Danny

iTrader: (16)

Hey guys,

I'm so pissed right now. All this body work and prep work I've been doing for the past weeks might have gone to waste. I just finished all the body work on my car and started painting yesterday around 3pm. Temp outside was around 78 degrees. I applied 3 coats of base reduced 1:1 with nothing else added. I allowed 10-15 mins for flash time. Then I sprayed 3 coats of clear...4:1 clear/hardner, 10% reducer and nothing else added. Again i allowed 10-15 mins for flash. I was shooting out of a 1.4 tip. The temp in my booth was about 80-85 degrees +/-. Everything looked good at first. Then once I was finished spraying the clear I went outside to take a break and let it sit. I came back 5 mins later and started noticing that I was getting cracks all over the car. 1/4 panels, jams, engine bay, everywhere...

Here's a few pics. What do you think went wrong???





I don't get it. I've sprayed a few panels here and there, but never an entire car, and this never happened.

Too much hardner in the clear for the temp in the booth?
Not enough flash time between coats of either base or clear?
Base coat wasn't dry enough to apply clear coat?
Not enough flash time?

This happened last night BTW.

Now today I went back in my garage and wet sanded a spot on the core support with 800 grit that had the cracks. I sanded all the clear off and noticed that the base still looked cracked but was smooth now. So I'm thinking the cracks were in the base coat because I can still see the cracks but I cannot feel them. I mean it's smooth as glass.

Here is what I need to know...
What went wrong?
Can I simply wet sand the entire surface down to the base with 800 grit until it's smooth as glass and start and apply 3 new coats of base and clear?
Or will everything need to be sanded all the way down, sealed once again and apply paint?

Any and all help will be greatly appreciated guys. Thanks in advance.

6898camaross

Did you use the same brand materials?

Danny

iTrader: (16)

I'll check tomorrow but I'm pretty sure the clear, reducer and hardner were all the same brand. I'm not too sure on the paint. I'm sure it was mixed up there at the paint store.

98camarols1

iTrader: (1)

Tht defently looks like wrong reducer or hardner was used.post wht u exactly used.and imo i would sand down with 600 to c if cracks smooth out.if not then keep stepping down the grit til cracks are gone.and it would be gud idea to prime it.

00ultraz28

iTrader: (2)

It lifted on you ... this normally happens in the basecoat ... its most always a matter of too much material going on too fast .... how long was your flash between your last coat of color and your first coat of clear... it usually happens to me if I'm doing a repair to a freshly painted panel or im painting over a panel that's been repaired poorly once before ... the hot solvent from the fresh paint gets under the older paint and causes it to lift ... I wouldn't fool with anything finer than 320

00ultraz28

iTrader: (2)

To start the repair ... let it set good and sand it out ... I had one that I couldn't get to stop lifting no matter how slow I went ... I ended up using a water-borne primer to put a barrier between substrate and fresh paint ... most paint companies have a basecoat hardener that you can add to the base to help with this

Danny

iTrader: (16)

Ok guys here are the products I used.

This is the paint and the reducer...


This is the clear and the hardener...


One thing I also want to point out is that I was shooting @ around 50PSI. I know, I know...that's higher than normal but for some reason when I would set the gun @ 35PSI it would spit the paint out. It looked shitty. So I cranked up the pressure and it started to atomize the paint much better.

So should I sand down passed the base coat? I'm sure I'll need to re-seal the car since the sealer is pretty thin.

custombluebird

looks like you didnt prep good like scuff down the car or didnt clean it with a wax and degreaser or it could be a chemical reaction

Danny

iTrader: (16)

I did scuff it down good. I used a red 3M scuffing pad and I washed it down with soap. Then right before I painted I cleaned it with wax and grease remover. So I know it's not a cleansing issue.

xBrandonx

iTrader: (11)

Sorry lol but that looks horrible!!!

Try shooting it on a similar material and see what happens (not on the car for oblivious reasons)


When I painted my front end, we sprayed 4 coats of everything on with less than 5 minutes between each coat. We let the coats sit for 30 minutes before going to the next step (primer ---> basecoat ---> clear)... so drying time shouldn't really be an issue here?


It might be a clear or base defect from searching online with similar issues.

00ultraz28

iTrader: (2)

There's a lot that affects it ..humidity, air flow, air pressure, reducer temps, activater temps.... this stuff happens ... I paint everyday and it still happens to me ... like I said it usually happens in the base. Ill get in a hurry and get a little heavy,walk out and it looks great ... walk back in and its started wrinkling. ... its hard to say without being there for the whole process .. and I'm not familiar with that paint line ... sealers can be very picky too ... some have very very strict flash times ... like a fifteen minute window in PERFECT conditions .. less if its hotter than normal ... I've seen paint sheet off of sealer because it sat too long ... I played with sealers for a while before I settled into what I'm using now ... I use southern polyurethane industry's epoxy as a sealer.

98camarols1

iTrader: (1)

i used the same dimension base-coat for my car.and tht is not the right reducer for tht base-coat.you have to use the SAME dimension reducer.where did you get your base-coat and clear?because sometime some salesman will bullshit you to sell their product and tell u can use clear reducer.i been situation in this situation.and did u use same reducer for base-coat and clear?

Danny

iTrader: (16)

Well, I've talked to a few different people about this issue and here's the responses I've got.

I asked the guy at my paint store, which says he has 25yrs in this industry. After telling him how I prepped everything he said that I should not have sanded the sealer that was put on a few days prior. I told him I needed to scuff it since I sprayed it a few days ago. He says if I needed to sand the sealer I should have laid a new coat on top of that prior to laying my base coat. He said that was one issue.

He sprayed a test panel for me and it came out good with no issues. So the material is all good.

I then asked a professional painter and he thinks that the base coat was not dry enough for the clear. He says that when he sprays base he waits hrs to apply the clear coat.

To tell you guys the truth I'm confused as f*ck. I started sanding down all the new base/clear.

Danny

iTrader: (16)

I got all my supplies from the same paint store. I don't think he was selling me the wrong supplies. The only reason why I say is because he told me today to bring everything back in. He sprayed a small test panel with the same supplies I brought back and it came out great. So I'm pretty sure those materials work well with each other.

00ultraz28

iTrader: (2)

Go back ... ask him for the procedure pages for the material ... I never wait hours for base to dry .... the more I think about the more I'm leaning towards you having an issue with the base adhering to the sealer... sealer isn't 100 percent necessary ... I would sand it all flat with 320 ... a coat or two of a good 2k primer ...wet sand it with 600,doing my best not to break through the primer ... wax and grease remove it and base right over that ... with no sealer... good generous flash times and maybe even do a tack coat on your first coat of clear and then 2 or 3 full wet coats.

98camarols1

iTrader: (1)

if your using dimension sealer then wht i usually do 1 coat of sealer and withing 30 mins 2 coats of base-coat(15-20mins) giving proper flash time.(its called wet-on-wet application)then let it sit overnight next day remove any nibs or imperfections then do last coat.and wait 30 mins or so then clear.i had the similar problem once thts because the sales guy told me to use clear reducer.and try shooting around 20psi.wht gun are you using?

00ultraz28

iTrader: (2)

A lot of times the same reducer is used for the base, clear, and primers...I use the same urethane reducer in all of mine (stays within the system)

98camarols1

iTrader: (1)

i agree with u on tht but in my case the guy sold me some off brand clear and dimension base-coat.

00ultraz28

iTrader: (2)

Gotcha.... its always nice to stay inside a paint system as much as possible ... it cuts down on a lot of the what ifs when something like this happens.

Nick V.

iTrader: (1)

i think it looked kinda cool, but probably wouldnt on a whole car.

hope you get it fixed man, goodluck