Project V6 Firebird
12-17-2010, 08:12 AM
#81
Installed LS6 injectors to deal with the current stockers just getting too close to maximum duty. Big hat tip to John and Jesse at Scoggin Dickey Parts Center for the help!
Getting started!
LS6 connector from Casper's Electronics:
Spliced into the harness:
Injector Spacers:
Back to tuning!
Getting started!
LS6 connector from Casper's Electronics:
Spliced into the harness:
Injector Spacers:
Back to tuning!
12-23-2010, 06:44 PM
#83
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much respect to ya wow, you rock bro,,, I prefer the 3.8 to Lt1 ,, the wifes has a 3.8 in her 2000 , very decent car your engine is killer much props,, you got that 3.8 lonestar edition ,, kick *** bro ,, great pics
12-24-2010, 08:28 AM
#84
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With the built motor in my 98 V6 I made 225rwhp and 225rwtq with a stock tune. I had SSMS stage 1 heads and intake, and a 210/220/534/547/112 comp cam. I also had a bored out forged bottom end. This was with RKsport headers since they were the only header out there at the time. If I could build a 3.8 again I could only imagine the outcome. Now there is HP tuners, and Longtubes, and huge cams..
12-24-2010, 12:21 PM
#85
Just the engine work itself with all the parts needed to get it running how it is now probably would have come close to doing an LS1 swap with a high mile motor (which would probably have to be torn apart anyway and built with proper parts).
I have a lot of parts installed on the car that would be considered an easy crossover as all of the suspension (except k-member) swap perfectly between the V6 and V8 cars. Hell, I've got more suspension work done than most guys will ever do to their cars.
But the experience of tearing apart my engine, rebuilding it and getting it running will pay dividends in the future, so that is priceless.
I figure everything, including the trans build ($1200) comes out to something like 5 or 6K, which was spread out over the past two years. Just the longtubes were $700 along with about $300 in exhaust work. Intake and heads work was only $600.
You'd be amazed at what we'd be capable of essentially cam only now. There's some in the high 11's to low 12's with a very aggresive cam. But those are the stock eliminator guys, so they tend to practice voodoo too 
Our biggest limitation is the cylinder head. We just don't have any high CFM heads, which would change the game for a lot of the guys in our community.
I have a lot of parts installed on the car that would be considered an easy crossover as all of the suspension (except k-member) swap perfectly between the V6 and V8 cars. Hell, I've got more suspension work done than most guys will ever do to their cars.
But the experience of tearing apart my engine, rebuilding it and getting it running will pay dividends in the future, so that is priceless.
I figure everything, including the trans build ($1200) comes out to something like 5 or 6K, which was spread out over the past two years. Just the longtubes were $700 along with about $300 in exhaust work. Intake and heads work was only $600.
With the built motor in my 98 V6 I made 225rwhp and 225rwtq with a stock tune. I had SSMS stage 1 heads and intake, and a 210/220/534/547/112 comp cam. I also had a bored out forged bottom end. This was with RKsport headers since they were the only header out there at the time. If I could build a 3.8 again I could only imagine the outcome. Now there is HP tuners, and Longtubes, and huge cams..
Our biggest limitation is the cylinder head. We just don't have any high CFM heads, which would change the game for a lot of the guys in our community.
12-24-2010, 01:46 PM
#86
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You'd be amazed at what we'd be capable of essentially cam only now. There's some in the high 11's to low 12's with a very aggresive cam. But those are the stock eliminator guys, so they tend to practice voodoo too
Our biggest limitation is the cylinder head. We just don't have any high CFM heads, which would change the game for a lot of the guys in our community.
Thats if you want to keep it all motor..
I was spraying a 125 shot on my motor and it made 370rwhp with it on a stock tune. So I went from 225rwhp-370rwhp on a 125 shot without doing anything to the tune or even raising my rev limiter for my cam.. My A/F ratio was in the low 10's on the bottle and the low 11's on motor. I think if I were able to tune the car I could have had another 20-30 hp on motor and 40-60 hp on the bottle just with a tune..
The Series 2 heads and intakes flow fairly well compared to the older series 1 motors. When you put a power adder on the Series 2 motors then they really shine. The way I would build my motor if I were to build a 3.8 is to build it for a Turbo.
After I sold my 98 V6 and got my 02 WS6 the 1st loss I had in my 02 was to my buddies 99 V6 firebird with a stock motor with a STS kit. He walked the crap out of me. My 02 at the time ran a 13.3@108mph and his V6 at the time ran a 12.4@114mph on 13lbs of boost.. Sick....I have not talked to hime in about 4 yrs so he is probably on a built motor now making crazy power.
The 3.8's are great motors and when done right can be monsters and still get great gas miles..
this build just gave me the motivation to get another car and fix my beat up 02 v6.
03-17-2011, 05:22 PM
#90
As promised! Need to get some lugnuts, center caps and valve stems. Probably going to run spacers to get them more flush with the body lines of the car (have ARP studs available, not looking forward to pulling rear axles)...Oh yeah and tires too!
Probably going to put the speedline spoke logo back on but in black this time. Unless I find some speedline center caps that fit, but these are going to require a 70mm back center cap. I can drop a 20oz can through the hub opening and not touch.
Before:
Probably going to put the speedline spoke logo back on but in black this time. Unless I find some speedline center caps that fit, but these are going to require a 70mm back center cap. I can drop a 20oz can through the hub opening and not touch.
Before:
04-29-2011, 01:03 PM
#92
Just got back from a dyno session at Texas Speed & Performance, I've been nervous all morning hoping everything would work out okay. I think I was more nervous than the day I got married!
As many of you know, I've been doing part throttle and cruise tuning on this car for quite awhile with help from a friend of mine [John Ginter]. The tuner at TSP commented on the overall idle of the car and how it did on the cruise and that it was doing pretty well. He did 4 or 5 pulls with cooldown in between. He was just trying to get the AFR just right, finished it up around 12.9:1 and it was pretty happy at that point. Open longtubes were creating a little noise issue with the knock sensors, he said it might have made a little more without it causing havok on that.
Going to look at getting a new harmonic balancer to help with spinning this thing up above 6K at the track since this thing without a balance shaft vibrates like crazy.
Just getting there:
3.8 Liter capacity strap-on:
Hot under the collar:
Anyway, numbers.
3rd gear pull, unlocked 3800 stall:
196.02 hp @ 5600 rpm
196.33 tq @ 4600 rpm
2nd gear was a little cleaner line:
195.12 hp @ 5750 rpm
206.14 tq @ 4600 rpm
These weren't really power pulls more just to get a good tune. He didn't want to lug it too bad in 3rd with it locked out.
Compare to stock 'verter/trans and 140K mile motor:
184 TQ @ 4700 rpms
169 HP @ 5300 rpms
I am honestly pleased to see these numbers through a big stall. There's so many things that have changed on the car that just looking at the numbers it is hard to really compare the two as this car is very different from when I first started.
Going to the track tonight, running the 1/8th and hopefully get some times for everybody tonight.
As many of you know, I've been doing part throttle and cruise tuning on this car for quite awhile with help from a friend of mine [John Ginter]. The tuner at TSP commented on the overall idle of the car and how it did on the cruise and that it was doing pretty well. He did 4 or 5 pulls with cooldown in between. He was just trying to get the AFR just right, finished it up around 12.9:1 and it was pretty happy at that point. Open longtubes were creating a little noise issue with the knock sensors, he said it might have made a little more without it causing havok on that.
Going to look at getting a new harmonic balancer to help with spinning this thing up above 6K at the track since this thing without a balance shaft vibrates like crazy.
Just getting there:
3.8 Liter capacity strap-on:
Hot under the collar:
Anyway, numbers.
3rd gear pull, unlocked 3800 stall:
196.02 hp @ 5600 rpm
196.33 tq @ 4600 rpm
2nd gear was a little cleaner line:
195.12 hp @ 5750 rpm
206.14 tq @ 4600 rpm
These weren't really power pulls more just to get a good tune. He didn't want to lug it too bad in 3rd with it locked out.
Compare to stock 'verter/trans and 140K mile motor:
184 TQ @ 4700 rpms
169 HP @ 5300 rpms
I am honestly pleased to see these numbers through a big stall. There's so many things that have changed on the car that just looking at the numbers it is hard to really compare the two as this car is very different from when I first started.
Going to the track tonight, running the 1/8th and hopefully get some times for everybody tonight.
04-29-2011, 01:20 PM
#94
Yup, waiting on it to open up to 1/4, the owner has been out of pocket so he's still going to run 1/8 this weekend. They're working on it, and I'll be out there when I get the chance for 1/4 times. The 1/8 will allow me to get myself acquainted with the car and launching it on drag radials.
04-29-2011, 03:58 PM
#96
Different dynos and operators and atmospheric conditions. It was about 6000ft DA here. Bigger stall eats up the hp numbers but puts the power right where it is most important.
The first dyno was on a mustang dyno (eddy current) which reads lower than a dynojet usually.
The first dyno was on a mustang dyno (eddy current) which reads lower than a dynojet usually.
04-29-2011, 07:36 PM
#98
I love it, and the looks on people's faces can be priceless even if the car isn't a speed demon.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAQyKuxvBMw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAQyKuxvBMw
for doing something different!
05-02-2011, 07:53 AM
#100
Although I kinda admire your stay with it till the end you realize the money you spent on this you could have bought a nice running ls1 car that wooood be worth something. This v6 car is basicly worth nothing, its a good example of what not to do with a v6 firebird. The engines are just so underpowered and small its not worth doing anything to them. I mistakingly bought a NICE 02 v6 firebird for my wife, WE KEPT IT 1 month! It was without a doubt the slowest pug I ever drove PLUS it got terrible gas mileage. GM made sure if you want to drive a "sporty" firebird you are buying a LS1 version.
Good Luck
Good Luck
Last edited by O2Form; 05-02-2011 at 08:00 AM.