I was reading the latest enginebuilder newsletter on the Crane webpage and thought the info was quite interesting. Sorta contradicts a lot of folks who think high valve spring pressures will collapse a hydraulic lifter. Also thought the info on the new LSx lifters was interesting. Called my buddy Roger Vinci, he's doing contract for Crane, and he said the test results are exactly what he saw!Check it out.

Q/T

http://www.cranecams.com/?show=newsLetters&no=425

 

once again, another great product of theres.

 

Hmm, I wonder what size of pushrod they had in there which flexed and wiped the cam lobe. I thought I heard somewhere that Morel and Crane used to have a business relationship...

 

That is great and I know it is a great product. I even plan on installing a set. Only thing is some of us rev our engines past 5400RPM for extended periods

 

Crane does have the 3/8" pushrods now for the LSx. I read the same newsletter with interest. Wonder what rocker they used as that is a lot of rocker load as well. Sounds like they used their shaft rockers, but it isn't specifically stated.

 

5400 rpm for X hours, so why not do 6800 rpms for X hours and on cams with different ramp lobe design than their Crane ones.

So readers please READ creafully before you jump to conclusions. Nevertheless a good product but not the lifters of all lifters, knw what I mean.....

 

Understand your point, but the Crane rockers (even the 1.7's) will tend to load the lifter higher due to their seat ratio as compared to for instance the stock rockers. However, I am only assuming which rockers they ran during their testing.

 

I'm happy that someone brought up this test on this forum, but I think many of you are missing the point or read what you wanted to read into the article. First of all, this was a general information article about our hydraulic roller mechanism and the strength of the body and components. These parts are used in all of our hydraulic roller lifters including the LSx lifters. These parts have proven themselves at 8400RPM in drag race applications and consistently see 7200-7500 every weekend at race tracks across the country. This test was performed on a big-block chevy with gold race 1.7 (stud-mounted) ratio rockers and 3/8"x.080 wall pushrods typical of a hydraulic set up in a marine application. The valves were 11/32 stem but not particularly light weight as marine applications generate substantial heat in the exhaust valves at sustained high RPM. This far exceeds the loads that are incurred with the lightweight LSX valve train and the pushrods are much longer and tend to flex much more. If these lifters held up this well on a BBC, they will definitely hold up much longer in a LSx.

What I found impressive was that the mechanism never collapsed or hiccupped under the unusually high spring loads that we put them through. Many people are on this site and others are convinced that these kind of spring loads will "collapse" a hydraulic lifter. Well they don't collapse ours.

A couple of other points of clarification: 1) Crane and Morel have never had any kind of relationship. Crane was the first performance company to ever market a high performance, billet hydraulic roller lifter (first introduced about 1984). If you take a Morel lifter apart and find an old, "1st generation" Crane lifter and take it apart and look in the chamber, you will see that they are identical. Hmmm!! We are in our fifth generation of development have not used the "1st generation" design since 2002. 2) The idea of this test was to significantly overload the lifters and see how long they lasted. They never failed. Sure 5400 isn't 6800, but how long do you run your engine at a constant 6800 RPM. Come to think of it, how long do you honestly run your LSx at 5400 constant speed? It can be brutal, especially at these spring loads. 5400RPM is at least 120MPH in most cars. This test was the equivalent of 17760 miles at that constant RPM. How many rebuilds would that be??? These lifter bodies and mechanisms have run the 24hrs of Daytona at 7200+ and not had any issues! 3) This was just one of many tests we are conducting in the constant improvement of our hydraulic lifter product line. I will gladly share more results. Our hydraulic roller lifters are currently second to none and we intend to keep them that way. The new Mikronite process brought to us by our new owners will enable us to really step this product line to unexpected levels. Thanks to those who currently use our products. We really appreciate your patronage.

Mark Campbell
VP, Market and Product Development
Crane Cams Inc., A Mikronite Technologies Company

 

I've done a few marine cams over the last few years and to run 170# to 200# on the seat spring pressure on Morels or Cranes has not been an issue.

 

So how did your 1st gen and Morel design end up being identical? Are you saying that the current Morel design is the same as your 1st gen design, and that you've found problems with that design?

 

You can figure that out for yourself, Crane was first on the market with an aftermarket, billet performance hydraulic roller lifter. Why do so many people want to read things (plots, deceptions, etc) into very staightforward statements? We have had no problems with our first generation hydraulic roller lifters. There are still tens of thousands of them out there running every day and competing every weekend; but through usage we have found ways of making them better. That's my job. If I don't make our product better, I won't be around in a couple of years! FWIW, the 2009 Crane hydraulic roller lifters better be superior to what we are currently selling, and the 2011 lifters will be better than the 2009. Now you might ask: What is an improvement? Improvements are improvements in materials, manufacturing quality control capabilities, component design (such as changing the slight crown on the roller wheel..did you know that steel roller wheels flex just like a rubber tire as it flattens on the road..it's just not as much, but the effects are critical to performance! A crowned wheel performs and lasts better than a wheel without a crown!) and many other items that you can't see or evaluate just by looking at the part.

We have very good competitors that make good products. We are constantly evaluating them to make our products better and I am sure they do the same. You, the customer, get the benefit; but you must understand that you only get what you pay for! Many of the improvements in any product are extremely subtle, but they pay off in handling more abuse and operating at higher engine speed. Please don't make the mistake of thinking that because a manufacturer brings out a new product that there must have been a problem with the predecessor. Technology and production capablilites keep improving and that is why most new products come to market. Look at the bright side not the "dark, sinister side"!!

 

Are these the same lifters as the ones in the $200-$250 range for our cars?

 

No. The lifters you are talking about are a high quality replacement hydraulic roller lifter that we only recommend up to .585 lift, part number 144530-16. The lifters Mark is talking about use a carburized steel billet lifter body, premium heavy duty wheel, axle and bearings. They also have a premium hydraulic lash adjusting mechanism. Their part number is 144536-16 which supersedes part number 144535-16.

 

A lot of guys swap cams and use rods to keep the lifters from falling, will these new lifters allow these methods to still be used?

Any photo's of the lifters?

Thanks

 

is this the infamnous joe vinci? i have a set of 144530 lifters on top of a .353 lobe, do you still think i am ok? haven't had any problems in 4+ years, just wondering what you think joe. i'm sure the oil band in the new lifters have been relocated to handle the .353, .367 lobes i take it.

 

The 144530-16 lifters that you are talking about are a high-quality replacement lifter that we purchase for resale. Many other companies do the same thing. You should be fine with the .367” lobes. Like the OE lifter, this lifter will work to .635” valve lift with 1.7 rockers. The new 144536-16 lifters are a premium lifter that we manufacture ourselves and even do all of the carburized heat treatment right here in Daytona Beach. It is much stronger than the 144530-16 and has a superior wheel, axle and bearings; and we recommend it for any application that is going to take a lot of abuse (such as lofting from pushrod flex, or overreving). We recommend these lifters at lifts starting with .585” at the valve just due to the nature of the intended application. If you are building a premium, high-output engine, the 144536-16’s will give you piece of mind that the lifters will be able to take most any abuse you can give them. Hope this clarifies things. Thanks!

 

Sounds like you were using a mercury marine racing engine

All the crane stuff we have here is really nice. I wish we could get a set of your LSX hydraulic lifters because I think they are probably better than the Comp R's I use now for our lsx spintron testing.