stroker or turbo
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Sep 2007
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From: Billings Montana
stroker or turbo i have a 2000 z28 t-56 and i was wondering what everyone thinks.
i have looked into getting the sts turbo system it looks like a sold buy but i dont know if a 427 stroker kit from lunati ,http://www.rpmmachine.com/stroker-lunati-ls1.shtml, would be better overall because there is nearly 100,000 miles on my engine.
i have one more question when i do this how is my rearend going to hold up with the horse power?
thanks alot look forward to hearing from people
~Brandon
i have looked into getting the sts turbo system it looks like a sold buy but i dont know if a 427 stroker kit from lunati ,http://www.rpmmachine.com/stroker-lunati-ls1.shtml, would be better overall because there is nearly 100,000 miles on my engine.
i have one more question when i do this how is my rearend going to hold up with the horse power?
thanks alot look forward to hearing from people
~Brandon
That large of a stroke will require sleeves. I'd say look into a LS2 (or LQ9 to save $) block. With that many miles I'd say the original engine would need a rebuild before installing a turbo and trying to go big #'s. Same would go for the stroker, but that's essentially what you would be doing anyways.
Depending on your power goals, i'd say you would be safe w/ an as-is STS 5lb kit. But that's gonna make 450-500 depending on supporting mods.
The 427 would make the same if not more power, and you could always throw a n2o kit on the 427. I would think the lower boost STS kit would be more reliable if it's a DD.
The rear end is hit and miss. I have blown two on near stock power, yet there are guys with 500+hp cars that baby it and it lasts a while. Safest bet would be investing in a 12 bolt or 9"
Depending on your power goals, i'd say you would be safe w/ an as-is STS 5lb kit. But that's gonna make 450-500 depending on supporting mods.
The 427 would make the same if not more power, and you could always throw a n2o kit on the 427. I would think the lower boost STS kit would be more reliable if it's a DD.
The rear end is hit and miss. I have blown two on near stock power, yet there are guys with 500+hp cars that baby it and it lasts a while. Safest bet would be investing in a 12 bolt or 9"
TECH Veteran
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 4,117
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From: Ft. Lauderdale, FL, USA
Originally Posted by brandon2000z
i have a 2000 z28 t-56 and i was wondering what everyone thinks.
i have looked into getting the sts turbo system it looks like a sold buy but i dont know if a 427 stroker kit from lunati ,http://www.rpmmachine.com/stroker-lunati-ls1.shtml, would be better overall because there is nearly 100,000 miles on my engine.
i have one more question when i do this how is my rearend going to hold up with the horse power?
thanks alot look forward to hearing from people
~Brandon
i have looked into getting the sts turbo system it looks like a sold buy but i dont know if a 427 stroker kit from lunati ,http://www.rpmmachine.com/stroker-lunati-ls1.shtml, would be better overall because there is nearly 100,000 miles on my engine.
i have one more question when i do this how is my rearend going to hold up with the horse power?
thanks alot look forward to hearing from people
~Brandon
To go turbo you have to rebuild the engine anyway and buy new pistons.
Depends on what you want out it whether or not to go stroker or turbo.
With the stroker, you're not gonna make the power its capable of without spending about $5,000 on good heads, intake and bigger TB.
.
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Sep 2007
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From: Billings Montana
Originally Posted by Quickin
If the block is fine it doesn't matter how many miles you have on it anyway. You need to get the block re-sleeved and bored to make 427 cubic inches. Thats gonna cost $1,500 or so.
To go turbo you have to rebuild the engine anyway and buy new pistons.
Depends on what you want out it whether or not to go stroker or turbo.
With the stroker, you're not gonna make the power its capable of without spending about $5,000 on good heads, intake and bigger TB.
.
To go turbo you have to rebuild the engine anyway and buy new pistons.
Depends on what you want out it whether or not to go stroker or turbo.
With the stroker, you're not gonna make the power its capable of without spending about $5,000 on good heads, intake and bigger TB.
.
i have another couple ?'s for you. if i end up re-sleeving it would it be worth it just to go to a 447. and what would you recommend for the heads and intake.
along the lines of the turbo i would rebuild the engine probably drop the comprssion to 8:1 so i could run around 14-20 psi, fully forged ofcourse.
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Joined: Dec 2001
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From: Ft. Lauderdale, FL, USA
Originally Posted by brandon2000z
well i figured i would have to re-sleeve it and thats not a problem i can get a really good deal on it a friend of mine i wnet to school with his dad has a machine shop and runs his own business so thats not a problem.
i have another couple ?'s for you. if i end up re-sleeving it would it be worth it just to go to a 447. and what would you recommend for the heads and intake.
along the lines of the turbo i would rebuild the engine probably drop the comprssion to 8:1 so i could run around 14-20 psi, fully forged ofcourse.
i have another couple ?'s for you. if i end up re-sleeving it would it be worth it just to go to a 447. and what would you recommend for the heads and intake.
along the lines of the turbo i would rebuild the engine probably drop the comprssion to 8:1 so i could run around 14-20 psi, fully forged ofcourse.
You need to decide what you want first.
A 447 will yield you about 28 more horsepower over a 427, all else being equal. But if you go nice ETP LS7 heads or maybe their 265 heads and a sheet metal intake, you could make 600+ RWHP N/A easy, close to 650 RWHP. With a LS7 intake maybe 570-580 RWHP at most depending on everything else. But a sheet metal intake means different daily street driving characteristics.
Turbo is a whole different story, you wouldn't need a 427, let alone a 447, to make near 1,000 RWHP.
Its all about CASH and WHAT YOU WANT. It can all be done.
Your other question: I think by going 447 you would be pushing the limits of the sleeve as far as bore goes, but if you stay N/A I think you will be perfectly fine, just don't hit it with a 250 shot. The stroke will be fine as the new Darton sleeves are longer.
.
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Sep 2007
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From: Billings Montana
Originally Posted by Quickin
Well, you're talking about an N/A stroker and possibly a turbo engine, which can be the difference between a 500 RWHP engine and a 900 RWHP engine.
You need to decide what you want first.
A 447 will yield you about 28 more horsepower over a 427, all else being equal. But if you go nice ETP LS7 heads or maybe their 265 heads and a sheet metal intake, you could make 600+ RWHP N/A easy, close to 650 RWHP. With a LS7 intake maybe 570-580 RWHP at most depending on everything else. But a sheet metal intake means different daily street driving characteristics.
Turbo is a whole different story, you wouldn't need a 427, let alone a 447, to make near 1,000 RWHP.
Its all about CASH and WHAT YOU WANT. It can all be done.
Your other question: I think by going 447 you would be pushing the limits of the sleeve as far as bore goes, but if you stay N/A I think you will be perfectly fine, just don't hit it with a 250 shot. The stroke will be fine as the new Darton sleeves are longer.
.
You need to decide what you want first.
A 447 will yield you about 28 more horsepower over a 427, all else being equal. But if you go nice ETP LS7 heads or maybe their 265 heads and a sheet metal intake, you could make 600+ RWHP N/A easy, close to 650 RWHP. With a LS7 intake maybe 570-580 RWHP at most depending on everything else. But a sheet metal intake means different daily street driving characteristics.
Turbo is a whole different story, you wouldn't need a 427, let alone a 447, to make near 1,000 RWHP.
Its all about CASH and WHAT YOU WANT. It can all be done.
Your other question: I think by going 447 you would be pushing the limits of the sleeve as far as bore goes, but if you stay N/A I think you will be perfectly fine, just don't hit it with a 250 shot. The stroke will be fine as the new Darton sleeves are longer.
.
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Joined: Dec 2001
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From: Ft. Lauderdale, FL, USA
Originally Posted by brandon2000z
what are the driving carachteristics of a stroker motor i have never driven one and i would like to keep the car rather streetable not exactly a DD but close too.
AND....right now the bitch has a little over 94,000 miles and not one failure of an engine component and it still runs like day one. Just electrical sensors and little crap like that. It does burn alot of oil but thats just because of the early 2001-2002 style sleeves that were available back than....now there is NO PROBLEM with oil burning because of the new longer sleeves by Darton. And you can safely go bigger bore and go shorter stroke to 100% eliminate that oil burning issue.
If all you want is 500-550 RWHP, on pump gas, and have it last a long fuggin time, get a N/A stroker engine. Go 436ci. If you have the money go with poerted LS7 heads and a ported LS7 intake. You will make 550 RWHP through an automatic. If you want to spend a little less, go L92 heads and L76 intake and make an EASY 525 RWHP. Small 230ish cam too, it'll idle great.
And run 10 second passes
.
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Your probably going to want to get a 6.0l block to start on either one of these ventures. Be it AL or FE.
As far as rear end...It does have the miles to pop under a good pedal standing. You are going to have to make a choice on the turbo before you even take your parts to the machine shop. It is either going to be 8.5-9.0 or 11.0+ depending on what you want to do. Low compression N/A car would be a dog for the money invested. So plan it out both ways and pick the one you want to go with from there. FWIW I would suggest a single under hood turbo vs. an STS.
As far as rear end...It does have the miles to pop under a good pedal standing. You are going to have to make a choice on the turbo before you even take your parts to the machine shop. It is either going to be 8.5-9.0 or 11.0+ depending on what you want to do. Low compression N/A car would be a dog for the money invested. So plan it out both ways and pick the one you want to go with from there. FWIW I would suggest a single under hood turbo vs. an STS.
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On The Tree
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 117
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From: Billings Montana
Originally Posted by Quickin
Well, I have a 436ci stroker, N/A. It drives absolutely, no different than when my car was stock. You can drive it like a grandma or you can drive it like a devil. My mother has driven it, my sister has driven it, and both of them have never driven anything but grocery getters their whole lives. My engine idles VERY close to stock after its warmed up too (242/242 .610/.610 114 lsa). It drives on the street in stop-and-go-traffic in hot *** south Florida weather with the A/C on max and won't over-heat and for a big stroker the gas mileage is real good IMO, about 250 miles per tank in the city and as much as 360 miles on a long trip before I need gas.
AND....right now the bitch has a little over 94,000 miles and not one failure of an engine component and it still runs like day one. Just electrical sensors and little crap like that. It does burn alot of oil but thats just because of the early 2001-2002 style sleeves that were available back than....now there is NO PROBLEM with oil burning because of the new longer sleeves by Darton. And you can safely go bigger bore and go shorter stroke to 100% eliminate that oil burning issue.
If all you want is 500-550 RWHP, on pump gas, and have it last a long fuggin time, get a N/A stroker engine. Go 436ci. If you have the money go with poerted LS7 heads and a ported LS7 intake. You will make 550 RWHP through an automatic. If you want to spend a little less, go L92 heads and L76 intake and make an EASY 525 RWHP. Small 230ish cam too, it'll idle great.
And run 10 second passes
.
AND....right now the bitch has a little over 94,000 miles and not one failure of an engine component and it still runs like day one. Just electrical sensors and little crap like that. It does burn alot of oil but thats just because of the early 2001-2002 style sleeves that were available back than....now there is NO PROBLEM with oil burning because of the new longer sleeves by Darton. And you can safely go bigger bore and go shorter stroke to 100% eliminate that oil burning issue.
If all you want is 500-550 RWHP, on pump gas, and have it last a long fuggin time, get a N/A stroker engine. Go 436ci. If you have the money go with poerted LS7 heads and a ported LS7 intake. You will make 550 RWHP through an automatic. If you want to spend a little less, go L92 heads and L76 intake and make an EASY 525 RWHP. Small 230ish cam too, it'll idle great.
And run 10 second passes
.
TECH Veteran
Joined: Dec 2001
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From: Ft. Lauderdale, FL, USA
Originally Posted by brandon2000z
that sounds pretty solid. i kinda just had a little idea pop into my head now if i did that and put say a powerdyne supercharger on it and ran around six pounds on it. i just thought of it wondering what you think. and one other thing if i do that do you think it would be a good idea to try and find a LS6 block wether i go with a n/a or the s/c on it, and how much would a ls6 block run what are the differences and would it be worth the effort of finding one. or do you think i could find a decent on at a local salvage yard.
I'm not a FI (forced induction) expert, but I do know that if you want to go FI you don't want to go big cubes because than you'll need a big sc'er. If you want to SC it you can actually use stock cubes (forged internals) and make 600-700 RWHP on pump gas with a medium sized sc'er. If you do a 447 you'll need a bigger one.
I think at 6psi you can add about 80-100 hp to a stock LS1 with stock compression and be good to go. 15 psi on a forged engine would roughly give you a 300 hp increase on stock cubes. Check with the FI people for accurate info.
A real nice set-up would be a stock cube forged internal sc'ed engine at 15psi.
But for roughly $10,000 you can have a pretty wicked N/A stroker making about 525 RWHP, in the 416ci range and it'll idle close to stock.
.
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Sep 2007
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From: Billings Montana
Originally Posted by Quickin
Whats your budget anyway?
I'm not a FI (forced induction) expert, but I do know that if you want to go FI you don't want to go big cubes because than you'll need a big sc'er. If you want to SC it you can actually use stock cubes (forged internals) and make 600-700 RWHP on pump gas with a medium sized sc'er. If you do a 447 you'll need a bigger one.
I think at 6psi you can add about 80-100 hp to a stock LS1 with stock compression and be good to go. 15 psi on a forged engine would roughly give you a 300 hp increase on stock cubes. Check with the FI people for accurate info.
A real nice set-up would be a stock cube forged internal sc'ed engine at 15psi.
But for roughly $10,000 you can have a pretty wicked N/A stroker making about 525 RWHP, in the 416ci range and it'll idle close to stock.
.
I'm not a FI (forced induction) expert, but I do know that if you want to go FI you don't want to go big cubes because than you'll need a big sc'er. If you want to SC it you can actually use stock cubes (forged internals) and make 600-700 RWHP on pump gas with a medium sized sc'er. If you do a 447 you'll need a bigger one.
I think at 6psi you can add about 80-100 hp to a stock LS1 with stock compression and be good to go. 15 psi on a forged engine would roughly give you a 300 hp increase on stock cubes. Check with the FI people for accurate info.
A real nice set-up would be a stock cube forged internal sc'ed engine at 15psi.
But for roughly $10,000 you can have a pretty wicked N/A stroker making about 525 RWHP, in the 416ci range and it'll idle close to stock.
.
4:10 gears. and probably rebuild my transmission and have a new clutch put in, and do a little body work to it. i think after all thats done all have around 11 to work with the engine depending on how musch i do with the suspension and body and tires. oh and brakes really need some new brakes here pretty soon.
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From: Ft. Lauderdale, FL, USA
Originally Posted by brandon2000z
my budget will be 15-20,000 when i get the car paid off here in about 4 months but i will be doing alot in suspension, 12 bolt,and a umi full suspension
4:10 gears. and probably rebuild my transmission and have a new clutch put in, and do a little body work to it. i think after all thats done all have around 11 to work with the engine depending on how musch i do with the suspension and body and tires. oh and brakes really need some new brakes here pretty soon.
4:10 gears. and probably rebuild my transmission and have a new clutch put in, and do a little body work to it. i think after all thats done all have around 11 to work with the engine depending on how musch i do with the suspension and body and tires. oh and brakes really need some new brakes here pretty soon.
Is the car 100% street use and NO strip or street/strip? If it's just a street car, like mine is, all you need are the suspension mods I have in my sig and your car will handle fuggin GREAT for the street. Maybe get different shocks than Hals, I learned after I got them that they are really for drag racing, even though they're friggin awesome for the street too.
So the suspension for the street is only gonna cost around $1,200 in parts. Tranny rebuild, I don't know, but also if its just a street car you don;t need a monster tranny with just 525 RWHP...you'll spin the tires before you break the tranny. Rear end will cost about $2,500.
After labor this should leave you with about $14,000. You can build a mean engine with $14,000.
PM'ed ya.
.
With your budget I highly reccommend N/A, no way could you do FI the 'right' way with your budget. You have to have a serious powertrain, drivetrain, fuel system, etc. Believe me you run into this and that, if never ends. Get a mean N/A stroker with some good heads, intake and add a 200 shot on top of it.
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Sep 2007
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From: Billings Montana
Originally Posted by Quickin
$11,000 is enough for a mean-as-hell 525-530 RWHP 416ci with L92 heads and L76 intake.
Is the car 100% street use and NO strip or street/strip? If it's just a street car, like mine is, all you need are the suspension mods I have in my sig and your car will handle fuggin GREAT for the street. Maybe get different shocks than Hals, I learned after I got them that they are really for drag racing, even though they're friggin awesome for the street too.
So the suspension for the street is only gonna cost around $1,200 in parts. Tranny rebuild, I don't know, but also if its just a street car you don;t need a monster tranny with just 525 RWHP...you'll spin the tires before you break the tranny. Rear end will cost about $2,500.
After labor this should leave you with about $14,000. You can build a mean engine with $14,000.
PM'ed ya.
.
Is the car 100% street use and NO strip or street/strip? If it's just a street car, like mine is, all you need are the suspension mods I have in my sig and your car will handle fuggin GREAT for the street. Maybe get different shocks than Hals, I learned after I got them that they are really for drag racing, even though they're friggin awesome for the street too.
So the suspension for the street is only gonna cost around $1,200 in parts. Tranny rebuild, I don't know, but also if its just a street car you don;t need a monster tranny with just 525 RWHP...you'll spin the tires before you break the tranny. Rear end will cost about $2,500.
After labor this should leave you with about $14,000. You can build a mean engine with $14,000.
PM'ed ya.
.
Originally Posted by brandon2000z
that sounds pretty solid. i kinda just had a little idea pop into my head now if i did that and put say a powerdyne supercharger on it and ran around six pounds on it. i just thought of it wondering what you think. and one other thing if i do that do you think it would be a good idea to try and find a LS6 block wether i go with a n/a or the s/c on it, and how much would a ls6 block run what are the differences and would it be worth the effort of finding one. or do you think i could find a decent on at a local salvage yard.
anything with over 400ci and a good set of heads and cam will be good. you will could easily put down 500 to the wheels with a very reliable setup. because you will only be able to run 5 psi with the turbo unless you went with different heads and even then you would have over 100k on that motor.
