May 10, 2016, 02:15 PM
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Bubbling Sail Panel Issue for Dummies
It isn't a hard and fast date however. My old 98 was a June build date and it had no signs of bubbles at all, and it was stored outside in all kinds of weather for years. Given the condition of the rest of the car I highly doubt anyone had done anything to the roof panel before I got it.
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 34,647
Likes: 2,573
From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
Also, the change doesn't appear to have anything to do with the glue, but rather the prep process on the underside of the panel (lack of paint/primer between the glue and the panel on late model panels). So far this seems to be the only difference that has been noted by people removing the panels.
Last edited by RPM WS6; Aug 9, 2012 at 03:11 AM.
I think I might have missed it, but what is the best glue to use when you replace the panel? 6le recommends three different urethane designed to replace windshields.
Can we get the initial post in this sticky updated to have a bullet list of the important info like this so people will stop adding posts every day asking things that are answered somewhere in this massive pile of postings? Better yet, replace this 7 year old book with a concise locked sticky posting with all the important info/history about this issue. You'll save yourself a lot of time.
Regards,
me
Can we get the initial post in this sticky updated to have a bullet list of the important info like this so people will stop adding posts every day asking things that are answered somewhere in this massive pile of postings? Better yet, replace this 7 year old book with a concise locked sticky posting with all the important info/history about this issue. You'll save yourself a lot of time.
Regards,
me
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 34,647
Likes: 2,573
From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
I think I might have missed it, but what is the best glue to use when you replace the panel? 6le recommends three different urethane designed to replace windshields.
Can we get the initial post in this sticky updated to have a bullet list of the important info like this so people will stop adding posts every day asking things that are answered somewhere in this massive pile of postings? Better yet, replace this 7 year old book with a concise locked sticky posting with all the important info/history about this issue. You'll save yourself a lot of time.
Regards,
me
Can we get the initial post in this sticky updated to have a bullet list of the important info like this so people will stop adding posts every day asking things that are answered somewhere in this massive pile of postings? Better yet, replace this 7 year old book with a concise locked sticky posting with all the important info/history about this issue. You'll save yourself a lot of time.
Regards,
me
However, I will not lock the thread, as we don't need new threads popping up every few weeks about this issue. If people want to discuss their roof replacement project, ask questions, etc., this thread is the place to do that - and it will contiue to be so.
As for the glues, I will post the info from the TSB that GM issued in the summary that I put together.
However, I will not lock the thread, as we don't need new threads popping up every few weeks about this issue. If people want to discuss their roof replacement project, ask questions, etc., this thread is the place to do that - and it will contiue to be so.
As for the glues, I will post the info from the TSB that GM issued in the summary that I put together.
As for the glues, I will post the info from the TSB that GM issued in the summary that I put together.
Thank you for the help!
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Verdad Gallardo Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 34,647
Likes: 2,573
From: Schiller Park, ILL Member: #317
Below is the summary that has replaced the first post of this thread:
***Summary of Issue as of 8/9/2012***
4th gen F-body sail panels are adhered to the body of the car using glue (urethane). The bubbling sail panel paint issue is due to this glue seeping through the panel and causing bubbles along the surface of the panel. The reason for the seepage seems to be due to the lack of paint/epoxy primer on the underside of the panel, a process change which started at GM on very late '98 cars (05/98 and later are at risk) and affected all '99+ models. This allows the glue to directly contact the panel and seep into it over time. Heat/UV exposure seems to bring the glue through the panel once it's begun to seep.
Sanding/painting/bondo'ing/etc. will not fix this condition. Complete panel replacement is the only permanent fix. Once the glue has eaten into the panel, there is no way to correct this from the top side. The problem lies underneath, and nothing you do on top is going to change this. The only other option would be to never drive the car in sunlight.
This panel was discontinued by GM several years ago. At this point, your only options for panel replacement are:
There is a GM TSB out about this issue, but this is NOT a recall. Here is a link to the post containing the original TSB:
https://ls1tech.com/forums/2783967-post2.html
There was an updated TSB issued in April of 2003, but the only scanned file of this I can find is currently not working (on page 35 of this thread). If someone has a scanned copy of this 4-2-03 revision, feel free to post it in this thread, and I will link it to this summary. Having said that, the repair process is the same between the two TSBs.
Glues that have been approved via the GM TSB for new roof application:
- U400 HV Essex (Dow)
- 3M Urethane 08690
Rarely, some customers were able to get GM or their dealer to cover the cost of replacing the panel, but this is no longer an option as GM doesn't stock the part and won't pay to locate/obtain/install a reproduction or used panel. The last person I've heard about that was able to get GM to cover the repair did so in or around 2008.
- RPM WS6
***Summary of Issue as of 8/9/2012***
4th gen F-body sail panels are adhered to the body of the car using glue (urethane). The bubbling sail panel paint issue is due to this glue seeping through the panel and causing bubbles along the surface of the panel. The reason for the seepage seems to be due to the lack of paint/epoxy primer on the underside of the panel, a process change which started at GM on very late '98 cars (05/98 and later are at risk) and affected all '99+ models. This allows the glue to directly contact the panel and seep into it over time. Heat/UV exposure seems to bring the glue through the panel once it's begun to seep.
Sanding/painting/bondo'ing/etc. will not fix this condition. Complete panel replacement is the only permanent fix. Once the glue has eaten into the panel, there is no way to correct this from the top side. The problem lies underneath, and nothing you do on top is going to change this. The only other option would be to never drive the car in sunlight.
This panel was discontinued by GM several years ago. At this point, your only options for panel replacement are:
- New reproduction panel from site sponsor 6LE (fiberglass or carbon fiber)
- Used panel from a donor 4th gen car built prior to 05/98 (and yes, an LT1 era car panel will fit and work just fine)
- Have a custom panel made by a body shop that is good with fiberglass fabrication
There is a GM TSB out about this issue, but this is NOT a recall. Here is a link to the post containing the original TSB:
https://ls1tech.com/forums/2783967-post2.html
There was an updated TSB issued in April of 2003, but the only scanned file of this I can find is currently not working (on page 35 of this thread). If someone has a scanned copy of this 4-2-03 revision, feel free to post it in this thread, and I will link it to this summary. Having said that, the repair process is the same between the two TSBs.
Glues that have been approved via the GM TSB for new roof application:
- U400 HV Essex (Dow)
- 3M Urethane 08690
Rarely, some customers were able to get GM or their dealer to cover the cost of replacing the panel, but this is no longer an option as GM doesn't stock the part and won't pay to locate/obtain/install a reproduction or used panel. The last person I've heard about that was able to get GM to cover the repair did so in or around 2008.
- RPM WS6
Ok so i really dont have time look thru 90 pages to see how to change the roof panel on my hardtop car is there a writeup on this? If so can somebody post a link to it? Ive had the roof repainted 1 time and it done it again so im getn the whole car painted and want it fixed rite this time!
have hard top panel if needed don't know your location but if you need a h/t panel, I have a 96 formula. the older panels were ok. pm me if you need it. if it will help you out you can have it cheap, I was going to scrap it with the remains of the car anyway but would like to see it used if possible. if you cant fix em at least use what you can to fix another. "save the birds!" lol.
The body shop that did mine had a windshield company come in and cut it off...it is held on with adhesive just like a windshield, so it seemed like a natural choice. Others have had some luck with piano wire.
Either way, it gets cut off and tossed.
Either way, it gets cut off and tossed.
TECH Resident
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 865
Likes: 1
From: central TX
I will be following these:
https://ls1tech.com/forums/paint-bod...y-version.html
with maybe some backup info from here:
https://ls1tech.com/forums/paint-bod...-yourself.html
https://ls1tech.com/forums/paint-bod...y-version.html
with maybe some backup info from here:
https://ls1tech.com/forums/paint-bod...-yourself.html
bah My whole roof is like this.. You can actually see the Zig Zag lines in the black paint...Couple bubbles that popped and now has grey primer? under it.. I hate that. 83k Miles on my 02 and this is the only major flaw with the car.. Thanks GM.
replacing hardtop skin??????? i got a 2000 camaro that the paint is bubbling on the roof and ive had it painted 1 time and its doing it again. after searching on here i see the only way to fix it is get a lt1 roof and put on it. my ? is i can get a whole top from my salvage yard for 72.00 if i cut it off but my ? is how to get it off the steel frame without tearing it up? ive seen people on here do t top cars but mines a hard top any ideas or is there a write up on this im missing? pictures how to steps or anything? or some body close to 29115 zip code in south carolina i can get to do it?
i got a 2000 camaro that the paint is bubbling on the roof and ive had it painted 1 time and its doing it again. after searching on here i see the only way to fix it is get a lt1 roof and put on it. my ? is i can get a whole top from my salvage yard for 72.00 if i cut it off but my ? is how to get it off the steel frame without tearing it up? ive seen people on here do t top cars but mines a hard top any ideas or is there a write up on this im missing? pictures how to steps or anything? or some body close to 29115 zip code in south carolina i can get to do it?
Staging Lane
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 84
Likes: 6
From: Houston, Texas
I have a 2001 Z 28 that has roof bubble issues and cannot get any body shop in Houston to touch trying to repair the bubbles. Anyone have any suggestions.
Groesbeck
White with t-tops and black roof area between t-tops and rear window.
Groesbeck
White with t-tops and black roof area between t-tops and rear window.