lbz34

iTrader: (3)

Which tables would I adjust for part throttle and cruise on ls1 edit??? I run the car in open loop. Main VE?? Which cells to adjust for idle air fuel?? My car runs 13's on air fiuel at idle. help plz.
Thanks

Bink

Is the car stock??? Mods??
Only use the VE table to lean out at and below Idle RPM.
Try for AFR = 15 at idle. If it hesitates or bogs then richen it up a little.

The part throttle/cruise adjustments are made with the IFR and Stoich table (Fuel Air Multiplier Table).Stoich table AFR = 14.7/table value.
Here is a table, from NoGo- he is the MAN, of desired part throttle/ cruise AFR at operating Temp:

20 kpa - 14.7
25 kpa - 14.5
30 kpa - 14.4
35 kpa - 14.4
40 kpa - 14.3
45 kpa - 14.1
50 kpa - 13.9
55 kpa - 13.8
60 kpa - 13.6
65 kpa - 13.5
70 kpa - 13.2
75 kpa - 13.1
80 kpa - 13.0
85 kpa - 13.0
90 kpa - 13.0
95 kpa - 13.0
100 kpa - 13.0
Lastly, WOT is adjusted with PE of course. Remember- IFR changes effect PE.
Hope this helps some.
joel

lbz34

iTrader: (3)

00 z28 m6.
tap 228/228 .581/.581 111 lsa cam
qtp 1 3/4 header
dual cutouts
ls6 intake
ls1 edit
ford 30 lb injectors
tsp lid
ftra
nossle kit w/separate fuel sys.
ram 910 clutch
thats about it
thanks for the help.
what map numbers correspond to what load???

Bink

Do you have scanner software- EFILive, Auto tap, EASE etc?? You need a wideband O2 to determine AFR.
Scan for MAP (kPa) at varying loadsto determine fuel adjustment needs.
Have you adjusted the IFR table for the 30 lb injectors?? If not you need to first scale the IFR table to correct for increased injector flow rate.
joel

newbie_tace02

I think what you're showing here is MAP (in kpa) not operating temp. Would this table be desired A/F by Manifold Pressure range?

Bink

I'm sorry I guess it's not clear. The Stoich table is AFR @ *c intervals. This is for a 90*C range.
joel

lbz34

iTrader: (3)

Ok so I put in 30 lb injectors. I scale the IFR tale up untill i get relatively close on the A/F at idle/light throttle. Then Which table to tune with for cruise? I would guess Fuel Air Multiplier since I run my car in open loop all the time. Then which table to tune for idle/decel? Main VE? Seems the tables do not even use the MAF.

I do have a OBD 2 scanner/log program, only it logs in inches of mercury. I can convert. I also have a FJO wideband with which to drive the car/tune with. I have dealt with 3-4 other stand alone systems and most others are far easier with which to tune. I just need to know what table does what.


I also have drilled the TB 2 sizes bigger and have a cruise control at speed. I have adjusted all the throttle follower tables and seems to make no changes to the problem. Thanks for the help guys. Keep it comming.

Slowhawk

iTrader: (12)

I would like to know why your running your car in open loop with the minor mods you have?Is it a race only car?

lbz34

iTrader: (3)

Car runs much better in open loop than it does in closed loop. Would do fine for about a minuite then into closed loop, and would go rich. No matter what i did I could not get The A/F to stay where I wanted it 14-1 or so. Disabled open loop and did some tuning and saw a good 14.5-1 A/F hile cruising. I just cant seem to get idle to lean out anymore that 13.5. WOT is the same in either mode open or closed. I have spent countless hours playing with different tables and cannot seem to understand what tables or how to get my idle A/F to come into check.

Can anyne tell me which tables to use.

IFR is x80%
main VE is x90%
AFR (open loop A/F) x90%

These changes have gotten me very close but still nt where I want it.

Have set the throttle follower tables to 0 at 15 mph and up. Still have the cruise effect.

Car is a daily driver.

Any other guru's?????????

Bink

I'm not a Guru but I'll try to help some.The Gurus would be NoGo (of course), Cal, ChrisB and others.

Idle AFR- try leaning out VE some more. Start at idle RPM,or slightly above, scale by 90%. I guess this is what you've done already? Then scale the 800 and 400 RPM range by 80%. See how it does . If still too rich try 1200 RPM * 80%. ........and so on. AFR @ Idle = 15 is a good #.

You need to slowly reduce the values in the decay tables that correspond to the MPH of your "cruise control" effect. This will reduce the Cruise effect.

When you say Open loop AFR do you mean the Fuel Air Multiplier Table (FAM) ?? This table should not be scaled as it's the Target AFR value at part throttle open -loop.
The IFR table would be used to reduce AFR across the board ( in which case you woulkd multiply by 110* and PCM would then reduce pulsewidth by 10%). Th Fuel Air Multiplier table gives the denominator (bottom) valuefor the Target AFR equation....Part Throttle AFR= 14.7/Fuel Air Mult.Value.
So , the values in my above post are simply the AFR values at given kPa.
Make small changes to the FAM Table at individual kPas to finesse your final AFR at that load/kPA.

What are your IACS set at ?? And Idle air (RAF)?? What is idle RPM....how does it do at idle??
Hope this helps some. Good Luck.
joel

lbz34

iTrader: (3)

Thanks Joe helps a lot.


I am going to start from my stock map and start over. I have made so many maps and changes I want to start over. Though my current map seems to run ok.

I have set all the throttle follower tables (3) to 0 above 14 mph.
Idle is at 825
RAF is stock
park position airflow is stock
reset iac park position is stock.

idle will drop comming off of a throttle snap (open)
to about 400 then it will catch.
car does not stall


My big problem is I do not now where in the fuel/ignition map I am at any given load/rpm. Other standalones/piggyback computers you can usually track the car through the fuel/ignition map to see where the car uses the map.

I would guess idle would be up to 30 kpa or so???

Thanks for all the help
Sean

Bink

Since your IAC and Idle Air are stock and you have "cruise control" I would think you overdrilled the TB. No big deal you can tune around it.
T he fact that the idle drops to 400 means it's overshooting your idle target- it's decaying to fast. I think I would go back to stock Throttle Followers and slowly subtract from them. Trial and error. I don't know how the PCM "sees" a zero value in these tables?
*
I'm not familiar with your scanner. I have EFILive and Autotap. You should be able to set "Metric" value for MAP sensor. This will/should give you MAP..kPAunits. *

I do have the FJO WideBand. Setup the Scanner and FJO O2 and start logging at the same time. THEN- start the car so they are synchronized. Now do a run/logging. You can Export both loggings(files), in the csv. format, to Excel (xls.). *

The FJO and Scanner you can coordinate with RPM. Do you have an Aux.sensor...TP or MAP?? This would help in referrencing the two log tables/files ( I set mine up with MAP and it reads ~0-5 volts). The time intervals on the Logs are a big help in following along in the recorded data.
You can then synchronize your two logs giving AFR and MAP and RPM. With these values you can adjust the Fuel Air Multiplier Table and VE . You should only make small changes( 2-3 %) in individual cells in the VE table- so as not to disrupt the overall flow of the table/graph.
Your idle should be in 30 - 40 kPa range .
*
Check out this "Idle" post by NoGo
*
NoGo Idle
Hope this helps some. Good Luck
joel

lbz34

iTrader: (3)

That is by far the best explanatio/idea yet. I do have the logging/rpm for the FJO. I will try that next week.
Thanks

Bink

You're welcome. In the above post I stated INCORRECTLY to subtract from stock decay. Subtracitng will increase the rate of decay . You want to add...this will slow the rate of decay.

Here is an Excellent explanation, by NoGo- about half way through this threadNoGo and decay explanation
Sorry, for the screw up...it's late.
joel