IM Thinking about a 800+HP LT1 turbo build
09-28-2010, 11:01 AM
#142
Thanks guys
Mike Im trying like hell to get my car fling like yours!! I agree with everything you just posted. People that have never done anything like this think its so easy and cheap when in fact they have no clue.
AmirGTR I would rather eat dirt than do a rear mount turbo. I know of 3 LT1 cars with them and none of them are happy with them. I did see one making near 600rwhp but had major issues and I believe he took it off, another guy never got it right and sold it after issue after issue. I hope Jen(Zgobyby sp?) can get hers figured out because she has spent a ton of cash and her car was in the 13s. A front mount is the only option for me and its about 4K for a BASE kit then you need everything else to support it like quick95 mentioned.
Mike Im trying like hell to get my car fling like yours!! I agree with everything you just posted. People that have never done anything like this think its so easy and cheap when in fact they have no clue.
AmirGTR I would rather eat dirt than do a rear mount turbo. I know of 3 LT1 cars with them and none of them are happy with them. I did see one making near 600rwhp but had major issues and I believe he took it off, another guy never got it right and sold it after issue after issue. I hope Jen(Zgobyby sp?) can get hers figured out because she has spent a ton of cash and her car was in the 13s. A front mount is the only option for me and its about 4K for a BASE kit then you need everything else to support it like quick95 mentioned.
09-28-2010, 11:19 AM
#143
Its pretty much all been covered here but i can add that I actually am building an LTX somewhere along the lines of the OP's Goals. I can honestly say If you want a shortblock good for 1000 rwhp like I did be prepared to spend atleast $5,500 on that alone, im shading closer to $7k and that doesnt include heads, fuel, or boost. That just an assembled short block.
I see guys in here saying just go eagle, but why would you? if money is an option just forget it right now. Save yourself some peace of mind and buy bullet proof components. the way it breaks down for me is something like this:
Crank- Callies dragonslayer- $1000
Rods- Carillo Billet- $850
Pistons- Custom Forged Wiseco- $800
Machine work (splayed 4 bolt, bore, hone, align hone, block deck, sonic test, cleaning, blah blah blah and assembly)- $1600
And misc (main caps, bearings, cam, valvetrain, etc etc)- $2000
And like I said before I havnt even bought heads, or boost, or fuel yet. I just decided to get the car running on port matched stock heads and NA. The Lower end is going to be cheapest part of this setup.
I see guys in here saying just go eagle, but why would you? if money is an option just forget it right now. Save yourself some peace of mind and buy bullet proof components. the way it breaks down for me is something like this:
Crank- Callies dragonslayer- $1000
Rods- Carillo Billet- $850
Pistons- Custom Forged Wiseco- $800
Machine work (splayed 4 bolt, bore, hone, align hone, block deck, sonic test, cleaning, blah blah blah and assembly)- $1600
And misc (main caps, bearings, cam, valvetrain, etc etc)- $2000
And like I said before I havnt even bought heads, or boost, or fuel yet. I just decided to get the car running on port matched stock heads and NA. The Lower end is going to be cheapest part of this setup.
09-28-2010, 11:33 AM
#144
Ok I get it. Only turbo builds require top of the line parts. Nitrous cars dont need built motors anymore. Stock fueling is great for nitrous but not on boost. Putting down 800 hp on nitrous doesn't require the same style suspension or rear end. An 800 hp nitrous car will cost half the price of a turbo alone plus the car. Turbos CANNOT be done for less than $25k. Alright. Better save my pennies or run stock with nitrous and put down huge numbers on cheap parts cause I read it in this thread. And 400 shots are safe on 400hp motors.
This is what you've said.
Cause what I've been sayingthe entire time is if your turbo build is 25k then an equal power nitrous car will still run you north of $20k. That's such a huge difference at that cost level.
I mean Christ you guys are talking about $25k turbo builds with 800whp and at the same time talking about a nitrous car that's over $20k and hasn't even dyno'd 600 who yet. That's a 20% price difference down 25% power. Yes ACs car is damn well built. But that hasn't made up TWO HUNDRED HORSEPOWER.
This is what you've said.
Cause what I've been sayingthe entire time is if your turbo build is 25k then an equal power nitrous car will still run you north of $20k. That's such a huge difference at that cost level.
I mean Christ you guys are talking about $25k turbo builds with 800whp and at the same time talking about a nitrous car that's over $20k and hasn't even dyno'd 600 who yet. That's a 20% price difference down 25% power. Yes ACs car is damn well built. But that hasn't made up TWO HUNDRED HORSEPOWER.
Last edited by LSWHO; 09-28-2010 at 11:44 AM.
09-28-2010, 11:45 AM
#146
Ok I get it. Only turbo builds require top of the line parts. Nitrous cars dont need built motors anymore. Stock fueling is great for nitrous but not on boost. Putting down 800 hp on nitrous doesn't require the same style suspension or rear end. An 800 hp nitrous car will cost half the price of a turbo alone plus the car. Turbos CANNOT be done for less than $25k. Alright. Better save my pennies or run stock with nitrous and put down huge numbers on cheap parts cause I read it in this thread. And 400 shots are safe on 400hp motors.
This is what you've said.
Cause what I've been sayingthe entire time is if your turbo build is 25k then an equal power nitrous car will still run you north of $20k. That's such a huge difference at that cost level.
This is what you've said.
Cause what I've been sayingthe entire time is if your turbo build is 25k then an equal power nitrous car will still run you north of $20k. That's such a huge difference at that cost level.
09-28-2010, 11:51 AM
#147
Ok I get it. Only turbo builds require top of the line parts. Nitrous cars dont need built motors anymore. Stock fueling is great for nitrous but not on boost. Putting down 800 hp on nitrous doesn't require the same style suspension or rear end. An 800 hp nitrous car will cost half the price of a turbo alone plus the car. Turbos CANNOT be done for less than $25k. Alright. Better save my pennies or run stock with nitrous and put down huge numbers on cheap parts cause I read it in this thread. And 400 shots are safe on 400hp motors.
This is what you've said.
Cause what I've been sayingthe entire time is if your turbo build is 25k then an equal power nitrous car will still run you north of $20k. That's such a huge difference at that cost level.
I mean Christ you guys are talking about $25k turbo builds with 800whp and at the same time talking about a nitrous car that's over $20k and hasn't even dyno'd 600 who yet. That's a 20% price difference down 25% power. Yes ACs car is damn well built. But that hasn't made up TWO HUNDRED HORSEPOWER.
This is what you've said.
Cause what I've been sayingthe entire time is if your turbo build is 25k then an equal power nitrous car will still run you north of $20k. That's such a huge difference at that cost level.
I mean Christ you guys are talking about $25k turbo builds with 800whp and at the same time talking about a nitrous car that's over $20k and hasn't even dyno'd 600 who yet. That's a 20% price difference down 25% power. Yes ACs car is damn well built. But that hasn't made up TWO HUNDRED HORSEPOWER.
OP im just trying to help here........giving my 2 cents for what its worth :p
all the other "dyno number" guys....u make ur big numbers....in the mean time i'll be working my way into the 9's NA
09-28-2010, 12:31 PM
#148
I dont see why not. Chassis is pretty much done, I have a built th350 and the only part of my engine Id worry about in the factory rods which do have arp hardware so It might last a while it might not. In the mean time i have a nice 4bolt block and cola crank that just need some pistons and rods. Vtechs car seems to do fine on a factory shortblock
Also if I remember right my car has gone quicker than yours has ever, and has every single time out, until I changed it.
If your referring to my 12sec pass at the shootout(which by the way you werent there) anyone who knows **** about cars knows my car is not set up to run NA at the moment and I had a bad day driving the first time out with the new set up.
Also if I remember right my car has gone quicker than yours has ever, and has every single time out, until I changed it.
If your referring to my 12sec pass at the shootout(which by the way you werent there) anyone who knows **** about cars knows my car is not set up to run NA at the moment and I had a bad day driving the first time out with the new set up.
. I take it you are still chasing that 120mph trap though.So since we're on specifics what exactly cost you 5mph in the 1/4 switching to a nitrous setup? A car setup for a small 200 shot shouldn't be down any power when it's running n/a.
09-28-2010, 12:39 PM
#149
AC's Car is setup well and the car DOES run quicker than 12's. As for getting that power to the ground on launch...it can....has....and could be done with the way his car is set up. Its not about what parts you ordered out of the catalog its about how they are set up....trust me. Also how fast does your car run? I dont see any numbers? Stay on topic with the discussion.....dont attack AC.
As far as my car I don't care what it runs in the 1/4. Pushing a pedal down and going in a straight doesn't amuse me since I grew up racing karts. But since you ask here's the slip.
http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k1...00timeslip.jpg
09-28-2010, 02:20 PM
#150
Forget the rest of the motor and car for a sec. FI is thousands more expensive than a N2o system. If thousands of dollars isnt a big deal then everyone would have a turbo car. Thousand of dollars is the difference of the car sitting for yrs or out on the road/track for me.
And to the 600whp comment. Anybody can spray a heads/cam car and make that power. It's no more impressive than a bolt on car running low 12s. Sorry if that offends anybody, but that's my opinion.
09-28-2010, 04:15 PM
#151
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Just for comparison sake my LT1 TT car would take close to 75k to duplicate ,the goals are to run in the 7 second zone 1300-1500 rwhp. On my LS1 Nitrous car it would take approx 40k to do, it has run mid 9's at 143 at 3700 lbs on a 200 shot. The car is now at 3500 lbs and looking to hit it with a bigger shot and try to get in the 8's with it.It is definetly very costly to make power with either poweradder of choice but turbos will make more power but at a cost.
09-28-2010, 04:27 PM
#152
Just for comparison sake my LT1 TT car would take close to 75k to duplicate ,the goals are to run in the 7 second zone 1300-1500 rwhp. On my LS1 Nitrous car it would take approx 40k to do, it has run mid 9's at 143 at 3700 lbs on a 200 shot. The car is now at 3500 lbs and looking to hit it with a bigger shot and try to get in the 8's with it.It is definetly very costly to make power with either poweradder of choice but turbos will make more power but at a cost.
09-28-2010, 04:27 PM
#153
Just for comparison sake my LT1 TT car would take close to 75k to duplicate ,the goals are to run in the 7 second zone 1300-1500 rwhp. On my LS1 Nitrous car it would take approx 40k to do, it has run mid 9's at 143 at 3700 lbs on a 200 shot. The car is now at 3500 lbs and looking to hit it with a bigger shot and try to get in the 8's with it.It is definetly very costly to make power with either poweradder of choice but turbos will make more power but at a cost.
And he's right, it costs $$ either way you look at it. I am looking at spending $3K plus in parts for weight loss. It isn't cheap to go fast turbo or not
09-28-2010, 04:46 PM
#154
Just for comparison sake my LT1 TT car would take close to 75k to duplicate ,the goals are to run in the 7 second zone 1300-1500 rwhp. On my LS1 Nitrous car it would take approx 40k to do, it has run mid 9's at 143 at 3700 lbs on a 200 shot. The car is now at 3500 lbs and looking to hit it with a bigger shot and try to get in the 8's with it.It is definetly very costly to make power with either poweradder of choice but turbos will make more power but at a cost.
09-28-2010, 05:01 PM
#155
Congrats on running quicker than my car, that's a real tough goal to shoot for . I take it you are still chasing that 120mph trap though.
So since we're on specifics what exactly cost you 5mph in the 1/4 switching to a nitrous setup? A car setup for a small 200 shot shouldn't be down any power when it's running n/a.
. I take it you are still chasing that 120mph trap though.So since we're on specifics what exactly cost you 5mph in the 1/4 switching to a nitrous setup? A car setup for a small 200 shot shouldn't be down any power when it's running n/a.
Car has gone 119.88 and went 116 at the shootout. Its not about power it was the set up changes.
Big tires, 2 small of gear, car was going threw the traps at 6200 not 68-7k like it should, 2000-2500ft DA didnt help either and the car would not get off the line leaving at the same rpm I had always left at . It just bogged and fell on its face. Even leaving at 5k it just bogged. Car is also heavier than it was.
Not to mention my driving just wasnt there. A week of staying up until 3-4am trying to get the car done and tow vehicle ready, showing up in BG at 3am sleeping in a tent then gettin up to go racing without any fine tuning or practice will do that to you. Car has been to the track once this yr and that was in BG. The only time it left decent It still bogged and I missed 4th It went 12.2 at 102mph
I also would imagine if I were out racing on JAN 31st 120+ trap wouldnt be an issue.
09-28-2010, 05:09 PM
#156
Yes, a turbo kit is more expensive than a nitrous kit. I've never said otherwise. But the nitrous kit or turbo kit is so minimal when the car as a whole is taken into account. Both will need SIGNIFICANT work to make that power.
And to the 600whp comment. Anybody can spray a heads/cam car and make that power. It's no more impressive than a bolt on car running low 12s. Sorry if that offends anybody, but that's my opinion.
And to the 600whp comment. Anybody can spray a heads/cam car and make that power. It's no more impressive than a bolt on car running low 12s. Sorry if that offends anybody, but that's my opinion.
Like Chris(Z8s) said hes got 35k difference in his two cars.
SD24 I never said it would be simple or that Im going to hit my engine with 400 but it could be done with a DP system. Tell me why it couldnt? You must have also missed the part about my other engine being built that should be able to handle it.
09-28-2010, 07:26 PM
#157
Do you think an 8 second car is in the same league as a 7 second car? I don't at all. What kind of power difference is that? 300whp? more? I am not sure, but it's A LOT.
$35k and what I would say is a GIGANTIC performance difference makes perfect sense. Oh and despite what you think, his LSx nitrous car has a HUGE advantage on any LTx build. They are lightyears ahead with tuning and 50whp advantage always mod per mod.
Bottom line AC, is you are arguing something I am not. I know turbo is more expensive, but the faster they are, the smaller the % of dollar per hp.
A 600hp nitrous car is WAY cheaper than a 600hp turbo car in more cases than not. But the more power you compare, (say 800, or 1000whp or so on) the lower that price difference gets. You understand where I'm coming from?
No offense, but speak for yourself, man. You've blown way more money than I could ever justify on an object with very little to no return investment. You have a hell of a damn car. It's awesome. I am impressed with it as a car, but I can't justify that amount of money that quick into a car. My house, yes. Car? No.
Last edited by LSWHO; 09-28-2010 at 07:33 PM.
09-28-2010, 08:03 PM
#158
As far as my car goes my nitrous system would only need a few changes to make the same power on my motor. I never said I was going to do it or it would be safe. I said it would make the power and that is all.
09-28-2010, 08:08 PM
#159
No offense, but speak for yourself, man. You've blown way more money than I could ever justify on an object with very little to no return investment. You have a hell of a damn car. It's awesome. I am impressed with it as a car, but I can't justify that amount of money that quick into a car. My house, yes. Car? No.
09-28-2010, 08:44 PM
#160
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Again............................ My TT Lt1 was very expensive ,Buttttttttttttttttttttt the first LS1 in the 7's on Nitrous happened just last week and that car has just as much into it to run that fast on spray. You cant compare my LS1 car to my LT1 car .Mike you've seen my LS1 car and can attest to the total streetcar that it is ,my LT1 is nowhere close to the same thing. I personally dont think there will ever be a Nitrous LT1 4th gen in the 7's it would cost just stupid money .