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Big Cam Surging
Big Cam Surging My Car Was "professionally Tuned" But Still My Ms3 Cammed Car Surges When Either Its Warming Up And The A\c Is On Or When Put Into Reverse Or Drive
Once Its Warmed Up All Is Good... Is Therre Anything I Can Do To Reduce The Surging While The Car Is Warming Up And The Ac Is Or In Gear ?
Once Its Warmed Up All Is Good... Is Therre Anything I Can Do To Reduce The Surging While The Car Is Warming Up And The Ac Is Or In Gear ?
Can I Expect A Cam That Large To Run Witn No Surgeing ?
Once Its Warm It Has None At Idle But It Always Has A Little While In Reverse Or If The Ac Is Turned On And The Car Is Put Into Gear (just For The First Few Secconds)
Once Its Warm It Has None At Idle But It Always Has A Little While In Reverse Or If The Ac Is Turned On And The Car Is Put Into Gear (just For The First Few Secconds)
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Are you using Hp Tuners? If so, can you post your bin/hpt file and an idle scan log at hptuners.com/forum/ and I'll take a look at it. The files are too large even when zipped to post on this forum. I need to know what your idle map kpa is in gear. With that cam I would set the base idle timing to 40* in N and in G. Also make sure that your LTFT low map boundary is 5 kpa higher than your idle in G map. And you want your low rpm boundary to be 100 rpm higher than your idle in G. Are you mafless?
Russ Kemp
Russ Kemp
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Wow, have you tried contacting TSP about this? These gripes you describe should be no brainers. Maybe they just gave you the wrong tune. If they knew your mods they should have been able to get you closer than this. There is no excuse for your car acting/driving like this.
Originally Posted by Doc
Wow, have you tried contacting TSP about this? These gripes you describe should be no brainers. Maybe they just gave you the wrong tune. If they knew your mods they should have been able to get you closer than this. There is no excuse for your car acting/driving like this.
This is a mail order tune, so in NO WAY will this be the EXACT tune that you need to help fix all of the driveability/surging issues. To solve those issues, you HAVE to re-map your VE table and adjust your cracker/follower tables which can ONLY be done by logging on YOUR exact vehicle. To top it all off, this cam is HUGE. Even if you spent weeks on your tune, you will always have a little surging/bucking here and there because of the reversion that i guarantee you're getting.
Only thing I can suggest is to get a cut-out and run with it open at all times to help reduce reversion. Also, some of the problems you're mentioning have to do with the fact that AC-on have different tables and its possible that they aren't tweaked as well for your particular setup. Are you running with the MAF? if you run SD I bet it'll help with some of the issues you're having. I would suggest contacting TSP, and letting them know of some of the simple issues that you have, and see what they can do for you. Honestly, to have a mail order tune that dead on the first try is amazing, so don't get all bent out of shape if it isn't perfect the first time.
I also just realized that you should go through the idle learning process for all different states, in-gear/ac-on. Those small idle surging issues for the first few seconds you're talking about when you change states just sounds like your PCM hasn't re-learned the LTIT for those states. Just give it a couple weeks worth of driving, and I'm sure it'll all smooth out. Also, take note that with a very large cam, your driveability will change A LOT between different engine and IA temps. If you're having large temp swings in your engine temps, it'll also cause surging/bucking and driveability issues. Its just the nature of a cammed vehicle.
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I agree with Haans249 If mail order tunes were dead on evey time who would get a dyno tune. Drive ability is something that has to be tweaked to the persons liking and is hard to get in one shot especialy with a big cam.
I'm not going to get caught up in sponsor name dropping but I have seen some local vehicles that have similar setups with mail-order tunes that are quite good. As time has gone by in the LSx world of tuning, in person which is always better, and thru the mail have both come a long way. All I am saying is as a consumer today as opposed to say five years ago, you shouldn't have to settle for what JPR is describing -something as simple as getting Air/Spark Tables right even on his size of cam. As for the VE tables, yeah if you want zero Ltrims you can only do that in person but for most prospective mail order customers who will run a MAF and Ltrims (not SD), +/- ~neg 2% should be fine. If the shop / tuner is proficient with either major tuning software suite, and has a broad spectrum of vehicles / mods under their belt they should be able to get a customer very close thru the mail. Well, closer than what Jpr is describing.
dont get me wrong the car runs great 99% of the time and the people at tsp are very helpful there is no doubting that..
all i want to know is what tables i should look at to stablize the idle while
1: the car is cold and warming up
2: the ac is on and the car or the car is put in reverse
if there is some waiting to do then mabye it just hasnt been long enough, i keep on retuneing the car with minor changes and havent really drove the car more that 50 miles sinse its been back together
furthermore the car is a 2002 a\4 trans am 3500 stall tsp stage 2.5 5.3l heads ms3 vs cam with a fast 90 setup
all i want to know is what tables i should look at to stablize the idle while
1: the car is cold and warming up
2: the ac is on and the car or the car is put in reverse
if there is some waiting to do then mabye it just hasnt been long enough, i keep on retuneing the car with minor changes and havent really drove the car more that 50 miles sinse its been back together
furthermore the car is a 2002 a\4 trans am 3500 stall tsp stage 2.5 5.3l heads ms3 vs cam with a fast 90 setup
The tuning you're talking about cannot be done on the dyno with a warm engine, and is too time consuming for the majority of tuners to deal with, which is unfortunate.
It takes me at least two days having the car dead-cold first thing in the morning to completely work out the cold-start calibrations which includes OLFA, idle spark & spark corrections, idle speeds, cranking tables, and all of the start-up tables.
You simply cannot nail these down unless you start with a dead-cold engine that has sat at least overnight.
It takes me at least two days having the car dead-cold first thing in the morning to completely work out the cold-start calibrations which includes OLFA, idle spark & spark corrections, idle speeds, cranking tables, and all of the start-up tables.
You simply cannot nail these down unless you start with a dead-cold engine that has sat at least overnight.
anyone care to post up a how to for just tuneing a cold motor ive read the sticky and it does not seem to apply
o yea as of now i have a 9\16th hole in my tb blade i dont think i should go any bigger but drilling thus far has seemed to help the surging also i have completly removed the set screw (i just figured i want 0% tps to mean 0 % of the air comming in is due to the blade being cracked open)
o yea as of now i have a 9\16th hole in my tb blade i dont think i should go any bigger but drilling thus far has seemed to help the surging also i have completly removed the set screw (i just figured i want 0% tps to mean 0 % of the air comming in is due to the blade being cracked open)
http://redhardsupra.blogspot.com/200...le-tuning.html
here's my writeup on idle tuning, one part of it is doing the coolant-temp-dependent airflow correction measurement.
here's my writeup on idle tuning, one part of it is doing the coolant-temp-dependent airflow correction measurement.
If Any One Is Willing To Take A Look I Mase A Log Of The Car From A Cold Start
It Kinda Runs Like **** When Its Really Cold.. I Noticed The Tieing Is All Over The Place But Seems To Steady Out Once It Warms Up
Also I Noticed That The Car (at Any Temp) Seems To Go Into An Annoying Cruse Controll Mode Above 2 Mph
Finally Sometimes It Seems Like The Idle Is Hanging While The Tps Reads Zero (if I Hold It At 2 K For A Min Then Let Off It Takes A Few Secconds To Come Down) In Gear This Dont Happen Just Netural Or Park
It Kinda Runs Like **** When Its Really Cold.. I Noticed The Tieing Is All Over The Place But Seems To Steady Out Once It Warms Up
Also I Noticed That The Car (at Any Temp) Seems To Go Into An Annoying Cruse Controll Mode Above 2 Mph
Finally Sometimes It Seems Like The Idle Is Hanging While The Tps Reads Zero (if I Hold It At 2 K For A Min Then Let Off It Takes A Few Secconds To Come Down) In Gear This Dont Happen Just Netural Or Park