Cam Swap...Parts list and ordering in a week or two
01-08-2014, 11:18 PM
#21
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As for the transmission, I would recommend getting TEP parts, and having a trusted local shop handle the install. Definitely go with 3.69 gears/3500 stall converter.
I bet you will be consistent 12.8's with street tires at 107-109 mph (390-400 crank hp)
Keep in mind that it is easy to over cam the 5.3L. It already has huge 212cc intake ports. This is why I recommended leaving the ports and such alone. I had my factory heads pocket ported and peak torque came in at 5000 RPM on the dyno. I realized that more hp would require higher RPM, or a different head. The W-body is heavy, with a power eating auto. Torque is where it is at. Trust me on this. Remember the 5.3 gets it's displacement from a large stroke, not from a large bore. The large stroke in the LS motors, help make the engines stay alive at lower RPM's with cathedral port heads. I think this is why most LS engines make peak TQ around 4K.
I bet you will be consistent 12.8's with street tires at 107-109 mph (390-400 crank hp)
Keep in mind that it is easy to over cam the 5.3L. It already has huge 212cc intake ports. This is why I recommended leaving the ports and such alone. I had my factory heads pocket ported and peak torque came in at 5000 RPM on the dyno. I realized that more hp would require higher RPM, or a different head. The W-body is heavy, with a power eating auto. Torque is where it is at. Trust me on this. Remember the 5.3 gets it's displacement from a large stroke, not from a large bore. The large stroke in the LS motors, help make the engines stay alive at lower RPM's with cathedral port heads. I think this is why most LS engines make peak TQ around 4K.
Last edited by DavidGXP; 01-08-2014 at 11:31 PM.
01-09-2014, 03:26 PM
#22
Staging Lane
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Nice parts list. I am lazy now days, but I will try to help you out.
Recommend:
OEM head gaskets
OEM head bolts
OEM balancer bolt
OEM rockers or 1.8 rockers with the Lunati cam (yes 1.8)
OEM LS2 lifter buckets
OEM LS2/LS7 lifters
OEM camshaft retainer
OEM LS6/LS2 oil pump
OEM timing cover gasket
OEM intake gaskets (improved design LS6)
Katech valley cover kit (NON DOD)
Lunati pushrods
Lunati Dual valve springs (I will never use beehive again)
Lunati voodoo camshaft 212/223 cam (great street cam 6200-6500 rpm shifts) no
Katech c5r single roller chain
DT headers
Single 3" into dual 2.5" exhaust
OEM balancer (improved LS4 design) DONT RISK USING THE OLD ONE
Do not mill the factory heads or have them ported. Just have them professionally cleaned and the valves checked (exhaust seats take a beating)
OEM MAF/TB with CAI of your choice
LS6 intake w/LS4 TB adapter
This combo is keeping it simple and cheap. It should put down 320-330 whp with tuning
Recommend:
OEM head gaskets
OEM head bolts
OEM balancer bolt
OEM rockers or 1.8 rockers with the Lunati cam (yes 1.8)
OEM LS2 lifter buckets
OEM LS2/LS7 lifters
OEM camshaft retainer
OEM LS6/LS2 oil pump
OEM timing cover gasket
OEM intake gaskets (improved design LS6)
Katech valley cover kit (NON DOD)
Lunati pushrods
Lunati Dual valve springs (I will never use beehive again)
Lunati voodoo camshaft 212/223 cam (great street cam 6200-6500 rpm shifts) no
Katech c5r single roller chain
DT headers
Single 3" into dual 2.5" exhaust
OEM balancer (improved LS4 design) DONT RISK USING THE OLD ONE
Do not mill the factory heads or have them ported. Just have them professionally cleaned and the valves checked (exhaust seats take a beating)
OEM MAF/TB with CAI of your choice
LS6 intake w/LS4 TB adapter
This combo is keeping it simple and cheap. It should put down 320-330 whp with tuning
That is the kit with springs comp cam recommended and I'm waiting for them to email me the specs for the cam they recommend.
Something else David I have the z06 style MAF car and an ls2 throttle body with ls1 intake and injectors. I should still be able to use this stuff.
As for the harmonic balancer the one I have on now only has about 3k miles on it and is an OEM balancer. My old one was wobbling to much for me.
01-09-2014, 05:46 PM
#23
I would spend the $25 and have Pat G spec a cam for you based on your parts and what you are looking for. If nothing else it lets you know the approximate camshaft you should have based on what you have and what you asked for. From there you at least have a better idea of what size cam you should get.
I just had him spec a cam for my LS4/F40 Fiero. I wanted to break 400 whp, keep the strong top end, improve the idle and low RPM torque... not asking for much
My parts:
4" Cold Air intake
LS7 MAF
LS2 90mm TB
LS2 intake
Stock LS4 long block
Stock 1.7 rockers
Stock LS7 exhaust manifolds
5' of exhaust length, most is dual 2 1/2 but about 8" is a single 3" section
No cats, magnaflow perforated tube muffler
3050 curb weight w/driver
3.55 final drive
Manual transmission
12# flywheel
New Cam specs:
EPS HiRev lobes, 222/226, .604”/.604”, 113 LSA +3 advance
Valve events at .050"
Intake Valve opens 1 BTDC (- indicates ATDC)
Intake Valve closes 41 ABDC
Exhaust Valve Opens 49 BBDC
Exhaust Valve Closes -3 ATDC (- indicates BTDC)
Exhaust Centerline 116
Overlap -2 degrees
Current DoD Camshaft:
224/232 .564”/.575” 113 LSA
Valve events at .050"
Intake Valve opens -3.5 BTDC (- indicates ATDC)
Intake Valve closes 47.5 ABDC
Exhaust Valve Opens 46 BBDC
Exhaust Valve Closes 5.5 ATDC (- indicates BTDC)
Overlap 2 degrees
So I get more lift, slightly less duration, EPS lobe profiles and 4 degrees less overlap. All of which should help make the combo more rounded, vs being just a high rpm screamer. I will likely get this cam made and install it as instructed and dyno it to compare the power bands. Then if I want it to peak a little higher, I could retard the camshaft 2-4 degrees.
I just had him spec a cam for my LS4/F40 Fiero. I wanted to break 400 whp, keep the strong top end, improve the idle and low RPM torque... not asking for much
My parts:
4" Cold Air intake
LS7 MAF
LS2 90mm TB
LS2 intake
Stock LS4 long block
Stock 1.7 rockers
Stock LS7 exhaust manifolds
5' of exhaust length, most is dual 2 1/2 but about 8" is a single 3" section
No cats, magnaflow perforated tube muffler
3050 curb weight w/driver
3.55 final drive
Manual transmission
12# flywheel
New Cam specs:
EPS HiRev lobes, 222/226, .604”/.604”, 113 LSA +3 advance
Valve events at .050"
Intake Valve opens 1 BTDC (- indicates ATDC)
Intake Valve closes 41 ABDC
Exhaust Valve Opens 49 BBDC
Exhaust Valve Closes -3 ATDC (- indicates BTDC)
Exhaust Centerline 116
Overlap -2 degrees
Current DoD Camshaft:
224/232 .564”/.575” 113 LSA
Valve events at .050"
Intake Valve opens -3.5 BTDC (- indicates ATDC)
Intake Valve closes 47.5 ABDC
Exhaust Valve Opens 46 BBDC
Exhaust Valve Closes 5.5 ATDC (- indicates BTDC)
Overlap 2 degrees
So I get more lift, slightly less duration, EPS lobe profiles and 4 degrees less overlap. All of which should help make the combo more rounded, vs being just a high rpm screamer. I will likely get this cam made and install it as instructed and dyno it to compare the power bands. Then if I want it to peak a little higher, I could retard the camshaft 2-4 degrees.
01-11-2014, 01:48 AM
#25
Staging Lane
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01-11-2014, 07:36 AM
#26
Just a couple of things for thought:
The LS7 lifters are just basically everyday GM lifters, there is a better GM alternative
88958689
Racing Hydraulic Roller Lifter Kit
• As developed by GM Racing and GM Powertrain
• For use in Gen III and Gen IV engines where sustained high rpms
are typical
• Special reduced-mass internal components allow for higher limiting
speeds with aggressive camshaft designs
• Improved valvetrain dynamics and stability will improve horsepower,
and high rpms
• Tested to 8,000 rpm in GM Racing applications
• Set of 16
Next there is the lifter buckets/guides they are not the same for DOD/ non DOD applications.
12595365
Lifter Guide
• Works in Gen III and IV applications (except with AFM)
Also something not mentioned at all is the Timing Chain Tensioner/guides/ damper, yours will most likely be cracked / broken/ worn, a very inexpensive component.
ACDELCO Part # 12588670 (damper) guides I don`t have the number at the moment.
This is the stock LS4 # there is a damper for the LS7 which is 1.1mm thinner and of higher quality and is required with some oil pumps.
Also some oil pumps require a different lower sprocket, be certain you have the match for the pump you will be using. To go with this be sure the oil pan gasket is the newer type as it has the oil splash shield for the upper end pressure relief valve, which functions with or without DOD.
And last, have you considered the valve cover to rocker clearance?
The LS7 lifters are just basically everyday GM lifters, there is a better GM alternative
88958689
Racing Hydraulic Roller Lifter Kit
• As developed by GM Racing and GM Powertrain
• For use in Gen III and Gen IV engines where sustained high rpms
are typical
• Special reduced-mass internal components allow for higher limiting
speeds with aggressive camshaft designs
• Improved valvetrain dynamics and stability will improve horsepower,
and high rpms
• Tested to 8,000 rpm in GM Racing applications
• Set of 16
Next there is the lifter buckets/guides they are not the same for DOD/ non DOD applications.
12595365
Lifter Guide
• Works in Gen III and IV applications (except with AFM)
Also something not mentioned at all is the Timing Chain Tensioner/guides/ damper, yours will most likely be cracked / broken/ worn, a very inexpensive component.
ACDELCO Part # 12588670 (damper) guides I don`t have the number at the moment.
This is the stock LS4 # there is a damper for the LS7 which is 1.1mm thinner and of higher quality and is required with some oil pumps.
Also some oil pumps require a different lower sprocket, be certain you have the match for the pump you will be using. To go with this be sure the oil pan gasket is the newer type as it has the oil splash shield for the upper end pressure relief valve, which functions with or without DOD.
And last, have you considered the valve cover to rocker clearance?
Last edited by Ill_Born_ss; 01-11-2014 at 09:27 AM.
01-13-2014, 08:53 AM
#27
Just a couple of things for thought:
The LS7 lifters are just basically everyday GM lifters,(The same non active fuel management lifter is used in basically all , yes LS9, LS7, LS6, LS4) (the p/n you are using 16@44.97 = 719.52)(btw it is also known as HL124 ac delco which has been superseded to HL128, the 124`s stopped being used in 06 but still used in some till 08)
there is a better GM alternative
88958689 Hydraulic Roller Lifter Kit
• As developed by GM Racing and GM Powertrain
• For use in Gen III and Gen IV engines where sustained high rpms
are typical
• Special reduced-mass internal components allow for higher limiting
speeds with aggressive camshaft designs
• Improved valvetrain dynamics and stability will improve horsepower,
and high rpms
• Tested to 8,000 rpm in GM Racing applications
• Set of 16 (here in CA, over the GM local part counter 350.00 or GM parts direct 250-270)
Next there is the lifter buckets/guides they are not the same for DOD/ non DOD applications.
12595365
Lifter Guide
• Works in Gen III and IV applications (except with AFM) (about 5 bucks ea.)
Also something not mentioned at all is the Timing Chain Tensioner/guides/ damper, yours will most likely be cracked / broken/ worn, a very inexpensive component.
ACDELCO Part # 12588670 (damper)
AC Delco part # 12626407 (Tensioner Kit, timing chain) (40 bucks)
This is the stock LS4 # there is a damper for the LS7 which is 1.1mm thinner and of higher quality and is required with some oil pumps.
Also some oil pumps require a different lower sprocket, be certain you have the match for the pump you will be using. To go with this be sure the oil pan gasket is the newer type as it has the oil splash shield for the upper end pressure relief valve, which functions with or without DOD.
And last, have you considered the valve cover to rocker clearance?
The LS7 lifters are just basically everyday GM lifters,(The same non active fuel management lifter is used in basically all , yes LS9, LS7, LS6, LS4) (the p/n you are using 16@44.97 = 719.52)(btw it is also known as HL124 ac delco which has been superseded to HL128, the 124`s stopped being used in 06 but still used in some till 08)
there is a better GM alternative
88958689 Hydraulic Roller Lifter Kit
• As developed by GM Racing and GM Powertrain
• For use in Gen III and Gen IV engines where sustained high rpms
are typical
• Special reduced-mass internal components allow for higher limiting
speeds with aggressive camshaft designs
• Improved valvetrain dynamics and stability will improve horsepower,
and high rpms
• Tested to 8,000 rpm in GM Racing applications
• Set of 16 (here in CA, over the GM local part counter 350.00 or GM parts direct 250-270)
Next there is the lifter buckets/guides they are not the same for DOD/ non DOD applications.
12595365
Lifter Guide
• Works in Gen III and IV applications (except with AFM) (about 5 bucks ea.)
Also something not mentioned at all is the Timing Chain Tensioner/guides/ damper, yours will most likely be cracked / broken/ worn, a very inexpensive component.
ACDELCO Part # 12588670 (damper)
AC Delco part # 12626407 (Tensioner Kit, timing chain) (40 bucks)
This is the stock LS4 # there is a damper for the LS7 which is 1.1mm thinner and of higher quality and is required with some oil pumps.
Also some oil pumps require a different lower sprocket, be certain you have the match for the pump you will be using. To go with this be sure the oil pan gasket is the newer type as it has the oil splash shield for the upper end pressure relief valve, which functions with or without DOD.
And last, have you considered the valve cover to rocker clearance?
Last edited by Ill_Born_ss; 01-13-2014 at 08:25 PM.
01-16-2014, 10:11 PM
#29
Staging Lane
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sorry for the delay in my responses....my father has been in the ICU. Anyways im going to be making some changes to the parts list and all and going with his recommendations since he is probably the most experienced with this motor. stand by for more awesomeness
