Trans Am variants?
06-29-2014, 03:09 PM
#22
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You still haven't answered the many people asking the mileage so I'm guessing there was a decent amount.
Even if it's fairly low at 80k, it's worth about $9,000 according to edmund's ($8,000 if you trade it in) which does sound about right to me. Maybe you could have gotten it up to ~$10,000 if you had sold it but not much more. Even if you rarely drove it and it has 30,000 miles you'd be struggling to get over $13,000 for it. That said, if the mileage is that low I'd definitely be arguing with them and displaying the KBB and Edmunds for it etc. A couple thousand is still a couple thousand. I bought my 98 standard Trans Am with a manual gearbox 5-6 years ago. It had 67,000 miles, one owner with a good history of dealer maintenance, and was in immaculate condition - couldn't find a scratch on her, interior was perfect. I drove her off the lot after paying $7500+tax.
Last edited by Flaring Afro; 06-29-2014 at 03:17 PM.
06-30-2014, 01:49 AM
#23
Good story! OP -
Speaking from experience, you must make a strongly documented case that your car falls in a different category than the vehicles used for comparison by your adjuster, as well as highlighting those things that make your car of a higher value than the 'average' vehicle.
I fought with my insurance company for 4.5 months and presented 30+ pages of vehicle-specific documentation, as well as ebay ads for cars similar to mine.
Ultimately, I had to "sell" my car on ebay and then present the final bid price to them as a real-world actual value. They still would not return my calls / emails - so I went over their heads; I sent the whole package of info (complete with a detailed record of my attempts to communicate with my Progressive reps) to the NC Dept of Insurance, and two days later Progressive called me and asked me how they could properly assist in repairing my vehicle!
: )
So, it can be done, but remember, the adjuster is given a bonus based on minimizing the amount of money paid out in claims.
Good luck!
Speaking from experience, you must make a strongly documented case that your car falls in a different category than the vehicles used for comparison by your adjuster, as well as highlighting those things that make your car of a higher value than the 'average' vehicle.
I fought with my insurance company for 4.5 months and presented 30+ pages of vehicle-specific documentation, as well as ebay ads for cars similar to mine.
Ultimately, I had to "sell" my car on ebay and then present the final bid price to them as a real-world actual value. They still would not return my calls / emails - so I went over their heads; I sent the whole package of info (complete with a detailed record of my attempts to communicate with my Progressive reps) to the NC Dept of Insurance, and two days later Progressive called me and asked me how they could properly assist in repairing my vehicle!
: )
So, it can be done, but remember, the adjuster is given a bonus based on minimizing the amount of money paid out in claims.
Good luck!
Thanks, man. Yeah, I've gone round and round with insurance companies a few times, and you're right, it can be done. They are just so used to everyone giving up that they almost take offense when you point out how wrong they are. I think I will try to get all I can out of them on this because: 1.) I really like the car and I have taken good care of it [original owner] and, 2.) They have annoyed me with their bad faith, B.S. "appraisal".
They are clearly using non-WS6 cars as comparables. Also, apparently none of their "comparable" are "currently available" to inspect, for some reason. Furthermore, they have out-and-out lied about the condition and options of my car.
I think I can make them pay more than they want to. Its a nice car, and it could easily be fixed. The only reason they think they can "total" it is because airbags are expensive.
Good story!
06-30-2014, 01:55 AM
#24
What I have done is take the money. I just ask the insurance company how much they want for the car that's totaled and they always say $500. So I just buy it back and fix it. I have done this twice with two different cars. U don't think they want to get there hands dirty (parting it out) do you. lol. They just get them towed to the nearest auction and the average they get back is $500 dollars for all the zillion cars they insure. They wouldn't want to have to start comparing values of different types of totaled cars. That would be work.
They other thing is you get a "salvage title" if you let them total it.
Last edited by fastertransam; 06-30-2014 at 02:14 AM.
06-30-2014, 11:44 AM
#27
Yeah, I've gone round and round with insurance companies a few times, and you're right, it can be done. They are just so used to everyone giving up that they almost take offense when you point out how wrong they are. I think I will try to get all I can out of them on this because: 1.) I really like the car and I have taken good care of it [original owner] and, 2.) They have annoyed me with their bad faith, B.S. "appraisal".
They are clearly using non-WS6 cars as comparables. Also, apparently none of their "comparable" are "currently available" to inspect, for some reason. Furthermore, they have out-and-out lied about the condition and options of my car.
I think I can make them pay more than they want to. Its a nice car, and it could easily be fixed. The only reason they think they can "total" it is because airbags are expensive.
They are clearly using non-WS6 cars as comparables. Also, apparently none of their "comparable" are "currently available" to inspect, for some reason. Furthermore, they have out-and-out lied about the condition and options of my car.
I think I can make them pay more than they want to. Its a nice car, and it could easily be fixed. The only reason they think they can "total" it is because airbags are expensive.
Good Luck!
06-30-2014, 07:46 PM
#28
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I'm guessing the car is near or past the 100k mile mark, which would make sense of an 8k dollar offer. I paid $10K for mine with 55k miles almost 4 years ago. Like others have said, the WS6 package isn't actually as rare as one may think (a standard Trans Am/Formula are rarer nowadays) but the WS6 package was the premium trim level aside from the Firehawk. So the WS6 package should still command a higher price.
07-01-2014, 05:09 AM
#29
Why? Why do you say that? I am not asking anyone on this discussion board to evaluate my car. I just asked if anyone knew offhand whether or not the 5.7 liter engines were available without the WS6 package.
With all due respect, I got a few responses from people who had helpful information or an actual answer to my question, and I appreciate that.
By contrast, I also got a slew of diabribes from people trying to play "expert car evaluator", or trying to devalue my car, or trying to justify their own purchases.
By the way, mileage doesn't necessarily mean much. Much more important is how the car has been driven and how well it has been maintained. My car happens to have relatively low mileage, but some people destroy their engine in 10,000 miles because they drive like maniacs.
Do you want to buy my car or something? Its not for sale.
The tone of your post is disrespectful. Don't try to order me around [on an internet chat board, no less]. O.K.?
With all due respect, I got a few responses from people who had helpful information or an actual answer to my question, and I appreciate that.
By contrast, I also got a slew of diabribes from people trying to play "expert car evaluator", or trying to devalue my car, or trying to justify their own purchases.
By the way, mileage doesn't necessarily mean much. Much more important is how the car has been driven and how well it has been maintained. My car happens to have relatively low mileage, but some people destroy their engine in 10,000 miles because they drive like maniacs.
Do you want to buy my car or something? Its not for sale.
The tone of your post is disrespectful. Don't try to order me around [on an internet chat board, no less]. O.K.?
07-01-2014, 06:38 AM
#30
TECH Junkie
Why do you say that? I am not asking anyone on this discussion board to evaluate my car. I just asked if anyone knew offhand whether or not the 5.7 liter engines were available without the WS6 package.
With all due respect, I got a few responses from people who had helpful information or an actual answer to my question, and I appreciate that.
By contrast, I also got a slew of diabribes from people trying to play "expert car evaluator", or trying to devalue my car, or trying to justify their own purchases.
By the way, mileage doesn't necessarily mean much. Much more important is how the car has been driven and how well it has been maintained. My car happens to have relatively low mileage, but some people destroy their engine in 10,000 miles because they drive like maniacs.
Do you want to buy my car or something? Its not for sale.
The tone of your post is disrespectful. Don't try to order me around [on an internet chat board, no less]. O.K.?
With all due respect, I got a few responses from people who had helpful information or an actual answer to my question, and I appreciate that.
By contrast, I also got a slew of diabribes from people trying to play "expert car evaluator", or trying to devalue my car, or trying to justify their own purchases.
By the way, mileage doesn't necessarily mean much. Much more important is how the car has been driven and how well it has been maintained. My car happens to have relatively low mileage, but some people destroy their engine in 10,000 miles because they drive like maniacs.
Do you want to buy my car or something? Its not for sale.
The tone of your post is disrespectful. Don't try to order me around [on an internet chat board, no less]. O.K.?
You're welcome. Have a nice day!
07-01-2014, 06:54 AM
#31
By the way, mileage doesn't necessarily mean much. Much more important is how the car has been driven and how well it has been maintained. My car happens to have relatively low mileage, but some people destroy their engine in 10,000 miles because they drive like maniacs.
When you reach out to an internet forum for assistance without needed information given, especially after several requests for it, it becomes frustrating and difficult to help. You need to help us to help you.
We all welcome you to LS1 tech and myself and I'm sure everybody else here hopes to see more of you but you need to become more open to how you interact with us. Work with us so we can work with you.
Let's see where this thread goes, I'll leave it open for now. O.K.?
Last edited by Paul Bell; 07-01-2014 at 07:20 AM.
07-01-2014, 09:12 AM
#32
Why do you say that? I am not asking anyone on this discussion board to evaluate my car. I just asked if anyone knew offhand whether or not the 5.7 liter engines were available without the WS6 package.
With all due respect, I got a few responses from people who had helpful information or an actual answer to my question, and I appreciate that.
By contrast, I also got a slew of diabribes from people trying to play "expert car evaluator", or trying to devalue my car, or trying to justify their own purchases.
By the way, mileage doesn't necessarily mean much. Much more important is how the car has been driven and how well it has been maintained. My car happens to have relatively low mileage, but some people destroy their engine in 10,000 miles because they drive like maniacs.
Do you want to buy my car or something? Its not for sale.
The tone of your post is disrespectful. Don't try to order me around [on an internet chat board, no less]. O.K.?
With all due respect, I got a few responses from people who had helpful information or an actual answer to my question, and I appreciate that.
By contrast, I also got a slew of diabribes from people trying to play "expert car evaluator", or trying to devalue my car, or trying to justify their own purchases.
By the way, mileage doesn't necessarily mean much. Much more important is how the car has been driven and how well it has been maintained. My car happens to have relatively low mileage, but some people destroy their engine in 10,000 miles because they drive like maniacs.
Do you want to buy my car or something? Its not for sale.
The tone of your post is disrespectful. Don't try to order me around [on an internet chat board, no less]. O.K.?
Second, you're talking to people who have owned these cars and have dealt with the F-Body platform for many years, some for decades. Lots of us have been in the scene so long we have a good eye for the market values on these cars and can point you in the right direction for where to look to get real life numbers and information for you to use in your fight with the insurance company and it probably will be a fight. They don't like to give extra money if they don't have to. That's why you came here in the first place, you didn't even know elementary information about your car and the trim models. Now you want to scold us?
Third, nobody wants to buy your wrecked car. These are a dime a dozen and the WS6 package was so popular that it wound up being ordered on roughly 41% of all Trans Ams for the 2001 model year. Literally almost every other 2001 Trans Am on the road is a WS6. Even if you include all the V6 models and the Formulas (which weren't offered with the WS6 package for 2001), the figure still comes out to 36%, so at least one out of three 2001 Firebirds is a Trans Am WS6. Figures like these are why insurance companies offer us crap for our cars. To their eyes our cars are common, and to be honest they kind of have a point. Good luck with your battle, hopefully you can find a fair price for the car.
07-01-2014, 11:30 AM
#33
So they want $2500 for Ws6's and firebirds and camaros that are 13+ yrs old and totaled. I'm sure there's a line of folks chancing all these totaled cars. Or might it be that your crying so much about its totaled value the more there going to charge you. I totaled one and I mean totaled it. Funny no junk yard was offering me $2500 for it.
07-01-2014, 03:50 PM
#35
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So they want $2500 for Ws6's and firebirds and camaros that are 13+ yrs old and totaled. I'm sure there's a line of folks chancing all these totaled cars. Or might it be that your crying so much about its totaled value the more there going to charge you. I totaled one and I mean totaled it. Funny no junk yard was offering me $2500 for it.
I just posted asking this guy what his buyback was, as it's the most recent one on here https://ls1tech.com/forums/paint-bod...-trans-am.html Just saw his reply, he said his buyback was $1,000
but the last one I read (within the last year) the buyback was 2500, LS1 cars command a premium. here it is, post #65 https://ls1tech.com/forums/paint-bod...-advice-4.html
also just found this post #43 https://ls1tech.com/forums/racers-lo...-02-ws6-3.html "$3,050 less if i keep the car" but this is like 2.5 years ago.
this is based on what I have read here, not my personal experience, I'm not "crying" over anything, I'm just saying what I have seen, sounds like your the one crying because the junkyards wouldn't give you crap for your car.
Last edited by Daniel Richards; 07-02-2014 at 04:47 PM.
07-01-2014, 04:11 PM
#36
By the way, mileage doesn't necessarily mean much. Much more important is how the car has been driven and how well it has been maintained. My car happens to have relatively low mileage, but some people destroy their engine in 10,000 miles because they drive like maniacs.
Relatively low mileage? Well, average mileage for most cars is 12k to 15k a year... Your 2001 is 13 years old. So average is anywhere from 150k-190k. "Relatively low" could still be over 100k, and at 100k+ miles, WS6 or not, well cared for or otherwise, in the sort of non-rare color and combo you have, $8000 is a decent offer. As others in the thread have stated, a WS6 with 30-50k miles can be had for around $10k... and that is all that matters to insurance.
When an insurance company is going to value your car on a standard insurance policy, all they are looking at is the real world cash cost to replace your car with a car of similar mileage and options. So mileage most certainly does matter. Period. Not auction prices for mint low mile cars with the most desirable options and in rare color combos.
Being in mint condition, but with over 100k miles wouldn't automatically mean a car would be worth as much as a similar car with 10k miles... Just because they are both well taken care of. Even if the 100k mile car is in better shape than the 10k mile car, the lower mile car is worth more. Why? Because you can restore the 10k mile car... At which point, it will be a mint 10k mile car. You can't remove the miles from the better condition car. No matter how mint it is, it's still a 100k mile car.
Last edited by Wheelman916; 07-01-2014 at 04:21 PM.
07-01-2014, 06:47 PM
#38
The fact of the matter is that we're talking subjective versus objective. This is all the insurance company cares about. Period.
Subjective: "The way the car was driven..."
Objective: "The car has 112k miles..."
Contrary to what one might think, not all vehicles are equipped with the voice of William Daniels. They can not tell the varying owners, technicians, evaluators, etc. that run into the car (figuratively, not literally) throughout its useful life what sort of driver a person was.
Year
Make
Model
Trim
Options
Mileage
Condition (based on a predetermined evaluation guideline which you agreed to when you started the insurance)
Those are the only parameters that matter. From there, the appraiser compares said vehicle to other comparatively similar vehicles. The only exception -- and this is not a guarantee -- is that some companies will allow for consideration of modifications that enhance the value.
Lastly, if one is ever at all concerned with how much they would receive from their insurance company should some ever happen, then it's time to look into collector car insurance.
Cliff notes: Either give the full story or this thread gets locked.
Subjective: "The way the car was driven..."
Objective: "The car has 112k miles..."
Contrary to what one might think, not all vehicles are equipped with the voice of William Daniels. They can not tell the varying owners, technicians, evaluators, etc. that run into the car (figuratively, not literally) throughout its useful life what sort of driver a person was.
Year
Make
Model
Trim
Options
Mileage
Condition (based on a predetermined evaluation guideline which you agreed to when you started the insurance)
Those are the only parameters that matter. From there, the appraiser compares said vehicle to other comparatively similar vehicles. The only exception -- and this is not a guarantee -- is that some companies will allow for consideration of modifications that enhance the value.
Lastly, if one is ever at all concerned with how much they would receive from their insurance company should some ever happen, then it's time to look into collector car insurance.
Cliff notes: Either give the full story or this thread gets locked.
07-02-2014, 07:46 PM
#40
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I didn't read the whole thread.
I'm an insurance agent. Usually if you have meticulous records and have done something big such as a clutch trans rebuild tires ect. You can usually negotiate the extra money back for those things. If you want proper coverage pay the extra money and get agreed value for your car. If you can prove your car is worth X amount and it's not a daily driver most insurance companies offer that coverage. Or find a specialty insurance company that offers it. But in any case it cannot be a daily driver.
I'm an insurance agent. Usually if you have meticulous records and have done something big such as a clutch trans rebuild tires ect. You can usually negotiate the extra money back for those things. If you want proper coverage pay the extra money and get agreed value for your car. If you can prove your car is worth X amount and it's not a daily driver most insurance companies offer that coverage. Or find a specialty insurance company that offers it. But in any case it cannot be a daily driver.