Shorty Headers
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Originally Posted by urbanhunter44
LT's will make more power everytime, they're good for about 25 hp over stock manifolds. Shortys are good for about 15.
that was with all bolt ons, and the hot cam.
also i gained 3 mph and .4 in the 1/4 thats alot more the 15 hp.
that was with the cheapest headers on the market(at the time.)
when you get into the bigger combinations i think thats where your going to see the gain.
Last edited by blkchevyz; Apr 14, 2006 at 02:23 PM.
I've had both, and there is no comparison. I have a 98 with the poor flowing stock manifolds, and gained next to nothing as far as sound or performance is concerned with shorties. Longtubes were a BIG step up! If there wasn't a big difference, all the cars at the track would be running shorty headers lol! 
Longtubes sound and perform 100% better, and you shouldn't have to worry about rasp as long as you have cats on your car.
Longtubes sound and perform 100% better, and you shouldn't have to worry about rasp as long as you have cats on your car. TECH Fanatic
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Originally Posted by infinitebird
Shorties are a basically a waste of money unless you just get them for sound.
Long tubes are not that much more and give you way more power.
Long tubes are not that much more and give you way more power.
im not trying to be an *******, but all is shorties suck, you will make more power with long tubes... but i never see any numbers proving that.
theres another post on here that me and a few other proved that they gained nothing from going to long tubes over shorties.
i agree, if you got the extra money, dont care about inspections or ground clearence get long tubes.
now if you do have to think about the above... get shorties/mid lenghts. you wont be disapointed...
unless you get 96-97 dual cat shorties. those do suck
if thats the case get some 93-95 shorties.
Last edited by blkchevyz; Apr 14, 2006 at 04:54 PM.
Originally Posted by blkchevyz
got anything to back up that up?
im not trying to be an *******, but all is shorties suck, you will make more power with long tubes... but i never see any numbers proving that.
theres another post on here that me and a few other proved that they gained nothing from going to long tubes over shorties.
i agree, if you got the extra money, dont care about inspections or ground clearence get long tubes.
now if you do have to think about the above... get shorties/mid lenghts. you wont be disapointed...
unless you get 96-97 dual cat shorties. those do suck
if thats the case get some 93-95 shorties.
im not trying to be an *******, but all is shorties suck, you will make more power with long tubes... but i never see any numbers proving that.
theres another post on here that me and a few other proved that they gained nothing from going to long tubes over shorties.
i agree, if you got the extra money, dont care about inspections or ground clearence get long tubes.
now if you do have to think about the above... get shorties/mid lenghts. you wont be disapointed...
unless you get 96-97 dual cat shorties. those do suck
if thats the case get some 93-95 shorties.
The search button is your friend!
You will probably feel stupid for saying that after doing a search. Longtubes make way more power PERIOD, and the evidence is everywhere! Just because some random person didn't gain anything on the dyno proves nothing. The reason the dyno didn't SHOW any gains were either because of technical error, or there was a problem with the car. Lack of tune, loose spark plug wire etc. It is a known and proven fact that longtubes will make alot more power than shorties. There is a big SOTP gain, not to mention a history of undeniable evidence. 
I'm not trying to be a jerk, I just don't want anyone to be misled by this post. TECH Fanatic
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Originally Posted by Redneck Z
The search button is your friend! You will probably feel stupid for saying that after doing a search. Longtubes make way more power PERIOD, and the evidence is everywhere! Just because some random person didn't gain anything on the dyno proves nothing. The reason the dyno didn't SHOW any gains were either because of technical error, or there was a problem with the car. Lack of tune, loose spark plug wire etc. It is a known and proven fact that longtubes will make alot more power than shorties. There is a big SOTP gain, not to mention a history of undeniable evidence. I'm not trying to be a jerk, I just don't want anyone to be misled by this post.
You will probably feel stupid for saying that after doing a search. Longtubes make way more power PERIOD, and the evidence is everywhere! Just because some random person didn't gain anything on the dyno proves nothing. The reason the dyno didn't SHOW any gains were either because of technical error, or there was a problem with the car. Lack of tune, loose spark plug wire etc. It is a known and proven fact that longtubes will make alot more power than shorties. There is a big SOTP gain, not to mention a history of undeniable evidence. I'm not trying to be a jerk, I just don't want anyone to be misled by this post.dont think your going to find many people that go from shorties to long tubes without switching anything else.
i can tell you for a fact that there was no loose plug wire, car was running the same air fuel ratio as it was with the shorties. my car dynoed 344 356 with the hot cam and bolt ons with shorty. ran 12.3 @111
put on long tubes, ran and dynoed the exact same. so thats dyno and track times proving other wise.
i'm not new to these cars, been modding mine since i got it in 97. so i know the difference from a poor running car, and one that just didnt gain anything from a mod.
misled by my post? i'm the only one that posted any evidence to back up my claim? im not just coping what others have said, they most likely they copied it from someone else.
I'm not trying to step on anyone's toes here, but, I've read that LT's are better for heavily modified cars. If your running a mildly modded car, you won't see much of a gain compared to mid's or shorties. Granted, mids and shorties do give you more torque on the lower end. I personally am running Pacesetter Mid's on my 93' Z and love them to death. I also had Headmen LT's on my old 85' I had and by all means loved it, just think it was overkill. It basically comes down to what one wants to do as far as modding goes.
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Originally Posted by blkchevyz
im not new to the internet, i know what a search button is. but if your so good do a search, get me some proff. if you find it shoot me a pm so we dont ***** up his post.
dont think your going to find many people that go from shorties to long tubes without switching anything else.
dont think your going to find many people that go from shorties to long tubes without switching anything else.
I don't care what it did or did not do on your car, the combined body of evidence on this subject is fairly overwhelming.
Last edited by infinitebird; Apr 18, 2006 at 02:22 PM.
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Originally Posted by infinitebird
Not trying to be an *** either, but, if you have to ask for proof that longtubes make more power than shorties, then you haven't been doing enough searching yourself.
I don't care what it did or did not do on your car, the combined body of evidence on this subject is fairly overwhelming.
I don't care what it did or did not do on your car, the combined body of evidence on this subject is fairly overwhelming.
all i've seen is gains over the stock manfolds... yes anythings going to be better then those(even the 96-97 dual cat headers)
but as i stated earlier
if you got the extra money, dont care about inspections or ground clearence get long tubes.
if you do go with shorties/mid lenghts. you wont be disapointed
Last edited by blkchevyz; Apr 18, 2006 at 03:06 PM.
Originally Posted by blkchevyz
im not new to the internet, i know what a search button is. but if your so good do a search, get me some proff. if you find it shoot me a pm so we dont ***** up his post.
dont think your going to find many people that go from shorties to long tubes without switching anything else.
i can tell you for a fact that there was no loose plug wire, car was running the same air fuel ratio as it was with the shorties. my car dynoed 344 356 with the hot cam and bolt ons with shorty. ran 12.3 @111
put on long tubes, ran and dynoed the exact same. so thats dyno and track times proving other wise.
i'm not new to these cars, been modding mine since i got it in 97. so i know the difference from a poor running car, and one that just didnt gain anything from a mod.
misled by my post? i'm the only one that posted any evidence to back up my claim? im not just coping what others have said, they most likely they copied it from someone else.
dont think your going to find many people that go from shorties to long tubes without switching anything else.
i can tell you for a fact that there was no loose plug wire, car was running the same air fuel ratio as it was with the shorties. my car dynoed 344 356 with the hot cam and bolt ons with shorty. ran 12.3 @111
put on long tubes, ran and dynoed the exact same. so thats dyno and track times proving other wise.
i'm not new to these cars, been modding mine since i got it in 97. so i know the difference from a poor running car, and one that just didnt gain anything from a mod.
misled by my post? i'm the only one that posted any evidence to back up my claim? im not just coping what others have said, they most likely they copied it from someone else.
Not trying to be a jerk, but you can search for these results just as easy as I can. As infinitebird said there is evidence literally everywhere! There are lots of people that have gone from shorties to longtubes on bolt on cars. You can gain 25+ rwhp with longtubes, and nothing remotely close to this with shorties. You don't need a stroker to see gains with longtubes. If you don't believe me, and aren't convinced by any of your search results, then call a sponsor. Talk to someone that builds engine's for a living and ask them if longtubes make more power than shorties. You could also call a performance shop with a dyno, and they could comment on what they've seen regarding shorties vs. longtubes. Different length primary tubes will optimize power in a certain rpm range. The reason longtubes work so well on most cars, is they not only increase scavenging, but they optimize an rpm range used by most cars. A 1 3/4 shorty might make nearly the same peak power as a 1 3/4 longtube, but you'd have to spin your motor to 8,000-10,000 rpm for this to happen. The length of the tubes on shorty headers are optimal for an rpm range that most people cannot or don't wish to use. If you want to optimize your power in the 3500-7000 range, then longtubes are what you want. The difference in power between a shorty header and longtube is night and day. I do have heads/cam, but started out with shorties and then went to longtubes. There are lots of bolt on guys here in CA that experimented with shorties while trying to stay smog legal, were disappointed with the results and went to longtubes. When I get a chance I'll try and find some stuff for you.
Last edited by Redneck Z; Apr 19, 2006 at 03:17 AM.
I went with long tubes and the car is not complete as of yet, but after doing some research and asking people that know LT's where the only thing I kept hearing. I also have seen live and in person the difference LT's make over shorties or mids. Now you keep preaching you want evidence it is everywhere look on this site,camaroz28.com, and a number of other sites and you will see the evidence you want or just call any of the header company's and they will gladly answer all your questions.
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From: ofallon mo
shorties dont suck and long tubes are not gona make "way" more power than them. maybe if its a big motor thenyes long tubes prolly will but for 90% of the cars in this section i will bet that shorties will make power thats damn close to long tubes.
i have yet to see real proof of the gains from switching. yeah there are plenty of people saying long tubes are better but were did they get their info? most likely from someone else who is just parioting what they heard another person say.
i was making 335 rwhp and 350 rwtrq and running 12.5s @ 112 with bolt ons and 94-95 style slp shorties/mid lenghts. im still running the same stuff but added home ported heads and fms cam and have gone 12.10 @ 116 the first time out and still have a few bugs to work out. i dont think thats too damn bad for headers that "suck".
i have yet to see real proof of the gains from switching. yeah there are plenty of people saying long tubes are better but were did they get their info? most likely from someone else who is just parioting what they heard another person say.
i was making 335 rwhp and 350 rwtrq and running 12.5s @ 112 with bolt ons and 94-95 style slp shorties/mid lenghts. im still running the same stuff but added home ported heads and fms cam and have gone 12.10 @ 116 the first time out and still have a few bugs to work out. i dont think thats too damn bad for headers that "suck".
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again and again you guys say you gained going to long tubes or have seen gains... what was the gain? sorry the assometer doesnt count in my book.
asking a vendor if there product is better then someone else isnt going to get me anywhere
if you ask a vendor that sells both there going to say the same damn thing i am... if you dont have to worry about emission or ground clearence get long tubes
asking a vendor if there product is better then someone else isnt going to get me anywhere
if you ask a vendor that sells both there going to say the same damn thing i am... if you dont have to worry about emission or ground clearence get long tubes
Originally Posted by blkchevyz
again and again you guys say you gained going to long tubes or have seen gains... what was the gain? sorry the assometer doesnt count in my book.
asking a vendor if there product is better then someone else isnt going to get me anywhere
if you ask a vendor that sells both there going to say the same damn thing i am... if you dont have to worry about emission or ground clearence get long tubes
asking a vendor if there product is better then someone else isnt going to get me anywhere
if you ask a vendor that sells both there going to say the same damn thing i am... if you dont have to worry about emission or ground clearence get long tubes
Come on man, PLEASE search before posting! This is rediculous! One day you'll kick yourself for not searching or talking to someone who knows what they're talking about, before posting this mis-leading information. You will find all you need through a search or by talking to someone. You will find alot more than butt-o-meter results!
Launching!
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From: ofallon mo
why search when all the threads are gona be full of people saying that longtubes are soooo much better and none of them contain any proof? the only "proof" is that so and so said i should so i did.
this debate is just as bad as the ss airbox vs. cold air intake. i have not seen enough "credable" evidence to make me switch, hell im still using a paper napa filter.
this debate is just as bad as the ss airbox vs. cold air intake. i have not seen enough "credable" evidence to make me switch, hell im still using a paper napa filter.
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Originally Posted by ks my ss
why search when all the threads are gona be full of people saying that longtubes are soooo much better and none of them contain any proof? the only "proof" is that so and so said i should so i did.
this debate is just as bad as the ss airbox vs. cold air intake. i have not seen enough "credable" evidence to make me switch, hell im still using a paper napa filter.
this debate is just as bad as the ss airbox vs. cold air intake. i have not seen enough "credable" evidence to make me switch, hell im still using a paper napa filter.
Originally Posted by blkchevyz
why wont you tell me what you gained?
Because I can't show you a dyno sheet. I tune my car on the fly with hp tuners and haven't ever had it on a dyno. The butt-o-meter registered a BIG gain, but no dyno proof. Like I said though, do some research and I guarantee you'll come to the same conclusion as me. I'm not talking about word of mouth either, but solid proof. Not only is there a wealth of info out there concerning longtubes, but you'd be a fool to compare a shorty header and longtubes side by side and wonder of there is a difference.
