Need some advice on my first LS shortblock
09-02-2013, 07:24 AM
#1
Staging Lane
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Need some advice on my first LS shortblock Hi guys. I'm putting together my first LS short block, and while ordering parts, came across a few questions....
First, reply knowing that this is NOT a 1,000 HP race car build. I had a blower, but am now going back n/a...with a budget stroker. This will be primarily a stout driver/road trip car. Not looking to burn up the track with this car anymore....may do a few passes or a track day just to benchmark, but that's it. Thought about a baby shot later down the road (less than 150-200), but that depends on what I put together now....but I know I'll always have that itch. Lol.
So, here goes...
The ever present...416 or 427 debate. No FI, so why not 427? Decided on a 4.070 bore, so not worried about the cylinder walls as much...but am concerned with the long stroke and losing ring seal. Any advice?
-Callies/Lunati/K1/Scat/Eagle? In my SBC days, everybody seemed to run Scat or Eagle. In the LS world, Callie's seems like the go-to. Lunati and K1 seem to have some nice LS pieces too.
Some shops..TSP and Livernois for example, have their own budget crank and rods...are they any good? Remember...baby shot later on, maybe...unless I can get enough out of it to be happy on all motor.
-Tool steel wrist pins...do I really need them at my level?
-Coated bearings/skirts...again, do I really need them at my level?
-Balancing....should I have the rotating assembly balanced from the vendor? Or at my machine shop with the block? Same price either way.
-Head gaskets...thinner now to bump CR slightly? Would limit NO2 useage in the future, but if the n/a numbers are good enough I wouldn't even bother and just turn my attentions and future budget elsewhere on the drive train.
That's all for now...I'm sure I'll think of something else though. Lol.
Thanks for any info advice.
First, reply knowing that this is NOT a 1,000 HP race car build. I had a blower, but am now going back n/a...with a budget stroker. This will be primarily a stout driver/road trip car. Not looking to burn up the track with this car anymore....may do a few passes or a track day just to benchmark, but that's it. Thought about a baby shot later down the road (less than 150-200), but that depends on what I put together now....but I know I'll always have that itch. Lol.
So, here goes...
The ever present...416 or 427 debate. No FI, so why not 427? Decided on a 4.070 bore, so not worried about the cylinder walls as much...but am concerned with the long stroke and losing ring seal. Any advice?
-Callies/Lunati/K1/Scat/Eagle? In my SBC days, everybody seemed to run Scat or Eagle. In the LS world, Callie's seems like the go-to. Lunati and K1 seem to have some nice LS pieces too.
Some shops..TSP and Livernois for example, have their own budget crank and rods...are they any good? Remember...baby shot later on, maybe...unless I can get enough out of it to be happy on all motor.
-Tool steel wrist pins...do I really need them at my level?
-Coated bearings/skirts...again, do I really need them at my level?
-Balancing....should I have the rotating assembly balanced from the vendor? Or at my machine shop with the block? Same price either way.
-Head gaskets...thinner now to bump CR slightly? Would limit NO2 useage in the future, but if the n/a numbers are good enough I wouldn't even bother and just turn my attentions and future budget elsewhere on the drive train.
That's all for now...I'm sure I'll think of something else though. Lol.
Thanks for any info advice.
09-02-2013, 07:37 AM
#2
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I ran into this question a while ago. I was thinking of doing a 427 LS3 but i was steered away from it due to skirt wear issues dont feel like dealing with higher maintanence since my application is similar to yours. so i ordered a 418 from TSP. And from what ive been told their budget stuff is pretty solid. I went with Callies crank and Rods just off reviews from others.
09-02-2013, 09:04 AM
#6
All responses in bold
Hi guys. I'm putting together my first LS short block, and while ordering parts, came across a few questions....
First, reply knowing that this is NOT a 1,000 HP race car build. I had a blower, but am now going back n/a...with a budget stroker. This will be primarily a stout driver/road trip car. Not looking to burn up the track with this car anymore....may do a few passes or a track day just to benchmark, but that's it. Thought about a baby shot later down the road (less than 150-200), but that depends on what I put together now....but I know I'll always have that itch. Lol.
So, here goes...
The ever present...416 or 427 debate. No FI, so why not 427? Decided on a 4.070 bore, so not worried about the cylinder walls as much...but am concerned with the long stroke and losing ring seal. Any advice?
Go with a 416 with the 4.000 crank. You won't miss the 11 cubes and your motor will have better ring seal.
-Callies/Lunati/K1/Scat/Eagle? In my SBC days, everybody seemed to run Scat or Eagle. In the LS world, Callie's seems like the go-to. Lunati and K1 seem to have some nice LS pieces too.
Some shops..TSP and Livernois for example, have their own budget crank and rods...are they any good? Remember...baby shot later on, maybe...unless I can get enough out of it to be happy on all motor.
If you are going to throw a shot on it then again, stay with the 416 setup
-Tool steel wrist pins...do I really need them at my level?
Nah they aren't needed
-Coated bearings/skirts...again, do I really need them at my level?
Nah they aren't needed either.
-Balancing....should I have the rotating assembly balanced from the vendor? Or at my machine shop with the block? Same price either way.
I would just let whoever you buy it from just balance it before you get it
-Head gaskets...thinner now to bump CR slightly? Would limit NO2 useage in the future, but if the n/a numbers are good enough I wouldn't even bother and just turn my attentions and future budget elsewhere on the drive train.
I would go with a .040 gasket that way your compression will be 11.3-4 with the -3 cc L92 pistons TSP or most manufacturers have. That compression will still be fine for nitrous.
That's all for now...I'm sure I'll think of something else though. Lol.
Thanks for any info advice.
First, reply knowing that this is NOT a 1,000 HP race car build. I had a blower, but am now going back n/a...with a budget stroker. This will be primarily a stout driver/road trip car. Not looking to burn up the track with this car anymore....may do a few passes or a track day just to benchmark, but that's it. Thought about a baby shot later down the road (less than 150-200), but that depends on what I put together now....but I know I'll always have that itch. Lol.
So, here goes...
The ever present...416 or 427 debate. No FI, so why not 427? Decided on a 4.070 bore, so not worried about the cylinder walls as much...but am concerned with the long stroke and losing ring seal. Any advice?
Go with a 416 with the 4.000 crank. You won't miss the 11 cubes and your motor will have better ring seal.
-Callies/Lunati/K1/Scat/Eagle? In my SBC days, everybody seemed to run Scat or Eagle. In the LS world, Callie's seems like the go-to. Lunati and K1 seem to have some nice LS pieces too.
Some shops..TSP and Livernois for example, have their own budget crank and rods...are they any good? Remember...baby shot later on, maybe...unless I can get enough out of it to be happy on all motor.
If you are going to throw a shot on it then again, stay with the 416 setup
-Tool steel wrist pins...do I really need them at my level?
Nah they aren't needed
-Coated bearings/skirts...again, do I really need them at my level?
Nah they aren't needed either.
-Balancing....should I have the rotating assembly balanced from the vendor? Or at my machine shop with the block? Same price either way.
I would just let whoever you buy it from just balance it before you get it
-Head gaskets...thinner now to bump CR slightly? Would limit NO2 useage in the future, but if the n/a numbers are good enough I wouldn't even bother and just turn my attentions and future budget elsewhere on the drive train.
I would go with a .040 gasket that way your compression will be 11.3-4 with the -3 cc L92 pistons TSP or most manufacturers have. That compression will still be fine for nitrous.
That's all for now...I'm sure I'll think of something else though. Lol.
Thanks for any info advice.
09-03-2013, 11:32 AM
#7
Staging Lane
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Thanks for the replies.
I figure I'm just going to stick with the 416 route, especially since I'm keeping my stock ported heads/intake.
Still debating on what the bottom end should be...house TSP stuff, Callies, or Lunati.
I figure I'm just going to stick with the 416 route, especially since I'm keeping my stock ported heads/intake.
Still debating on what the bottom end should be...house TSP stuff, Callies, or Lunati.
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09-03-2013, 01:10 PM
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Staging Lane
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Going to have to have a lifter bore sleeved if I use my block. With the added cleaning and machining, I'm wondering if it'd be cheaper to simply get a new short block and just use mine as a core....
09-05-2013, 10:19 AM
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Staging Lane
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Anybody got any ballpark machining prices?
sleeve lifter bore
hot tank/clean block
standard stroker machine work, bore/hone, new bearings pressed, etc...
or just get a short block and core mine?
sleeve lifter bore
hot tank/clean block
standard stroker machine work, bore/hone, new bearings pressed, etc...
or just get a short block and core mine?
09-05-2013, 02:05 PM
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Anybody got any ballpark machining prices?
sleeve lifter bore=350 to 450
hot tank/clean block= 100 to 125
standard stroker machine work, bore/hone, new bearings pressed, etc...=600 to 700
And don't forget you have to get it Balanced.
sleeve lifter bore=350 to 450
hot tank/clean block= 100 to 125
standard stroker machine work, bore/hone, new bearings pressed, etc...=600 to 700
And don't forget you have to get it Balanced.
09-05-2013, 02:51 PM
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U would do better buying a short or long block 416...I just like to see every thing as I build ....My engine is very similar to yours, except for LQ9 and it being a 408.To have your block complete with all of your own parts will set u back @ min.$1500.oo and you will have to have all your OWN parts....Rods 600/Crank 750-800 all eagle.Pistons 750+..... bearings, rings=Total seal..150 to 250 depending..... and then pay 1500 for assembly and balancing.Also ARP studs+ 200..... block work is included in the 1500 boring....etc
09-05-2013, 02:51 PM
#18
Staging Lane
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That's what it's starting to look like is the path of least resistance. Especially if I can just core mine, and even more so if they can do the wire transfer payment discount. I didn't think TSP did cores anymore.
09-05-2013, 02:54 PM
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Staging Lane
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Working it out, buying most everything from TSP and using a local'ish SAM machine facility, I think by the time I jumped through all the hoops and gathered all the parts, I may save $100.
If I can core my short block, a new one is the way I'd go.
If I can core my short block, a new one is the way I'd go.
