WTF - 57rwhp form a 100 wet shot (Dyno chart inside)
03-05-2010, 12:31 PM
#61
2.Im just saying if it comes to me getting another degree or two of timing with a little richer tune I think i would go that route as long as there are no signs of knock(detonation) and it makes more power.If it doesnt give more power than there is no use in the timing anyway.
3.At my track the return road is probably 3 times as long as the track and most of us dont have pit crews and golf carts to drag us around.
You didnt say to forget the wideband but it was said.And I agree with the rest of your statement.
And sorry to the OP,IM done.
3.At my track the return road is probably 3 times as long as the track and most of us dont have pit crews and golf carts to drag us around.
You didnt say to forget the wideband but it was said.And I agree with the rest of your statement.
And sorry to the OP,IM done.
2.holy **** batman if your using knock to tune n2o go out to the garage get a BFH and smach your laptop.
3,4,5,6,7,8,X . If your not willing to do it right dont do it...
03-05-2010, 12:38 PM
#62
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the point was they were telling someone who wouldnt have a clue to forget his wideband and just read the plugs
would you recommend that?if so then i would say you are no smarter than my 5 yr old son
Dave put it better than anyone,you have to account for someone's know how before you go telling them **** like forget your wideband and read your plugs or yeah you can run a nitrous a/f in the high 12's
the OP clearly is not like you guys-he has a street car that im sure he would like to get tuned safely and not on the edge at any time he goes wot on the spray
now can we let this die or do you guys want to keep dragging it out
03-05-2010, 12:45 PM
#63
I would tell them to use the god damn internet and do 30 minutes of reading and you will see what to look for on plugs. or like 30 guys last year post the pics and some of the guys here who know have no issue giving free advice on the tune. you will even get a few different opinions.
I like dave and hes good at what he does and i repect his opinion. But we can disagree. I believe 11.anything is to rich and mid 12's is not on any edge at all. I had a 500 shot on pump gas, atv had 400 dry on pump gas. My brother had a 10.5 150 shot cam only car at 3700lbs, stock rear, stock tranny. Wep ut a stock short block in the 9's with 150,000 miles. the list goes on and on. We have plenty of stock experiance. these were all stock pcm tuned.
Your not the OP and its not your call to let anything die. Feel free to move along...
I like dave and hes good at what he does and i repect his opinion. But we can disagree. I believe 11.anything is to rich and mid 12's is not on any edge at all. I had a 500 shot on pump gas, atv had 400 dry on pump gas. My brother had a 10.5 150 shot cam only car at 3700lbs, stock rear, stock tranny. Wep ut a stock short block in the 9's with 150,000 miles. the list goes on and on. We have plenty of stock experiance. these were all stock pcm tuned.
Your not the OP and its not your call to let anything die. Feel free to move along...
03-05-2010, 12:53 PM
#64
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I would tell them to use the god damn internet and do 30 minutes of reading and you will see what to look for on plugs. or like 30 guys last year post the pics and some of the guys here who know have no issue giving free advice on the tune. you will even get a few different opinions.
I like dave and hes good at what he does and i repect his opinion. But we can disagree. I believe 11.anything is to rich and mid 12's is not on any edge at all. I had a 500 shot on pump gas, atv had 400 dry on pump gas. My brother had a 10.5 150 shot cam only car at 3700lbs, stock rear, stock tranny. Wep ut a stock short block in the 9's with 150,000 miles. the list goes on and on. We have plenty of stock experiance. these were all stock pcm tuned.
Your not the OP and its not your call to let anything die. Feel free to move along...
I like dave and hes good at what he does and i repect his opinion. But we can disagree. I believe 11.anything is to rich and mid 12's is not on any edge at all. I had a 500 shot on pump gas, atv had 400 dry on pump gas. My brother had a 10.5 150 shot cam only car at 3700lbs, stock rear, stock tranny. Wep ut a stock short block in the 9's with 150,000 miles. the list goes on and on. We have plenty of stock experiance. these were all stock pcm tuned.
Your not the OP and its not your call to let anything die. Feel free to move along...
OP let us know how it goes when u get back on the dyno
03-05-2010, 02:21 PM
#65
Open or closed loop has nothing to do with it. cut the car off at the stripe and look at the plugs.....
BTW a lean idle will not burn off anything. pull your plugs after idling and ill pull mine aft6er a 1/4 trip and ill bett 100.00 yours are grey to black and mine look like new. the problem with idle is to cloud the plugs/brown them not clean them up it covers the fuel ring and makes it unreadable.
BTW a lean idle will not burn off anything. pull your plugs after idling and ill pull mine aft6er a 1/4 trip and ill bett 100.00 yours are grey to black and mine look like new. the problem with idle is to cloud the plugs/brown them not clean them up it covers the fuel ring and makes it unreadable.
I think we basically said the same thing here. If you let the car switch from Open Loop to Closed Loop, you will get a distorted reading. Yes you are right the best way to insure you do not distort the plugs for reading is to shut the car off right after the pass, regardless if you have the tune set up to be Open Loop all the time or not. If you drive the car in Open Loop back to the pit before you pull the plug, the plug reading will be distorted. I think we are saying the same thing. We are just presenting it in different ways.
I do have one honest question about reading plugs. I hope you will take the time to make me understand. When data logging the pass with a Wide Band I can see were in the rpm band that I am rich or lean of my target, so I can correct those areas. Is there a way to determine the same thing when reading the plugs?
03-05-2010, 02:55 PM
#66
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I do have one honest question about reading plugs. I hope you will take the time to make me understand. When data logging the pass with a Wide Band I can see were in the rpm band that I am rich or lean of my target, so I can correct those areas. Is there a way to determine the same thing when reading the plugs?
I do have one honest question about reading plugs. I hope you will take the time to make me understand. When data logging the pass with a Wide Band I can see were in the rpm band that I am rich or lean of my target, so I can correct those areas. Is there a way to determine the same thing when reading the plugs?
What you need to make sure of is that your A/F readings match up with what the plug is telling you. We know what 13.0 A/F looks like on our plugs compared to 12.5. Alot of 02 sensors read a little different so make sure your readings match the plugs.
So once you determine that you want 12.5 A/F (for example) than you can shoot for that across the RPM range and trust that its right.
Hope I explained it right, makes sense in my head anyways ... LOL
03-05-2010, 03:06 PM
#67
I think we basically said the same thing here. If you let the car switch from Open Loop to Closed Loop, you will get a distorted reading. Yes you are right the best way to insure you do not distort the plugs for reading is to shut the car off right after the pass, regardless if you have the tune set up to be Open Loop all the time or not. If you drive the car in Open Loop back to the pit before you pull the plug, the plug reading will be distorted. I think we are saying the same thing. We are just presenting it in different ways.
I do have one honest question about reading plugs. I hope you will take the time to make me understand. When data logging the pass with a Wide Band I can see were in the rpm band that I am rich or lean of my target, so I can correct those areas. Is there a way to determine the same thing when reading the plugs?
I do have one honest question about reading plugs. I hope you will take the time to make me understand. When data logging the pass with a Wide Band I can see were in the rpm band that I am rich or lean of my target, so I can correct those areas. Is there a way to determine the same thing when reading the plugs?
No not at all points but withut looking at a plug what a/f do you randomly target? our same car with different heads and or cam has like A/f ranging from 13.0-13.4 i know most will think im crazy...
Also 1 wide band is just an avg of that side of the motor. and we all know #8 and number 2 want 2 different things. We use a wideband as a refrence but we look at every plug every run. we also move our wideband around to different holes then the avg so we have alot of data and can make an educated guess as to what the a/f is and what the plug will look like.
03-05-2010, 03:24 PM
#68
Thank makes sense to me, thanks for the response. I have seen two different WB read as much as 1 afr difference (AEM as compared to NGK) and I have always wondered which is right, I can see how the plugs would be the ideal way to determine which one to trust. I also like to use EGT's to help feel comfortable with the WB. I for one am not an expert at reading plugs, I would say I only know the basics to plug reading. I will be bugging you guys latter trying to learn more on this subject.
To the OP, sorry for temporarily highjacking your thread.
Thanks guys for the help.
To the OP, sorry for temporarily highjacking your thread.
Thanks guys for the help.
04-16-2010, 07:01 PM
#69
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