Who's running truck 6.0 w/VVT AND adding LSA Supercharger?
04-18-2017, 11:03 AM
#2
I would think most will recommend ditching the VVT as the SC will give you the bottomend anyways. If you build it anyways, I'll be watching.
04-18-2017, 06:21 PM
#4
I considered it. My tuner looked into it and didn't think he could make it work. Dunno.
Anyway, ditched the VVT for LS9 cam, haven't added boost yet but very happy with the switch.
I was pro-vvt until I realized it has too many limitations. If it is all the ****, why aren't people swapping to it?
Anyway, ditched the VVT for LS9 cam, haven't added boost yet but very happy with the switch.
I was pro-vvt until I realized it has too many limitations. If it is all the ****, why aren't people swapping to it?
04-18-2017, 08:01 PM
#5
The added complexity of it most people do not want to deal with because they can acheive their goals without it. But you can make alot more power under the curve with it. It has its place in practically ALL engines from the OEM now. There is so much to be had from it. Unfortunately a pushrod single cam engine can only advance or retard the entire cam (intake and exhaust) so the gains are not as significant as a dual overhead cam where intake and exhaust can be independently advanced and/or retarded, allowing LSA adjustment as well. However, being able to advance the camshaft at low rpm gains low end torque and retarding at high rpm/load gains horsepower.
Here is 1 of many tests for LS specific VVT:
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/hrdp-...formance-test/
Only reason I havent done it yet is because I built a forged 5.3 gen3 block. The next platform I go to will be a VVT aluminum 6.2 with boost. If there is torque and power on the table to be made, I am always interested in the headache and learning curve. Playing with the VVT in my ecoboost 3.5 v6 has made a TREMENDOUS improvement in driveability, spool time, gas mileage and top end power.
I think big power LS guys look at it as more moving parts and potential issues not to mention they prefer someone to spec them a camshaft and not think about it again, and dont need to think about it because they make 800whp. At the high power levels, the gains and headache tuning it may not be as attractive to some.
Another thing to keep in mind is big lift and long duration cams are cutting close with respect to piston to valve clearance, so there is not much available room to advance or retard the cam. But for a mild cam turbo street car, it is worth its weight in gold in my opinion.
Here is 1 of many tests for LS specific VVT:
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/hrdp-...formance-test/
Only reason I havent done it yet is because I built a forged 5.3 gen3 block. The next platform I go to will be a VVT aluminum 6.2 with boost. If there is torque and power on the table to be made, I am always interested in the headache and learning curve. Playing with the VVT in my ecoboost 3.5 v6 has made a TREMENDOUS improvement in driveability, spool time, gas mileage and top end power.
I think big power LS guys look at it as more moving parts and potential issues not to mention they prefer someone to spec them a camshaft and not think about it again, and dont need to think about it because they make 800whp. At the high power levels, the gains and headache tuning it may not be as attractive to some.
Another thing to keep in mind is big lift and long duration cams are cutting close with respect to piston to valve clearance, so there is not much available room to advance or retard the cam. But for a mild cam turbo street car, it is worth its weight in gold in my opinion.
04-18-2017, 08:40 PM
#7
The added complexity of it most people do not want to deal with because they can acheive their goals without it. But you can make alot more power under the curve with it. It has its place in practically ALL engines from the OEM now. There is so much to be had from it. Unfortunately a pushrod single cam engine can only advance or retard the entire cam (intake and exhaust) so the gains are not as significant as a dual overhead cam where intake and exhaust can be independently advanced and/or retarded, allowing LSA adjustment as well. However, being able to advance the camshaft at low rpm gains low end torque and retarding at high rpm/load gains horsepower.
Here is 1 of many tests for LS specific VVT:
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/hrdp-...formance-test/
Only reason I havent done it yet is because I built a forged 5.3 gen3 block. The next platform I go to will be a VVT aluminum 6.2 with boost. If there is torque and power on the table to be made, I am always interested in the headache and learning curve. Playing with the VVT in my ecoboost 3.5 v6 has made a TREMENDOUS improvement in driveability, spool time, gas mileage and top end power.
I think big power LS guys look at it as more moving parts and potential issues not to mention they prefer someone to spec them a camshaft and not think about it again, and dont need to think about it because they make 800whp. At the high power levels, the gains and headache tuning it may not be as attractive to some.
Another thing to keep in mind is big lift and long duration cams are cutting close with respect to piston to valve clearance, so there is not much available room to advance or retard the cam. But for a mild cam turbo street car, it is worth its weight in gold in my opinion.
Here is 1 of many tests for LS specific VVT:
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/hrdp-...formance-test/
Only reason I havent done it yet is because I built a forged 5.3 gen3 block. The next platform I go to will be a VVT aluminum 6.2 with boost. If there is torque and power on the table to be made, I am always interested in the headache and learning curve. Playing with the VVT in my ecoboost 3.5 v6 has made a TREMENDOUS improvement in driveability, spool time, gas mileage and top end power.
I think big power LS guys look at it as more moving parts and potential issues not to mention they prefer someone to spec them a camshaft and not think about it again, and dont need to think about it because they make 800whp. At the high power levels, the gains and headache tuning it may not be as attractive to some.
Another thing to keep in mind is big lift and long duration cams are cutting close with respect to piston to valve clearance, so there is not much available room to advance or retard the cam. But for a mild cam turbo street car, it is worth its weight in gold in my opinion.
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04-19-2017, 03:40 AM
#8
Don't the ford 3.5 Ecoboost engines have the same type of VVT as the Cyote engine? Twincam and independadsxntly variable?
04-19-2017, 12:31 PM
#9
Yup, back to what I said, most people dont see the time and effort worth it. I design engines for a living and its imperative in our designs to always try and squeak out every last bit to improve power density, and reduce brake specific emissions and brake specific fuel consumption. The methods I exercise as a mechanical engineer tend to carry over into my car life. I love the high tech aspects.
Yes the 3.5 ecoboost is twin independent variable camshaft timing, or "Ti-VCT", which provides extremely precise variable – yet independent – control of timing for intake and exhaust valves.
Now if the LS were a DOHC with Ti-VCT rather than a simple single equal (pushrod platform) ...then the benefits would be more significant and no one would eliminate the system. I am an LS guy through and through and they work for me and everyone else on the planet. But I cant deny the fact that the coyote 5.0 is a quality piece of engineering. I just hate the new Ford calibration strategy. Has really been a pain in my *** for my calibration (tuning) side business in order to stay ahead of the curve ha ha. Everyone can tune a LS, its a cakewalk. The load strategy implemented by Ford is a nightmare when you first approach it, but works well once you figure it out.
Yes the 3.5 ecoboost is twin independent variable camshaft timing, or "Ti-VCT", which provides extremely precise variable – yet independent – control of timing for intake and exhaust valves.
Now if the LS were a DOHC with Ti-VCT rather than a simple single equal (pushrod platform) ...then the benefits would be more significant and no one would eliminate the system. I am an LS guy through and through and they work for me and everyone else on the planet. But I cant deny the fact that the coyote 5.0 is a quality piece of engineering. I just hate the new Ford calibration strategy. Has really been a pain in my *** for my calibration (tuning) side business in order to stay ahead of the curve ha ha. Everyone can tune a LS, its a cakewalk. The load strategy implemented by Ford is a nightmare when you first approach it, but works well once you figure it out.
04-20-2017, 10:16 PM
#11
I think the biggest obstacle is going to be controlling both the VVT side of it and the boost bypass valve. I did a LY6 with LSA supercharger but deleted the VVT, Just not worth the trouble for me, I'll already have more low end torque than I'll be able to use.
Last edited by LLLosingit; 04-20-2017 at 10:22 PM.
04-21-2017, 08:31 AM
#12
I'm running a 2010 ly6 with a mast vvt cam and a whipple 2.9 . I started n/a , then kept the cam when I installed the blower. I'm running the corvette bracket spaced out w/ Holley spacers, truck balancer, 2010 camaro water pump. It's around 650rwhp@ 10lbs. Car also has ac. Used a dirty dingo ac bracket mounted down low on pass side.
Last edited by jimmyg; 04-21-2017 at 08:57 AM.
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my406cid (06-07-2020)
04-21-2017, 11:25 AM
#13
Jimmy,
Any closeup pics showing the engine /FEAD/ Whipple?
thanks,
Jim
Any closeup pics showing the engine /FEAD/ Whipple?
thanks,
Jim
04-22-2017, 05:32 AM
#16
I currently have the high mount Holley bracket and Vintage Air set up. Did you have to go with lower AC or was that just easier/what you wanted? What did you do with ECM and tuning? Where are you located?
Last edited by Goldhawg; 04-22-2017 at 05:42 AM.
04-22-2017, 06:33 AM
#17
I went with the lower Ac set up to allow room for the tensioner for the blower. I bought a performance package from mast motorsports ( ecm ,harness, cam , springs ) came with a tune, then they sent me another tune when I put whipple on. You also get free tuning software with their ecm.. I can't say enough about their customer service. Damon Sampson over there really knows his ****. My car runs perfect. I live in mass.