chi3f

iTrader: (3)

Alright, I bought a stage 3 tickshift t56 from hunter02ss,

Messages from me February 3rd 2009

Hey Matt,
I have decided to go a different route and I will not be needing a core tranny. If you will pay the shipping on the tranny I will sell it to you for the 2300+ shipping.
If you use PayPal, I will eat the PayPal fee as well.
LMK!, Chris

i'm not trying to be a pain but there is no way you will do 2300 shipped? with paypal of course.

Pay the 3% paypal fee's and it's a done deal.
Total would be $2369.00



Total price: $2369.00 on February 3rd 2009. I was very happy I finally found a built transmission to get my car one step closer to ready for summer. Well it shipped out 2/11/2009 and through ups and that was that. Last day it was reported by ups. Called UPS, they can’t find it after a couple weeks. They tell me they are sending a check to the shipper since I was the receiver and couldn’t tell me anymore about it. So I told chris (hunter02ss) that UPS told me they were sending him a check. He said it was the first he had heard of a check and that they told him they were still looking for it. I talked to them again a few days later and they closed the case and said again that the seller would be getting a check. Again they wouldn’t tell me anything more. So I waited for Chris to receive a check until march 5th. I put in a claim to paypal because you only have so many days to file a claim.

Claim:

3/5/2009 10:35 PST - Buyer: I know the transmission getting lost wasn't your fault but i am running out of time to file a claim with paypal. UPS says they have issued payment to you but won't go into further detail. Sorry for the trouble.


Well then I get his comment back through paypal:

3/6/2009 09:48 PST - Seller: The buyer did not purchase insurance for this item that was sold him. The item was shipped UPS and a shipping label was processed thru PayPal. The item shipped and got lost by UPS. This is not my fault and I should not have to refund the customer his money. UPS is supposed to send me a check for the shipping charge,s since there was no insurance,and that's it. I am out the product and if the buyer recieves his money back, I am out the money as well!

As you can probably guess reading that after thinking my money was coming back to me was quite a shock. At no point did he tell me the check was just for shipping charges. He just let me believe the money was coming back.

Finally the paypal process is over. They went in my favor and I got back 480.65. He still has 1888.35 of my money. He claims somehow he is out the tranny and $480 that paypal returned and it is my fault there is no insurance on it. When in reality he got money back from shipping it, he got my money, and he sold me the transmission I never got. Since HE never put insurance on it.

HUNTER02SS

iTrader: (24)

I shipped the tranny out to you! UPS lost it! I told you if I had the tranny back in my possesion, I would be more than happy to give you your money back. The check I recieved from UPS was for the shipping charge's I paid for.You want me to give you your money back on a item that you did not purchase insurance for and got lost by UPS???
You did not purchase insurance on the transmission, so therfore none was purchased! I never insure anything I sell, unless the buyer wants it.
This is no different when buying anyting else(like a car) it is the buyers responsibilty to purchase insurance!

chi3f

iTrader: (3)

Buying a car? yea i insure my car however i did not buy my car and ship it through UPS. You never once said hey i don't normally put insurance on the item even though it's $2369, do you want it? IT is the SELLERS responsibility until i sign for it. I didn't sign for it because it never even got close to my house, it never even left the state you shipped it from.

HUNTER02SS

iTrader: (24)

You are incorrect!!! It is my responsibility until it leave's my hands and is in UPS hand's. After that it is UPS's responsibility. UPS LOST IT. I shipped it!!!!

chi3f

iTrader: (3)

YOU signed the contract with ups. UPS is not responsible because YOU didn't put insurance on it. As far as ups is concerned i am a "3rd" party and have nothing to do with it. That is why they shipped YOU the money, that is why if they ever happen to find it they will ship it to YOU. That is why paypal also says YOU are responsible. I paid you for a transmission, got nothing but a headache and a lot lighter wallet.

Josh@KY-Turbo

iTrader: (120)

This is very wrong.

Look into the Federal freight by-laws. UPS, Fed-EX, Postal services ect....

Seller transfers ownership of said sold Property when when said Property is released to the shipper. At that point it is the Property of the buyer, and the reposibility of the shipper to deliver the buyer said Property to them. At no point after the said Property is released to the shipped is the seller responsibel do the said Property.

Chris you need to appeal the decision with paypal and get a lawyer in volved if need be. I have been down this road before on a transmission and you are getting screwed in the ordeal.

chi3f

iTrader: (3)

this is not to be argumentative i'm just going by what paypal, ups and the bank has told me. How is it the buyer is responsible when the buyer didn't sign the contract with ups. UPS clearly stated to me multiple times it is between the shipper and the seller and will not tell me anything about it since it is chris's shipping account. I made it to the 4th supervisor after talking to them for 2 hours and each one said the same thing.

Since UPS deals with this everyday i have a hard time believing they are completely misinforming me.

HUNTER02SS

iTrader: (24)

The reason they are saying I am responsible is due to the fact there was no insurance bought from me by you. If the shoe was on the other foot and I was buying from you, I would have requested insurance to be placed on the item, even if you didn't say a word about it! That's just me. I spend that much money, I myself want to make sure it is insured. If I sell a part to another person, if they want it in 2 days they tell me, I don't ask. You cannot assume that there was insurance placed on a item. It is your money you are spending and you should of made sure that your money would be secured in a event like this was to happen! I apoligize that this happend, but it is out of my hands.

gvzo6

iTrader: (53)

I think you have it backwards, until the buyer recieves the product ,it is your responsabiliy 100% any issue you have with ups is on you not the buyer when we ship product from our company its the shippers responsibility for the insurance not the buyers think about it ,if you buy a product and it gets damaged or lost are you going to pay for it ,absolutley not ,it traces back to the shipper and he needs to have it properly insured ,not the buyer ,that is how it works

chi3f

iTrader: (3)

that's a good thing to know, if you buy something you make sure there is insurance but if you sell something you don't care what happens. Guess what, it's not that easy, and even if i said put insurance on the item i have no way of forcing you to do so.

exactly what paypal and ups both have said. Exactly how it works whenever i receive something either at home or at work. Why do you think you can refuse signing for something. Soon as you sign for it then it is the buyers issue but until then it is the sellers responsibility.

Again i didn't refuse signature it never even made it that far.

HUNTER02SS

iTrader: (24)

All I am saying is this! If I was buying something, I would take it upon myself to Make sure there was insurance on it, especially that amount. The seller which is me, cannot hold every buyers hand, and read the buyers mind, if they want insurance on it or not. It is not my reponsibility to put insurance on every item that is sold! That is a option the buyer has!

bret97gsx

iTrader: (22)

I've sold alot of stuff on here, and ebay, and other forums. If you ship through UPS, insurance is cheap as crap. You are a bad seller is all it boils down to. You seriously think that this guy would drop $2300+ bucks on a transmission and not want you to put insurance on it? Come on be real. I mean man, you are probably MAKING money off this transmission, and you couldnt drop a measly $11.50 for insurance.

I think HUNTER02SS and the OP need to reach some median. I mean its not fair that either party lost there money, but split everything in half and be done with it.

UPS Declared Value Charges


Value Charge

$0.00 to $100.00 FREE

$100.01 to $300.00 $1.50 minimum

$300.01 to $50,000.00 $.50 per $100 of value

$2300 x .50= $11.50

Lesson learned.

HUNTER02SS

iTrader: (24)

I sell alot of stuff on here as well, and I am NOT A BAD SELLER!
If the buyer wants to take a chance with UPS and not tell me they want the extra insurance on the item to COVER THERE INVESTMENT, that is up to them, not me! I do not babysit buyer's. If they want something , they ask for it.! If they don't ask, not my fault! Like I said, if I was buying the product and spending that much money, I would of made sure there was insurance on the item, and definatly not leave it up to the seller. I did my part, I recieved the money and shipped the product out in a timely manner to the buyer!

bret97gsx

iTrader: (22)

I retract my statement that you are a bad seller, youre right. You did ship the item in a timely manner. You just arent a fair and smart seller ( at this point )....

Being a babysitter and a smart man are two different things.

If Ive shipped an expensive item, ive bit the $.50-$15.00 insurance charge just to make life easier. Maybe next time you can do a good deed and insure something if the buyer forgets to tell you to insure it.

FYI, you have to decline insurance at UPS. How did you know that he wanted you to do so without asking? When you make an assumption, you are in the wrong.

HUNTER02SS

iTrader: (24)

Being a smart man is opening your mouth and asking about something that you want, and not relying on other people to care of it.
FYI, the label was printed thru PAYPAL, not at UPS!!The reason no insurance was added was the buyer did not tell me to add it! Also, The buyer seen in the pic that I posted of the container the tranny was going to be shipped in, the buyer ASKED me if I would change out the container to a better suited one , that way he(buyer) would feel more comfortable about it being shipped and not get damaged! I said no problem and I did that for him.
Obviously he was worried about it being damaged, and he ASKED and I accomadated for him. He did not ASK about insurance, therfore no accomodation was made for it!
And you are correct, the buyer made a assumption and he was in the wrong!!

chi3f

iTrader: (3)

I didn't ask you to swap out the container, you did that on your own. I have the messages which i just read over. you said YOU didn't like how they shipped it so YOU went and got another container. That was nice of you i agree. The shipping container has nothing to do with what is going on. it still doesn't change the fact that the transmission never made it here which paypal says you are liable for. Like i said previously UPS says i'm a 3rd party and it is your responsibility. You made the contract with them.

As far as making an assumption you are correct. I did assume you would put insurance on the transmission. You assumed i didn't want it. Again, that doesn't change the fact that there is no transmission. I didn't know there was no insurance on it so how did i take a chance by not putting it on, you took the chance, or we wouldn't be at this point. How many times do you need to repeat the same thing? How many times do i?

PAYPAL SAYS YOUR LIABLE FOR THE AMOUNT I PAID FOR THE TRANSMISSION. what more needs to be said?

gvzo6

iTrader: (53)

he is absolutly liable ,you paid for the trans and did not get it ,thats the bottom line,he knows its his fault its just BS runaround and excuses you are gettin from him ,he played russian rulett not insuring it and the gun went off

chi3f

iTrader: (3)

I just read through all the paypal user agreement and it clearly states that if you do not receive a package you paid for it is the sellers responsibility. The more people i talk to (ups)(paypal) and the more i read, the shipping insurance is more for the shipper then the buyer. So telling me it is my fualt for not telling him to put shipping insurance on it is complete garbage when that is more for his benefit to begin with.

gvzo6

iTrader: (53)

you are absolutly correct ,i have sold several items on ls1tech and there is no way i would sell someone a $2300 trans and not insure it ,ups usually does not lose things ,but it seems in your case they did he is 100% responsible for that trans getting to you ,he blew it and does not want to man up for his oversite check with any venders that ship expensive product I bet they all insure there product good luck

cablebandit

iTrader: (37)

my feeling is that whomever paid for the shipping is responsible for adding insurance since they would be taking on that responsibility. It sux for both parties involved. Both of you are dumb asses for not making sure that insurance wasnt on it.