EFI tuning
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 446
Likes: 81
From: Midwestern Illinois
EFI tuning Looking to start building my first GM powered vehicle. 99-04 mustang using a 5.3 single turbo on E85. I'm well versed with blowthrough carbs, but keep eyeballing EFI systems. Just curious how complex the tuning aspect is. I'm somewhat familiar with the moates quarter horse system and honestly have no desire to use anything like that again. Hauling the car to a Dyno tuner is not an option for me. Thanks for any help.
Staging Lane
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 57
Likes: 0
Looking to start building my first GM powered vehicle. 99-04 mustang using a 5.3 single turbo on E85. I'm well versed with blowthrough carbs, but keep eyeballing EFI systems. Just curious how complex the tuning aspect is. I'm somewhat familiar with the moates quarter horse system and honestly have no desire to use anything like that again. Hauling the car to a Dyno tuner is not an option for me. Thanks for any help.
you would definitely need a dyno learn on as street is alot harder to tune on,
the main thing you want to look at is afr, knock and cylinder pressure, i think the max safe timing on ls engine is 18 with a turbo some go higher but for reliability most of people increase boost over timing i think some people leave the timing as low as 14 not really sure, dont tune leaner than 11.8 but still dont go richer than 11, make a det can headset and listen for knock.
since you are still learning if you can get standalone ecu it would help you alot to learn on as you can fix your mistake right away than using reflash ecu like stock
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 446
Likes: 81
From: Midwestern Illinois
If I go EFI I would be using something like a Holley HP or MS3. I haven't researched either enough to draw a conclusion. The Holley looks nice, but a steep price tag with a learning curve seems pretty daunting.
my last turbo car (a Ford) was an E85 blowthrough setup with an MSD 6530 ignition. Fuel adjustments were simple enough to make via wideband readings. And the MSD software made ignition tuning a breeze.
my last turbo car (a Ford) was an E85 blowthrough setup with an MSD 6530 ignition. Fuel adjustments were simple enough to make via wideband readings. And the MSD software made ignition tuning a breeze.
TECH Fanatic
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,059
Likes: 198
I think the biggest factor is whether you're comfortable working with tables of numbers. Personally I like it a LOT more than turning screws on carburetors. There are more things to adjust, but it's far easier to predict what the results will be when I change something. Also, when you can make data logs, you can get a much clearer picture of what's happening, so you can make more informed decisions. Just make small changes, test them, study the results, and repeat until done.
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 446
Likes: 81
From: Midwestern Illinois
Staging Lane
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 57
Likes: 0
If I go EFI I would be using something like a Holley HP or MS3. I haven't researched either enough to draw a conclusion. The Holley looks nice, but a steep price tag with a learning curve seems pretty daunting.
my last turbo car (a Ford) was an E85 blowthrough setup with an MSD 6530 ignition. Fuel adjustments were simple enough to make via wideband readings. And the MSD software made ignition tuning a breeze.
my last turbo car (a Ford) was an E85 blowthrough setup with an MSD 6530 ignition. Fuel adjustments were simple enough to make via wideband readings. And the MSD software made ignition tuning a breeze.
https://www.hpacademy.com/courses/ba...ng-fuel-tuning
watch those free videos this would explain small part of what you will be doing, the first video is tuning ve table is basically equivalent of turning the screw on a carb, the second video i think its gonna be like using the msd to you
they have a package called how to tune starter package its cost 417$ there is two option the one you need is practical standalone tuning, i highly recommend getting the package before buying the ecu, it took me about 6 month of watching videos and reading online topic and forums to understand everything i wanted to know but you already have more knowledge and experience than me when i started
i would get either haltech or holley that my preferred choice
the datalog at first might seems overwhelming but once you know what you are looking at it will be useful,
Originally Posted by NSFW
I think the biggest factor is whether you're comfortable working with tables of numbers. Personally I like it a LOT more than turning screws on carburetors. There are more things to adjust, but it's far easier to predict what the results will be when I change something. Also, when you can make data logs, you can get a much clearer picture of what's happening, so you can make more informed decisions. Just make small changes, test them, study the results, and repeat until done.
Originally Posted by sewerpickle
that is the part I find most intimidating about EFI tuning. I can't seem to make much sense of the data provided, but that was different software than the Holley or ms3, ect.
And there are other parameters you would never have thought of -- like WHEN to spray the fuel in the engine rotation.
Personally I like the OE ECU and OS. It is quite versatile
Trending Topics
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 446
Likes: 81
From: Midwestern Illinois
Talked to the guys at Haltech and Holley today. Both seem like very good options. But how do you guys get over the sticker shock of these systems? I know quality comes with a price but yikes EFI is cashy.
LS1 Tech Stories
The Best V8 Stories One Small Block at Time
6 Common C5 Corvette Failures and What's Involved In Repairing Them
Pouria Savadkouei
Retro Modern Bandit Pontiac Trans AM Comes With Burt Reynolds' Autograph
Verdad Gallardo
Top 10 Greatest Cadillac V Series Performance Models Ever, Ranked
Pouria Savadkouei
Top 10 Most Powerful Chevy Trucks Ever Made!
Hennessey's New Supercharged Silverado ZR2 Has 700 HP
Verdad Gallardo
Coachbuilt N2A Anteros Is an LS2-Powered C6 Corvette In Italian Clothes
Verdad Gallardo
Awesome K5 Blazer Restomod Comes With C7 Corvette Power
Verdad Gallardo
10 Camaros You Should Never Buy
10 LS Engine Myths That Refuse to Die
Verdad Gallardo
Building a proper blow through carb setup is not exactly cheap and easy. Doing it right is a hell of a lot more tedious than a standard draw through arrangement.
Depending on your HP goals could sell you a holley sniper setup. They work really good as blow through and can be tuned just like a hp or dominator setup. We sell more dominator setups than anything though. If you break it down and factor in everything holley can do and control, its actually pretty economical if your starting from scratch.
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 446
Likes: 81
From: Midwestern Illinois
True statement there. My last setup was a blowthrough carb on E85. The carb was custom built, brand new and cost me $850. 2 jet changes, and a LSAB size change and it was dialed in. The support from the carb builder was worth just as much to me as the carb itself.
my fear with EFI, is buying a high dollar system, being unable to tune it myself, having little tech support, and being stuck having to pay someone to tune it for me.
I guess I stayed with a carb on my last setup because I have an understanding how they work with boost, kind like a run what you know type of thing. But change isn't a bad thing either.
my fear with EFI, is buying a high dollar system, being unable to tune it myself, having little tech support, and being stuck having to pay someone to tune it for me.
I guess I stayed with a carb on my last setup because I have an understanding how they work with boost, kind like a run what you know type of thing. But change isn't a bad thing either.
TECH Fanatic
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,059
Likes: 198
In that case, pick the EFI system based on the community of DIY tuners using that system (if they even have one). I personally might never have gotten into EFI tuning if not for the community of DIY Subaru tuners over at romraider.com. It was incredibly helpful to have a bunch of people I could lean on when I got stuck. And heaps of forum threads that I could read to learn about what other people did when they ran into issues similar to whatever I had run into.
I haven't looked info aftermarket EFI systems much but if you find one with a more active DIY community than the rest, that could be your deciding factor.
Also, HPTuners seems to have a pretty active forum, so it might be a good idea to start with their tools and a factory PCM, at least just to learn the ropes, then switch to an aftermarket system later if you want or need to. The fundamentals are going to be pretty much the same (air, fuel, spark, boost), so most of what you learn should carry over.
I haven't looked info aftermarket EFI systems much but if you find one with a more active DIY community than the rest, that could be your deciding factor.
Also, HPTuners seems to have a pretty active forum, so it might be a good idea to start with their tools and a factory PCM, at least just to learn the ropes, then switch to an aftermarket system later if you want or need to. The fundamentals are going to be pretty much the same (air, fuel, spark, boost), so most of what you learn should carry over.