LTX block is cancelled
But I want MORE than I can handle on the street. In fact, I want so much more, that I laugh myself silly every time I drive. Currently I feel my car is slow and it makes me yawn sometimes.
For us guys that haven't already invested in a built bottom end, this block would have given us a few extra options that we previously didn't have... and in my book, that's a damn good thing!
In the end, we are all just swinging around our E-**** here, bitching and venting about yet another LTX let down.
96capricemgr - For the record, I respect a lot of what you post on these boards and agree with most of your opinions. I lurk and read, you always contribute in the LT1 section and I would notice your absence... just busting your *****.
I really can't understand why the few of you hate to see a large cube option become available to the LTX... it's almost like you view it as a step back or something.
Yah... LS1/2/3/6 have better heads, hell it's a all around better motor. But the options are what drove their success.
it would have been a step forward, but i think most viewing it as a cost effective alternative to a 383 or 396 "race motor" would be quite disappointed. Plus... it would have been an SHP block, not a little m where you're really getting added strength, improved oiling/cooling, etc
I just like blowing money out my ***... truthfully... if I had some semblance of restraint I'd be rich by now.
Thanks guys... I mean for a moment there, I guess I just wanted more cubes to work with.
Now that I realize more cubic inches suck... I'm just going to leave her at the stock 5.7 displacement. What a moron I am for wanting more options.
Now I'm going to go make fun of all the big cube LSX donkeys and tell them how they are compensating for lack of build skills by heaping on loads and loads of unneeded displacement.
Now that I realize more cubic inches suck... I'm just going to leave her at the stock 5.7 displacement. What a moron I am for wanting more options.
Now I'm going to go make fun of all the big cube LSX donkeys and tell them how they are compensating for lack of build skills by heaping on loads and loads of unneeded displacement.
seems to me like the "big guys" here just dont want their special block in the hands of guys w/ street cars. The fact that you can do whatever with a stock block is no reason not to have a better one.
you build your car how you want it, and Ill build mine the way I want it. That is what the hobby is about.
I do not have a stroker yet and I am saying I have my hands full. I am fairly certain more stroke would make things interesting.
I don't think anyone is saying the Dart block would have been a bad thing. What we are saying is the community as a whole is NOT utilizing the block we have and that in the end the sales would not have been there for Dart to sell this cheap AND turn a profit which is afterall what businesses are there to do, make money.
It's simple enough to convert the heads to conventional cooling, then use the GM Bowtie block made for the one piece rear mains and factory roller cam.
All internams and your oil pan will still fit.
It's a fact that not enough LT1 ownners would step up and buy one, it would take the sale of several hundred blocks for Dart to turn much of a profit. Look at the LTX shoot-out car counts, then look at the LSX shoot-outs. Most LT1 racers, (which are NHRA Stock and Super Stock racers), that could afford one are restricted by the rules to GM blocks, so couldn't use them if they were available. The LT1 is not used for much else but street cars.
All internams and your oil pan will still fit.
It's a fact that not enough LT1 ownners would step up and buy one, it would take the sale of several hundred blocks for Dart to turn much of a profit. Look at the LTX shoot-out car counts, then look at the LSX shoot-outs. Most LT1 racers, (which are NHRA Stock and Super Stock racers), that could afford one are restricted by the rules to GM blocks, so couldn't use them if they were available. The LT1 is not used for much else but street cars.
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lets see:
-torque potential
-by the time i did splayed main caps to a stock block alone id already be at $500, let alone the machining... why not have more potential while im spending the money?
-stronger block, even if i dont need it.
People that dont need the block, but want to purchase it anyway are why the product failed? huh???
Other people whinning is not my problem. No i couldnt afford this block now but that doesnt mean i wasnt saving for it. Dart should not give a damn if i intend to make 450 rwhp or 800. As long as the money is in their hands they are profitting and frankly these street builds would only be helping sales so that the block could actually be produced in the first place and bought by racers. Dart probably wouldnt have even considered building it if it would only have only sold to the small sub-9 second racing crowd.
Im not going to argue that I NEED 427ci but if it only costs a few hundred more in the long run, tell me why the hell wouldnt I? (We never got to see what the pricing was going to be so you cant say i wasnt being hopeful) A wilder top end can hurt driveability whereas increased cubes do not. Just because 700hp has been done doesnt mean it was street friendly.
-torque potential
-by the time i did splayed main caps to a stock block alone id already be at $500, let alone the machining... why not have more potential while im spending the money?
-stronger block, even if i dont need it.
People that dont need the block, but want to purchase it anyway are why the product failed? huh???
Other people whinning is not my problem. No i couldnt afford this block now but that doesnt mean i wasnt saving for it. Dart should not give a damn if i intend to make 450 rwhp or 800. As long as the money is in their hands they are profitting and frankly these street builds would only be helping sales so that the block could actually be produced in the first place and bought by racers. Dart probably wouldnt have even considered building it if it would only have only sold to the small sub-9 second racing crowd.
Im not going to argue that I NEED 427ci but if it only costs a few hundred more in the long run, tell me why the hell wouldnt I? (We never got to see what the pricing was going to be so you cant say i wasnt being hopeful) A wilder top end can hurt driveability whereas increased cubes do not. Just because 700hp has been done doesnt mean it was street friendly.
The block is $1500, THEN you got to machine it, it doesnt come ready to assemble.
For less than $800(including Pro Gram main caps) you could od EVERY trick in the book to an LT1 factory block and build 1000 hp and be reliable.
Torque "potential" LMAO I can set these 325/50's ON FIRE from a 30 roll on. With a six speed I would put down upper 400's in torque, 435 now...torque "potential" hmmm.
You could take my setup, put a hyd roller in it with a six speed behind it make damn near 500 to the wheels and daily drive it. I dont see the confusion here.
There is no need for that block, too many 383/396's make less than 450 to the wheels with a STICK. VERY few make that with an auto.
Spend your money where it needs to be spent to make power, I would rather say I gotta 600 hp 383 than a 500 hp 427. If more people spent the dollars on the CORRECT setup the LT1 would show alot more of its potential.
Last edited by FASTFATBOY; Nov 2, 2009 at 11:50 AM.
Well, my na 383" (532 rwhp with non-lockup 4400 converter, and through mufflers) pushed cylinder walls around so bad it would make about ten 1/4 mile passes before the breathers began to get damp. That is with a vacuum pump. First pass with the hone and you could see right where the Hard Block stopped. Splayed steel caps stopped the bottom end from moving around, never did get the cylinders to stay. My Super Stock engine does not have that problem but it is a stock compression 355". It only makes a little over 450at the tires, but that is through a 6000 RPM torque converter.
The block is $1500, THEN you got to machine it, it doesnt come ready to assemble.
For less than $800(including Pro Gram main caps) you could od EVERY trick in the book to an LT1 factory block and build 1000 hp and be reliable.
Torque "potential" LMAO I can set these 325/50's ON FIRE from a 30 roll on. With a six speed I would put down upper 400's in torque, 435 now...torque "potential" hmmm.
You could take my setup, put a hyd roller in it with a six speed behind it make damn near 500 to the wheels and daily drive it. I dont see the confusion here.
There is no need for that block, too many 383/396's make less than 450 to the wheels with a STICK. VERY few make that with an auto.
Spend your money where it needs to be spent to make power, I would rather say I gotta 600 hp 383 than a 500 hp 427. If more people spent the dollars on the CORRECT setup the LT1 would show alot more of its potential.
For less than $800(including Pro Gram main caps) you could od EVERY trick in the book to an LT1 factory block and build 1000 hp and be reliable.
Torque "potential" LMAO I can set these 325/50's ON FIRE from a 30 roll on. With a six speed I would put down upper 400's in torque, 435 now...torque "potential" hmmm.
You could take my setup, put a hyd roller in it with a six speed behind it make damn near 500 to the wheels and daily drive it. I dont see the confusion here.
There is no need for that block, too many 383/396's make less than 450 to the wheels with a STICK. VERY few make that with an auto.
Spend your money where it needs to be spent to make power, I would rather say I gotta 600 hp 383 than a 500 hp 427. If more people spent the dollars on the CORRECT setup the LT1 would show alot more of its potential.
but just to throw it out there I would be interested in swapping all my 385ci components into a stronger block with less flex if one were to be avilable.....oh well ill just stick with my valley girdles and billet mains for now its holding up just fine and I'm shifting at 8000
468rwhp un-locked vigilante 4200 converter w/ slicks on a land a sea dyno here.....383 cubes is plenty for the air our 23 degree heads can flow
but just to throw it out there I would be interested in swapping all my 385ci components into a stronger block with less flex if one were to be avilable.....oh well ill just stick with my valley girdles and billet mains for now its holding up just fine and I'm shifting at 8000
but just to throw it out there I would be interested in swapping all my 385ci components into a stronger block with less flex if one were to be avilable.....oh well ill just stick with my valley girdles and billet mains for now its holding up just fine and I'm shifting at 8000
Thanks,
Mike V
That brings up another point I made when this idea of Dart building a block first hit.
Most of you want to do away with everything that seperates and LT1 from a gen 1 anyway. You mistakenly think the intake is bad, the distributor is bad, the waterpump is bad.
Most of you want to do away with everything that seperates and LT1 from a gen 1 anyway. You mistakenly think the intake is bad, the distributor is bad, the waterpump is bad.
The intake is by no means "bad" I made peak power at 7400 rpm with it, it is just not the best option to keep up with a high flowing high reving big cube motor. The log design just doesn't work that efficently. The intake is a great design for most LTx Head/Cam platforms however when you start making peak usable power up around 7-8k rpm the stock intake doesn't really do the job that well. You can see this if you monitor your EGT's on all of your cylinders. As for the distributor yes I will say, it is a bad design. I'm using a crank trigger and I would kind of like to be able to change my cap and rotor without removing half the front of my motor. I like the water pump though lol.
Am I saying this block would have succeeded? No. I have no ground to argue that and in fact I think it was doomed myself. But some of the things being said in this thread are ridiculous IMO. We all have different goals for our builds and we all have different budgets.
Last edited by JoeliusZ28; Nov 2, 2009 at 07:47 PM.
I was a little disappointed to see this turned down, as I planned on just putting in a used engine to get my car back on the road, then buying a Dart block once available, then start buying all of the parts here and there to build it up to a 21* TFS 427 to make a killer street/RR motor.
The good thing is, I'll save some money now. I'll just pull my current 4-bolt block and build up a 385 using the SRP 4.040" pistons I already have sitting here and just get some Scat rods and an Ohio Cranks 3.75" crank, and I'll build on what I already have. Still will go with fully ported 21* TFS heads though
.
The good thing is, I'll save some money now. I'll just pull my current 4-bolt block and build up a 385 using the SRP 4.040" pistons I already have sitting here and just get some Scat rods and an Ohio Cranks 3.75" crank, and I'll build on what I already have. Still will go with fully ported 21* TFS heads though
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