Quickin

I'm getting my ARE 436 in about a week. I was wondering for future plans.

And what kind of system?

It's an aluminum block.

Thanks

Postal

Is the motor being built for n20 use or N/A? Why don't you just ask Nick? He's the one building it, get the 411 straight from the horses mouth.

Quickin

Sounds logical, he's just so busy right now I thought I would ask all of you. It was built for N/A use. I lose my warranty if I use any power adders, but in a couple years I may do it because I'm sure I'll have a new one built so I always have a warranty.

I assume a small shot like 100 HP wouldn't hurt, right?

Onyx LS1

iTrader: (5)

You could go much bigger than that, just make sure your fuel system can handle it.

Quickin

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Onyx LS1:
[QB]You could go much bigger than that, just make sure your fuel system can handle it.
__________________________________________________

Well, assuming I put the correct injectors in and whatnot, how big could I go without killing the engine too much? 250? 300?

1320

iTrader: (6)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Quickin:
<strong>[QUOTE]Originally posted by Onyx LS1:
[QB]You could go much bigger than that, just make sure your fuel system can handle it.
__________________________________________________

Well, assuming I put the correct injectors in and whatnot, how big could I go without killing the engine too much? 250? 300?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Too much? Hey, if you burn a hole in one piston you mine as well burn em all.....your not ussually gonna replace just one.....

And....let me get this straight.....your getting a 436 built by are, for na use and before you even get it...your asking about n2o use?
Personally its insulting to Nick and ARE to go ask other opinions after you have committed to them.....

One of the biggest problems with people building cars is getting info from different sources....A lot of people build great engines and cars....but if you combine them together you get a horrible mess.........I might build a killer engine......Nick builds a killer engine......but that doesn t mean we could build a killer engine........ARE knows there enigine......and there opinion is the only one that counts.....not even other are engines should matter.....yours could be different.....

Quickin

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by 1320:
<strong>[QUOTE]Originally posted by Quickin:
[qb][QUOTE]Originally posted by Onyx LS1:
[QB]You could go much bigger than that, just make sure your fuel system can handle it.
__________________________________________________

Well, assuming I put the correct injectors in and whatnot, how big could I go without killing the engine too much? 250? 300?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Too much? Hey, if you burn a hole in one piston you mine as well burn em all.....your not ussually gonna replace just one.....

And....let me get this straight.....your getting a 436 built by are, for na use and before you even get it...your asking about n2o use?
Personally its insulting to Nick and ARE to go ask other opinions after you have committed to them.....

One of the biggest problems with people building cars is getting info from different sources....A lot of people build great engines and cars....but if you combine them together you get a horrible mess.........I might build a killer engine......Nick builds a killer engine......but that doesn t mean we could build a killer engine........ARE knows there enigine......and there opinion is the only one that counts.....not even other are engines should matter.....yours could be different.....
__________________________________________________

I knew I should have just dropped this subject. Believe me when I tell you, "1320", if anyone was to add an NOS system to my engine it would be Nick or someone that he approved. Nick's just a tad busy right now, I only wanted to get an idea about the size and type of system I "MAY" want to go with in the distant future. I don't plan on having just one engine, I plan to have others built very soon.

I was just trying to learn about NOS, I wasn't trying to, and didn't insult anyone.

rich

You have to rember n/a engines are built real light so they can't handle the presure. If your spending the money just have him build it for n2o.If I spent that much $$ I wouldn't want to burn it up tring to do something that it wasn't designed to do.Get the right tool for the job so to speak.

DJ's Z

iTrader: (10)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> Too much? Hey, if you burn a hole in one piston you mine as well burn em all.....your not ussually gonna replace just one.....

And....let me get this straight.....your getting a 436 built by are, for na use and before you even get it...your asking about n2o use?
Personally its insulting to Nick and ARE to go ask other opinions after you have committed to them.....

One of the biggest problems with people building cars is getting info from different sources....A lot of people build great engines and cars....but if you combine them together you get a horrible mess.........I might build a killer engine......Nick builds a killer engine......but that doesn t mean we could build a killer engine........ARE knows there enigine......and there opinion is the only one that counts.....not even other are engines should matter.....yours could be different..... </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"><img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> 1320, what the hell was that all about??? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

All he was asking was a couple of simple questions about NOS. In my book the more information you have about something the more you'll be able to make rational and intelligent choices about what direction you may want to go in...Damn !
Quickin, to try and answer your question with out knowing too much about your motor, ie. compression, fuel set up, timing, etc. I would not run anymore than a 200 shot if that much with everything PERFECT and correct A/F ratio. The one problem I've been told is the possibility of our "LS1" heads lifting off the block with too much cylinder pressure. What internals have been installed also will play a part in strength of your short blk. Definatley check with ARE, as I'm sure you will, when and if you get to that point and see what Nick says. Good Luck !

<small>[ April 09, 2002, 06:35 PM: Message edited by: DJ's99SS ]</small>

1320

iTrader: (6)

I m sorry.....

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Sad]" src="gr_sad.gif" />

Why ask the question that way? Now its possible he'll go to Nick and say , hey a guy in TX with a 422 said 200 would be ok....Do you really think Nick wants to hear that? The really funny part is.......two fold......one not hurting it to much? What is that......sounds like being sorta pregnant?

Second , you give an opinion of 200 shot even knowing that you don t know anything about that particular engine? And you want to help him make an edjucated decision? How exactly? It looks like 200 would be ok for anything with pistons.......

Im sorry I really didn t mean to offend anyone.......I guess sometimes you can do that by accident.. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

On the up side......if one can afford more then one engine......does it really matter if one gets hurt at all...

Again sorry for the perceived attitude.

383LQ4SS

iTrader: (33)

1320....you have some valid points...just kinda came off a little strong <img border="0" alt="[judgement]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_judge.gif" />

Its ok to ask advice...hell we all do it...and give it from time to time. But On an unkown quantity such as your new ARE motor it would be very difficult to give an exact answer on how much Nitrous you could spray on the limited knowledge we have of your build up. Especially since you are looking for the max number. Definately ask Nick...I know he is difficult to get a hold of...trust me I know <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

I would just say that it is likely that you will be able to spray in excess of a 100 shot. Wether or not Nick says a 200 is ok....only he can answer that. Did you get ARP head studs? As mentioned I think your limiting factor will be head lifting. I have lifted my heads a few times. Once during detonation and once spraying a 325 shot(accidentally <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="gr_eek2.gif" /> Sorry Nick!).

<small>[ April 09, 2002, 11:03 PM: Message edited by: 383LQ4SS ]</small>

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

My ARE 422ci iron block motor is built for nitrous, and can take 200-300, 225+ would have to be in the form of a direct port fogger. I have nitrous oriented piston rings as an example.

I would think that your new motor would take 100 shot but ask the builder at some point. Or build it towards nitrous like me.

xxxhp

I guess that 100 -150 shot should be no problem on the engine assuming that other parameters like proper fuel delivery, retarded timing & high octane gas are available.

You can choose to have the motor built for Nitrous, but in this case you might give up about 20 rwhp while running the motor NA due to the different camshaft & less overall motor compression.

After all, a 436 motor with 150 shot should be capable of low 10s - high 9s. Good enough? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="gr_eek2.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

<small>[ April 10, 2002, 12:36 AM: Message edited by: xxxhp ]</small>

Quickin

I'm learning there's a hell-of-allot-to-know about NOS!

This is my first badass motor, I always wanted N/A only but NOS has me interested.

Thanks for the insight/wake up call about NOS, maybe the next motor.

DJ's Z

iTrader: (10)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> Second , you give an opinion of 200 shot even knowing that you don t know anything about that particular engine? And you want to help him make an edjucated decision? How exactly? It looks like 200 would be ok for anything with pistons.......</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"><img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> 1320, did you even read my post ? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> Quickin, to try and answer your question with out knowing too much about your motor, ie. compression, fuel set up, timing, etc. I would not run anymore than a 200 shot if that much with everything PERFECT and correct A/F ratio. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> Definatley check with ARE, as I'm sure you will, when and if you get to that point and see what Nick says. Good Luck !
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"><img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="gr_images/icons/mad.gif" /> You seem awfully quick to jump on someone's *** without thouroughly reading their response to a question !! How many NOS motors have you had over the past 19 years ? Thought so...

1320

iTrader: (6)

I guess I just comprehended your responce differently then you intended it. You see thats why I quoted you, so you could see what I saw as a direct contradiction.....giving and opinion of 200 and then going back and giving another one....of talking with the builder? Gee seems like the safe, most edjucated move is to talk to the builder....I tried to make that point and show my reasons why......

And as to how many nos motors Ive built in the last 19 years? Thats is first and foremost ridicuolous....but sometimes poeple ask ridiculous questions..... Why not 20? Would that throw you off? Why not 10 years? And in any case why would that have any bearing on what you stated you don t know? You said that you didn t know anything about his engine? But you, after (apparently 19 years) of building engines can tell with out even looking at his on what it can do.....That is incredble! I hope to aspire to be that knowledgeable someday, until then I ll just have go with facts.

Hmmm back to the ? 19 years? I have lost count.... How many blown 4 valve v8 chevies have you built.......? I actually have a number , you?

I know it doesn t have anything to do with it but.......or how much nitorous have you used? Still no relavence but.......how about turbo bikes? I know it doesn t matter ........

oh oh I got a good one, how many cars do you own now (currently ) that have nos? It doesn t have anything to do with his engine or what it can take, but my number is like 10 or so about....currently......not over 19 years.....

Man, all I said is talk to the BUILDER.....and why I thought that......

383LQ4SS

iTrader: (33)

Ok...back on topic please <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

Quickin

Damn, I guess I should only ask a question about the LS1 when I have cash in hand and I'm ready to start building something the next day.

Getting info ain't what it used to be.

And I guess once (and if) I'm ever ready for an NOS beast, I won't need to come here because the person building it will have all the info. I have learned that it will most likely be an iron block, so I have learned something so far.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

<small>[ April 10, 2002, 08:14 PM: Message edited by: Quickin ]</small>

Teddy D

I think a very important point on NOS that no one is touching on is detonation. This will apply to a turbo or, supercharged motor as well. It is my understanding that the number one killer of a boosted motor(NOS included) is detonation, and or lean condition. When people say you can run this or you can run that, it is not a all inclusive statement. There is someone out there who has run in the 10's with a 300 shot of NOS and a stock engine. From what I have seen this all leads back to using racing fuel and big enough injectors and fuel fump, with proper translator tunning. If I am wrong, please let me have it, if not then it would be good for some of the ls1 guys to realize these principles. This could be very useful for taking a stock motor with NOS to low 11's on a budget. The major expense is the racing fuel, it's kinda like paying off the horsepower a little at a time. If people doubt what I am saying call TNT and they will say the same thing.

383LQ4SS

iTrader: (33)

No...you are correct. However I believe when someone here sais that you may be able to run XXX shot on your setup its usually assumed that the person installing and running it will take the necessary precautions to fight detonation. Running race gas and retarding timing to suit if necessary. If someone knew the magical point where detonation would occur Im sure they would share that info. Problem is with the multitude of LS1 configurations, cubes, strokes, iron block, alum block, comp ratios, type of fuel, size of shot, type of kit, coupled with the fact that people are still learning the quirks of LS1s...theres no way to exactly predict that. You can only try to make a prediction keeping on the conservative side.

I think the discussion here was more of the mechanical aspect than tuning. I certainly would have no idea what kind of tune would make that 436 ci ARE motor go.