, try to either 1) lean it out at idle-MAF T, or 2) try to add some timing at idle-LS1 Edit. You hav too much fuel or not enuff air at idle.

If your o2's are gunked up they will make the car run worse.

Put in new ones OR take your old ones and burn off the gunk with a torch. They should switch decently.

Your car is dynotuned with those injectors right? Sounds like you need to do some addtional driveability tuning as i mentioned above.

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

NOTE: I would replace or clean the 02's before I would mess with the tune.

XtraCajunSS

iTrader: (2)

Top Fuel,

My diagnosis depends on the fact that your car was running fine for a while and gradually degraded... If that is the case, then I would almost bet your plugs have at least a light coating of oil. The O2's will only make the car run worse. It is a vicious cycle...

Shane

Raughammer

1. Idling issues: How far is your TB hole drilled? Open it up, continue opening it up until your slow speed/idle problems are resolved.

2. Rich issues: Reinstall the stock injectors. Find out what the O2 sensors are doing, send us some auto tap logs. If you know you need front injectors, replace them right now. Then reinspect the problem.

3. The smoking issues. No problems with this before the head install? Is your PCV system up to snuff? Do you have a catch can for the PCV system? If you take off the oil filler cap does oil/smok puff out of the valve cover like puff the magic dragon?

Good luck.

P.S., the TB hole, o2 sensors should clear up most of your problems.

Top Fuel

iTrader: (8)

John, you're correct the car was dynoed tuned w/ the SVO's

Shane, these problems have been occuring since the install

I don't have time to do anything today, but over the next few days I will clean the O2's, reset my 1133 & 1153 codes, crack the throttle blade just a wee bit, lean it out 5% at base via my translator, pull a plug or 2, and report back w/ findings.

thanks for the help so far, <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
Steve

Top Fuel

iTrader: (8)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Raughammer:
<strong>3. The smoking issues. No problems with this before the head install? Is your PCV system up to snuff? Do you have a catch can for the PCV system? If you take off the oil filler cap does oil/smok puff out of the valve cover like puff the magic dragon?
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">w/ stock internals I had the stock PCV system w/ no oil consumption problems whatsoever. Now, with H/C I still have stock PCV system w/ added insurance of a crankcase breather and still have no oil consumption problems. The only time it uses oil is at the track, about 1/4-1/2 qt. I figure this is just from normal high rpm abuse. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

Steve

Ragtop 99

iTrader: (7)

I would not pull the injectors and put stock one s in. 3 reasons:

1) Your car was dyno tuned with the injectors. It is hard to believe that they didn't scale the injectors before moving onto WOT tuning.

2) Your LTRIMs are near zero. If you're O2s were working right and your injector scaling were stock, you would be registering LTRIMs of at least -20 because of the oversized injectors (unless you have already used the 20% lean base setting on the MAFT).

3) Once running, the computer can keep the A/F ratio even with the 30lb injectors. The Ltrims would go to -25 and STRIMs would be high, but the car would drive fine.

FWIW, I know #2 & #3 are correct because I ran my car on a stock PCM with SVO 30lb injectors for over 100 miles before I could change the injector table with Edit. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

Top Fuel

iTrader: (8)

update,

I cleaned off the O2's today and cleared the codes, so hopefully they are going to read right at least until i get these problems solved. I then went ahead and leaned it out 10% at base on my translator. Ltrims at cruising now are a little lean averaging in between 11-13. At idle they fall to in between 2-5. Car doesn't seem like it wants to die anymore and there is no hint of surging in my brief driving test period. The car still needs throttle at start up though to find its idle. So tomorrow I'm going to crack open the throttle blade to see if that aids in start up. I'll then report back in. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

later,
Steve

CHRISPY

I would remove the crankcase breather if you have an otherwise stock PCV setup. You are allowing unmetered air into your motor past the MAF. this will lean out your LTRIM (Make them positive)
Please cap the breather and see what your LTRIMS look like afterwards with the PCV system totally stock.
If they are negative by alot then you need to check and see if the PCM was programed for the 30# injectors and replace to stock if necessary.
Cheers,
Chris

StevieZ

iTrader: (3)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> I would remove the crankcase breather if you have an otherwise stock PCV setup. You are allowing unmetered air into your motor past the MAF. this will lean out your LTRIM (Make them positive) </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Funny you should mention this. After installing a LS6 PCV system yesterday along with getting rid of the breather, my Ltrims at idle went about 8% more negative. The other cells did not seem to be affected as much although they did go just slightly more negative.

Top Fuel

iTrader: (8)

I opened up the throttle blade a little today. That seemed to help a little, car fired up without throttle. But, I have to close it back up some because i went to far and my IAC's are now at 0. After a few more days of driving to make sure those O2 codes aren't coming back, I'll then go ahead and put the factory oil fill back on and set the MAFT back to 0. Then the Ltrims should let us know whether the computer has been corrected for the SVO's or not.

later,
Steve