LTx Motown Block
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 296
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From: Capital region, NY
Just check the last FB page status. $3,475.
https://www.facebook.com/LTxMotownBlock/
Should have done a Gofundme.....
https://www.facebook.com/LTxMotownBlock/
Should have done a Gofundme.....
Launching!
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 296
Likes: 0
From: Capital region, NY
I think that considering World is not fronting the cost for the tooling they should be selling this block for very cheap. Their prices obviously reflect the need for them to recover the costs associated with development. As far as I'm concerned the tooling costs are "the cost of doing business". I'm sick of how normal its become for businesses to pass EVERYTHING onto the consumer; and they don't even try to hide what they are passing on. This should carry an agreement with world products that the cost of the blocks will be "X amount" (a fair agreed upon amount so world makes some money) plus the actual cost to manufacture the block. This block costing the same an the other blocks they make is ridiculous, especially if they didn't have to pay to develop the tooling.
What's so unusual here is that the manufacturer refuses to assume any risk what-so-ever related to getting this particular product/project off the ground.
And BTW.....it was made pretty clear to me that any donation towards this $70K+ startup would be exactly that....a non-refundable donation to World Products.
KW
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 296
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From: Capital region, NY
I'm quite aware of this BUT it has gotten worse in recent years.
It would be cool to have a bigger cube LTx block but there no way I will pay a company to develop a block THEY make money on and I get nothing in return except the ability to PURCHASE their block at full retail price. (assuming I don't get one of the first 200 blocks)
Bottom line like you said, it's a donation.
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 296
Likes: 0
From: Capital region, NY
I'm responding to this idea and how it's being brought about. It's your money and you can do whatever you want with it. This is America after all! 
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 296
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From: Capital region, NY
Also wouldn't a 434 LTx for example need bigger heads? Like literally bigger castings? For example with a big bore wouldn't the heads overshadow the bore itself really badly? Seems like the limiting factor would be the heads themselves. What do you do then? (Like bolting L99 heads to a stock LT1 block). Maybe the LT1 heads combustion chamber can be opened up to match a larger bore? That doesn't seem effective considering the chambers close proximity. Anyone think about this? Or is this a non-issue?
Also wouldn't a 434 LTx for example need bigger heads? Like literally bigger castings? For example with a big bore wouldn't the heads overshadow the bore itself really badly? Seems like the limiting factor would be the heads themselves. What do you do then? (Like bolting L99 heads to a stock LT1 block). Maybe the LT1 heads combustion chamber can be opened up to match a larger bore? That doesn't seem effective considering the chambers close proximity. Anyone think about this? Or is this a non-issue?
Although you would want bigger heads to feed an engine that size, we're talking larger valves and runners, not physically bigger castings.
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I'm fairly certain AI could handle a job like this, would be cool to see what they come up with. Sending the stock castings I picked up to them for my 355 build.
They do make a 215cc TFS head that would be great for a street car though, but id still be looking even bigger for a hotter street/strip setup north of 400 cubes.
11 Second Club
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,707
Likes: 13
From: New Orleans, LA
I would definitely not be using stock casting at the point of needing the aftermarket block. A 400+ cube motor is going to need a lot of air, and you can only take the stock castings so far. AI only recommends their bigger AI200 head for 350-383ci motors. You really want a 220+ cc port at 400+ci.
They do make a 215cc TFS head that would be great for a street car though, but id still be looking even bigger for a hotter street/strip setup north of 400 cubes.
They do make a 215cc TFS head that would be great for a street car though, but id still be looking even bigger for a hotter street/strip setup north of 400 cubes.
Single plane. I wasn't thinking of the stock castings for 400+, I was thinking more along the lines of send AI a set of AFRs or TFSs to have worked to put the big cubes to work.
Those are their Raised Runner heads, 215cc IIRC. Super rare and crazy expensive, but some of the best 23* SBC heads around. They definitely are not a bolt-on deal though.
I'm saying if you collect a $350 deposit from 200 potential customers and start production, then you reach out to them and say "okay, we're building them, time to pay the balance of $2450", and they say, "oh I'm not paying that" or "I don't want to buy it anymore". Well then since production has started they forfeit their order and deposit.
Anyone with any experience in sales knows there are a ton of people that love to say "I'd buy that", but very few will put up the money. Look at the Chevy SS sedan. Everyone loved to bitch on internet about how nobody offers a v8 6 speed sports sedan, Chevy brings it out, and they're sitting on the lots and dealers are having a hard time moving them.
Anyone with any experience in sales knows there are a ton of people that love to say "I'd buy that", but very few will put up the money. Look at the Chevy SS sedan. Everyone loved to bitch on internet about how nobody offers a v8 6 speed sports sedan, Chevy brings it out, and they're sitting on the lots and dealers are having a hard time moving them.
I think that considering World is not fronting the cost for the tooling they should be selling this block for very cheap. Their prices obviously reflect the need for them to recover the costs associated with development. As far as I'm concerned the tooling costs are "the cost of doing business". I'm sick of how normal its become for businesses to pass EVERYTHING onto the consumer; and they don't even try to hide what they are passing on. This should carry an agreement with world products that the cost of the blocks will be "X amount" (a fair agreed upon amount so world makes some money) plus the actual cost to manufacture the block. This block costing the same an the other blocks they make is ridiculous, especially if they didn't have to pay to develop the tooling.
I'm quite aware of this BUT it has gotten worse in recent years.
I agree with this, suprising really...
That's the way I look at it as well. You give money for world to develop a product for free THEN you pay typical retail price on that item. I understand it but I just think it's dumb. Not really dumb on world products part though. Pretty smart from a business standpoint. Dumb from a consumer standpoint.
It would be cool to have a bigger cube LTx block but there no way I will pay a company to develop a block THEY make money on and I get nothing in return except the ability to PURCHASE their block at full retail price. (assuming I don't get one of the first 200 blocks)
Bottom line like you said, it's a donation.
I agree with this, suprising really...
That's the way I look at it as well. You give money for world to develop a product for free THEN you pay typical retail price on that item. I understand it but I just think it's dumb. Not really dumb on world products part though. Pretty smart from a business standpoint. Dumb from a consumer standpoint.
It would be cool to have a bigger cube LTx block but there no way I will pay a company to develop a block THEY make money on and I get nothing in return except the ability to PURCHASE their block at full retail price. (assuming I don't get one of the first 200 blocks)
Bottom line like you said, it's a donation.
Years ago DART was going to do an LT1 block. They even started taking pre-orders then out of nowhere they scrapped the project. Nobody out there wants to take the risk of producing a block for us, understandably. One of our guys have been working on this deal with World for over 2 years, and this is currently the only option we have. We tried to test the waters a year or so ago and compiled a list of about 40 people that said they would buy a block TODAY if one were available. World told us that it would take a preorder of 120+ blocks up front at regular list price in order for them to do it and take the risk. We couldn't even get close.
The $70k is for tooling to get the block produced. In exchange for World not taking any risk in this project, they offered to sell the first 200 blocks at a discounted rate. THEY ARE NOT DOING A RUN OF 200 BLOCKS right off the bat. If they did, they would most likely be sitting on a bunch of them for quite some time.
Again, this is the only option we have. Just to prep a stock block to handle even a moderate amount of power costs what this block will cost, and this block will take the LT1 platform to another level. So if you would like to see what this block could really do, please donate if you can spare $20. That's all we are asking for. It may take a little while to come up with the money, but it will definitely be worth it in the end.
Thank you,