New Shelby's going to be showing up at the strips
11-22-2011, 01:49 PM
#41
^ This....around these parts you're either a loyal die hard chevy/gm lover, who would only consider a Camaro/Corvette even if the Cobra had 1000hp; loyal die hard Ford fan who would only consider a mustang no matter how much faster a Vette is, or you don't count (ricers, mopar guys). Maybe it's something to do with Nascar being so big here but brand loyalty is ingrained from birth 
11-22-2011, 01:58 PM
#42
[QUOTE=SS RRR;15650830]Interesting. Still reads as if you think the ZL1 doesn't have anything to worry about because the Mustang is slower because it has more power, as in the new GT500 is doomed because any attempt made to harness its power is futile.
/QUOTE]
You didn't pay attention to what I said....the Cobra's main problem is lack of traction...not lack of power. Granted, Ford *may* have helped by adding launch control as is in the Camaro, but they foolishly stuck with pizza cutter (by supercar standards) 285mm rear tires which will go up in smoke in part due it's much worse weight distribution than the Camaro (Camaro is F/R 51/49 distribution) and the massive HP obviously. Unless Ford pulls some magic with the launch control I don't see it besting the sub 4.0 0-60 of the Camaro. I admit, all of this is bench racing and either of us can be proven wrong as soon as there is an official test of both cars on the same track same day.
/QUOTE]
You didn't pay attention to what I said....the Cobra's main problem is lack of traction...not lack of power. Granted, Ford *may* have helped by adding launch control as is in the Camaro, but they foolishly stuck with pizza cutter (by supercar standards) 285mm rear tires which will go up in smoke in part due it's much worse weight distribution than the Camaro (Camaro is F/R 51/49 distribution) and the massive HP obviously. Unless Ford pulls some magic with the launch control I don't see it besting the sub 4.0 0-60 of the Camaro. I admit, all of this is bench racing and either of us can be proven wrong as soon as there is an official test of both cars on the same track same day.
Last edited by ahritchie; 11-22-2011 at 02:01 PM. Reason: spelling
11-22-2011, 02:08 PM
#43
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after the car is bought, any1 who puts money into the car will generally make the car go faster. that being said, once the new gt500's start running around with street slicks they will back up the power being put down. if things start breaking like the IRS they should have, or other parts, that just happens just like any other car. think about how many 4l60e's go out on our car, or clutches or our amazing 10 bolts. There's always weak links in cars and its our job to find out where they are =) the car is going to come out and stock may not be able to go incredibly fast due to traction, but thats a simple $400 fix.
hopefully chevy responds well to this with a twin turbo set up, but only time can tell.
hopefully chevy responds well to this with a twin turbo set up, but only time can tell.
11-22-2011, 02:31 PM
#44
viper.....that would leave room for the ZL1 Camaro to have it's 638-650 HP rated LS9/LSA without stealing Corvette sales. Who thought a day would come when 580HP is not enough stock! Thanks Ford! Lol
11-22-2011, 02:35 PM
#45
In 2011 the 5.0 is exactly what 4th gens guys wanted the 5th gen to be, similar weight to a 4th gen, a strong solid rear axle and a motor that responds incredibly to mods, yet they hate since it's a Mustang. If it was 1996, I am sure I would have bought a 4th gen as well, they were incredible performers for the dollar.
11-22-2011, 03:26 PM
#46
Let's face it, as nice as the lower weight is, it's still the same boring looking car that's been around since 05' that every teenage girl and secretary drives. The camaro actually looks good, which counts for a lot obviously, since it sells better than the new mustang even with it's fancy new 5.0. To say "Chevy can't compete" is just ignorant.
11-22-2011, 03:26 PM
#47
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Ford's "credit" side took a 16 billion "paper" paper bail-out from the gov't.
I like all the new offerings, but with 3 kids, college to pay for for them and a mortgage, I can't afford anything past the family cruiser and my 13 yo f-bod.
I like all the new offerings, but with 3 kids, college to pay for for them and a mortgage, I can't afford anything past the family cruiser and my 13 yo f-bod.
11-22-2011, 03:55 PM
#48
Looks are subjective, the Camaro is selling well, but whats going to happen in 2014 when the new Mustang comes out and the 5th gen is well in to it's production run? I bet the Mustang begins to out sell the 5th gen. The 5th gen is selling well, first time a Camaro has put up numbers over a Mustang since the third gen era.
11-22-2011, 04:02 PM
#49
Looks are subjective, the Camaro is selling well, but whats going to happen in 2014 when the new Mustang comes out and the 5th gen is well in to it's production run? I bet the Mustang begins to out sell the 5th gen. The 5th gen is selling well, first time a Camaro has put up numbers over a Mustang since the third gen era.
11-22-2011, 04:05 PM
#50
Looks are subjective, the Camaro is selling well, but whats going to happen in 2014 when the new Mustang comes out and the 5th gen is well in to it's production run? I bet the Mustang begins to out sell the 5th gen. The 5th gen is selling well, first time a Camaro has put up numbers over a Mustang since the third gen era.
11-22-2011, 04:15 PM
#51
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11-22-2011, 04:33 PM
#52
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it's a constant battle for weight, luxury and power. just because of the few here on tech or other boards would take a stripped down car with a **** ton of power doesnt mean anything. the overall concern is the general public. if you can have power, looks and luxury, its going to sell. the camaro nailed it with the 5th gen. I would much rather the car have no options , be 3200lbs and run low tens factory. but the reality is 89% of the people want what gm is selling.
as far as buying a ford. the only car that i believe is worth the money in along time that ford has sold is the 03-04 cobra.
the new mustangs are fine when they price them in a mag. but go to a dealer, the mark up was unreal. when the new 500's first came out (mustang) I saw one in texas for 85k. thats retarted.
personally id like to have a/c and a option between auto and manuel trans. turbo a small block and run with it. thats the new camaro i want. and give us a good rear end.
as far as buying a ford. the only car that i believe is worth the money in along time that ford has sold is the 03-04 cobra.
the new mustangs are fine when they price them in a mag. but go to a dealer, the mark up was unreal. when the new 500's first came out (mustang) I saw one in texas for 85k. thats retarted.
personally id like to have a/c and a option between auto and manuel trans. turbo a small block and run with it. thats the new camaro i want. and give us a good rear end.
11-22-2011, 06:15 PM
#53
[QUOTE.
the new mustangs are fine when they price them in a mag. but go to a dealer, the mark up was unreal. when the new 500's first came out (mustang) I saw one in texas for 85k. thats retarted.
[/QUOTE]
There is a dealer here, Watson Chevrolet that had a Camaro 2SS convertible they wanted $80K for it. Talk about retarded. Right now they are "blowing them out" for $43K.
Al 2002 Z28
the new mustangs are fine when they price them in a mag. but go to a dealer, the mark up was unreal. when the new 500's first came out (mustang) I saw one in texas for 85k. thats retarted.
[/QUOTE]
There is a dealer here, Watson Chevrolet that had a Camaro 2SS convertible they wanted $80K for it. Talk about retarded. Right now they are "blowing them out" for $43K.
Al 2002 Z28
11-22-2011, 06:37 PM
#54
Yea the prices have been insain but then again we went 8 years with a lack of variety in the American V8 sports coupe market. Now it seems we are flooded again and that should be a real good sign that the prices will fall a bit. I see RT challengers that were 32k to 36k 2 years ago now in the 28k to 32k range. So they are slowly coming down a tad.
11-22-2011, 08:08 PM
#55
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I got everything you said. You say the ZL1 doesn't have a thing to worry about because the Ford is not quick enough because it has too much power. I am repeating exactly what you are stating yet the only way it makes sense to you is if it comes from you.
11-23-2011, 07:52 AM
#58
I agree with , traction limited performance. I few years back CD did a test of the "American 500" The three cars were the Mustang, Viper and Zo6 all with 500 or more Hp. The Mustand got waxed in every category but price and if I remember correctly had the most HP.
11-23-2011, 08:21 AM
#59
Wow...you still don't get it. 
What I was tying to say is the mustang cannot utilize it's huge horsepower properly with the current tire/suspension setup...why is the 440 hp 5.0 Boss FASTER (0-60 4.0 12.3 1/4) than the current 550hp GT500 (0-60 4.1 12.4 1/4) Gee I wonder? 
(superior weight distribution) Why does the 750 hp Supersnake only run 12.0 with 200!?! more HP than stock? Throwing more horsepower does not solve the inherent problem.... traction issues...the Camaro's chassis/tires does not suffer these problems nearly as badly...what's so hard to get about this? 
11-23-2011, 09:23 AM
#60
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Why so defensive?
Wow...you still don't get it. What I was tying to say is the mustang cannot utilize it's huge horsepower properly with the current tire/suspension setup...why is the 440 hp 5.0 Boss FASTER (0-60 4.0 12.3 1/4) than the current 550hp GT500 (0-60 4.1 12.4 1/4) Gee I wonder? (superior weight distribution) Why does the 750 hp Supersnake only run 12.0 with 200!?! more HP than stock? Throwing more horsepower does not solve the inherent problem.... traction issues...the Camaro's chassis/tires does not suffer these problems nearly as badly...what's so hard to get about this? I get it perfectly and no amount of smiley icons will help you illustrate your point any clearer. You are saying the Mustang is slower because it has more power and the ZL1 has not a thing to worry about because the Mustang has too much power. See?
And you go on to say it's because the Mustang has too much power therefore it is not as quick.
... or am I still not getting it... 
Wow...you still don't get it. What I was tying to say is the mustang cannot utilize it's huge horsepower properly with the current tire/suspension setup...why is the 440 hp 5.0 Boss FASTER (0-60 4.0 12.3 1/4) than the current 550hp GT500 (0-60 4.1 12.4 1/4) Gee I wonder? (superior weight distribution) Why does the 750 hp Supersnake only run 12.0 with 200!?! more HP than stock? Throwing more horsepower does not solve the inherent problem.... traction issues...the Camaro's chassis/tires does not suffer these problems nearly as badly...what's so hard to get about this? And you go on to say it's because the Mustang has too much power therefore it is not as quick.
... or am I still not getting it...