abdulb011

Hi All,

Introducing my swap. A 1980 Firebird Espirit I bought for $1,000 that had a 301/TH350 in it. It ran and drove when I bought it but had a bad leak in the gas lines. Fixed the gas leak, it ran great but carb needed cleaning/rebuild. Let the car sit for about a year as I had another project, my 1986 Porsche 944 that I was trying to finish. Once spring rolled around I finished the Porsche and now at the end of this 2017 Summer I started my Firebird LSX Swap.

I took the whole front clip off of the vehicle and got the 301/TH350 out in about two days... considering its my first time taking this stuff of these cars wasn't too bad. Did all of it myself

The 4.8 came out of a 2000 Silverado, 6.0 came out of 03 Yukon Denali and the 4l80 came out of a 2000 Express Van. Hodge podge of donors lol. The ECU that came with the 6.0 can do DBW and DBC so I have options, but the 4.8 can only do DBC. I do want to tinker with the DBW just to learn but for ease of swap for the beginning stages I will keep DBC system for simplicity. (I don't feel like fabing a pedal mount for the DBW )

I plan on doing a 6.0 LS Swap but for learning purposes so I do not hurt my 6.0 LS while I am learning how to tune the turbo set up I am going to run a 4.8/4L80E set up since its cheaper and easier to find these motors where I live. As of right now I need to take the old Pontiac motor mounts off, buy the 2292 chevy motor mounts so my Holley/Hooker 12613HKR Motor mounts fit. Autozone sells the 2292 motor mounts for about $10.00. I have to take of the lower control arm to get to those motor mount bolts. Otherwise I heard its a pain in the a**...

I will try to keep this forum as up to date with the build as time allows! I hope you guys will enjoy the build.



















































Dog Tax

abdulb011

Oh yeah I forgot to post the turbo lol

Its a VSRacing 7875 t4 turbo.




Something funny when I took the A/C Condensor/Blower Motor Housing off of the firewall, I found a bee hive on the props of the blower motor lol. I wonder how long its been since this car had the blower motor turned on

abdulb011

Swapped the motor mounts yesterday. Man are they a pain in the a**.. So to use the Holley LS swap motor mounts, requires the use of the Chevy motor mounts, the 2292 style. You must remove your old Pontiac motor mounts and install the Chevys. With some finesse it can be done... a lot of finesse.

Using a 9/16 socket and various extensions and wobble extensions, a deep well 9/16 socket, busted knuckles and tons if sweat you can also have your Chevy engine mounts in a pontiac.

abdulb011

A couple clearance issues with the stock manifolds off of a Chevy Silverado. I don't plan on keeping this manifolds. Holley makes turbo exhuast manifolds with a crossover tube I was thinking about buying. But I need to fab a cross member for the transmission before I look into that. No point for an exhuast if you can't drive right? Still wondering what I should do about a fuel system. My goal is 500 whp. Been looking into using the stock tank, putting a sump on it and than a complete -8 braided steel hoses feed to -6 return but after pricing out it comes to about $700.00. I talked to a few street guys who said all the fancy fittings aren't nesscarry if your looking to just go fast. It's still a toss up. Need to figure out how to mount this 4L80E. Probably going to remove the Exhaust Manifolds to make mocking the motor/trans easier.

abdulb011

I almost forgot, Dog Tax.

reedld

iTrader: (7)

You should consider 4th gen LS fuel bucket before you sump/external electric pump. I'm using stock tank, top is recessed to fit 4th gen pump (lines don't hit bottom of trunk). You could cut a hole in your trunk too. I had a sump/external pump previously...it worked but was noisy. You don't need fancy braided lines/fittings. I'm using copper nickel lines, flared to use with AN fittings. Good luck!

abdulb011

Hey reedld! Thanks for the info! I really appreciate it. How did you recesse the gas tank so the 4th gen fuel bucket wouldn't hit the trunk floor? Also, as far as cost goes, what difference is there between the sump/external set up versus the in tank gen 4 fuel bucket set up?

Things are getting a little bitter sweet! In the process of buying my first house so the car might get put on the back burner for the next coming weeks .... but I get a new house! Excited and sad at the same time lol I don't know how that works...

reedld

iTrader: (7)

i bought a used fuel bucket setup with electrical harness from eBay. For piece of mind, I bought a new fuel pump and installed it in the bucket. I was not sure how long the previous pump was used. With stock fuel bucket, you don't need tank baffling (I've run down to 1/8 tank w no issues), you don't need fuel pressure regulator (built in), and if you haven't bought new fuel gauge, you can use the 4th gen one. The resistance (google it) is not 0-90 ohm like the 1970s-1980s.

I had had a welder friend make me a recessed area into a new tank. I went new tank because I didn't want any safety concerns. This issue is one you have if you weld in a sump.
I used the vetteworks bucket flange /mount to secure bucket.

Price wise, I'll bet I'm under $500. It's been 4 years, I've forgotten a lot about prices. Bucket came from "fparts" on eBay , new pump from eBay (it was a GM part), new tank was from a forum member who changed mind. There are complete tank setups but I like the factory OEM part. I can go to Autozone (ugh) in a pinch and buy a replacement if I am out on the road (far away trip). Tanks inc or spectra can't offer that.

I'd go rigid Dorman or copper nickel, my original braided stainless started to emit fuel vapors in my garage (or pay more money for ptfe lined braided stainless). Copper nickel bends and flares nicely.

Since photobucket blows, all my pics are gone. PM me your email, I'll send you pics

Leon

ryeguy2006a

iTrader: (27)

Looks like a great start to a build. Look forward to seeing that turbo motor finished! FYI, the stock 00-02 Fbody Camaro manifolds fit pretty well in 2nd gens.

Reed, I thought that with the 4th gen you still needed to run the Vette filter/reg? I didn't know that they were internally regulated?

reedld

iTrader: (7)

Nope, additional vette FPR not needed. I'm guessing you DID and it didn't make a difference.

Leon

abdulb011

So now I am looking for flexplates to mount the 4L80E to combo that I have. Because the 6.0L I purchased didn't come out of a big van or something 2500HD it was not hooked up to a 4L80E from the factory And the 4.8 I have also. They both have dished flexplates which means I have to buy some.

So for those following along, the flexplates in the 4.8/5.3 are dished for the 4L60E and the torque converter snouts are elongated when manufactured to coupe for lost space. WHAT LOST SPACE!? Well, from GEN I SBC, they had long crankshafts (0.4" longer I believe... I might be wrong) The GEN III LS motors have a shorter crankshaft. The snouts on the 4L60E converters are modified at production. 4L80E on the other hand I guess GM didn't want to bother because the production numbers just weren't high enough to do a tool change... anyhow... the 4L80E shares the same architecture as the older TH350/TH400/700R4. To fix this issue, GM used a spacer that filled the 0.4" void and a flat flexplate for the vehicles that used the 4L80E. Those being the 6.0L 2500HD trucks, vans etc..

Now with the history lesson over for the 4.8/5.3/6.0 that were originally mated to 4L60E you will need that flat flex plate Chevy used, the crank/flexplate spacer Chevy used and extended bolts. Chevy performance sells all these and the part numbers are

FLEX PLATE: 19260102
SPACER: 12563532
6 BOLTS: 19257940

information sourced from Sloppy Mechanic.



Now the flex plate from GM performance I found on Jegs (Cheaper than Summit) for $68.99 not SFI approved. Pretty much your stock flexplate you would find on a 6.0 that originally came with a 4L80E. As well as the spacer/bolt combo for $64.13 at Jegs (cheapest I could find).







Now I have found another flexplate, sold and manufactured by Jegs. The part number is 555-601062. They say it will fit the 6.0, common knowledge tells us that means it should fit the 5.3/4.8. I am not sure if it will fit with the GM Performance spacer kit but I wouldn't see why it wouldn't. This Flexplate is SFI approved and cheaper?? $53.99... So I am a bit hesitant to purchase it because it seems sketchy (too good to be true). Has anyone used this with any luck? I did look at reviews and it looks like someone has used it on a 5.3 swap. I emailed them to get confirmation. What are your thoughts? Worth trying? TCI makes SFI approved Flexplates but their near $300... It looks like a different style flexplate. Seems like a lot more material left on it so maybe its stronger? I'll keep you guys updated on which one I end up getting and how it works out.



Oh! I also found a killer deal on an 044 Bosch pump from a local speed shop by me. $159 bucks for a brand new 044 pump with AN fitting and adapters already.

abdulb011

Ryeguy,

Thanks! I am giddy to get it going but everyone knows money is the limiting factor. Just budgeting everything out. Just sold my Porsche 944 project car so I have some money I can put into the project now.

I did look into the 00-02 Fbody manifolds but I am going to be doing turbo manifolds eventually so I don't think its worth investing in a set of stock manifolds. I'm just going to grind/cut away some of the material that is hitting the rails. It is a very small amount that will not affect the functionality. I will be posting pictures later when I get to it.

abdulb011

Just got confirmation from Jegs staff Bob Grace that this infact will work with the spacer kit and the 4.8/5.3! Order up!

jmd

iTrader: (4)

You can get a stock replacement flexplates with included spacer for a lot less than $118.

abdulb011

Hey jmd,

Where can I get it? Does it include the bolts needed too?

abdulb011

Worked on the car today a bit. Will probably be the last weekend I really get to work on it before I put it off because of the house. I got the 4l60e torque converter and flex plate off of the 4.8. Mounted the 4l80e to try to fit I in the vehicle. I got it in pretty deep until it hit the coolant lines on the trans tunnel and the trans mount hit the cross member bolt mount. Took the trans mount off the transmission tail and removed the coolant lines, went in a good bit further but not enough. It looks like this is as far as I can go with the 4l80e. I knew it wasn't going to fit without modification but I wanted to see what i needed to change. From looking at the motor mounts it looks like it needs to go back another 4-5 inches and I might get away with it if I cut that mounting bracket off the cross member and weld it to the other side and slide the cross member back in the front frame, drill 4 holes to mount it. That way I will be able to use the existing cross member with slight modification. I don't know any of this for sure yet. The angle might not be right... I know the Holley motor mounts were designed to work in conjunction with their Holley 4l60e cross memeber for the right angle but Holley doesn't make a cross member that bolts right into the frame right now for the 4l80e. I did some research and found that the g body 4l80e cross member will work if you use it with the f body trans adapter mount??? (I think). From some reading I seen there was whispers about a 2nd gen f body 4l80e cross member being made by holley for a reasonable price but to no avail... I even emailed them to see if it was going to be something i could purchase in the future but i never got any response.... (if someone from Holley ends up reading this please respond )
I'll work on it more tommorow. Going to take off the cross member and see where I can go from there. Will keep you guys updated!

There is dog tax somewhere in the pictures lol

jmd

iTrader: (4)

Well, I think the aftermarket dropped the free shim with new flexplates so I was wrong. But, add 12563532 and 244-2902 and FRA450 on Summit and save a very few $ and get ARP bolts in the deal. Or 704000 can save a few more $.

abdulb011

Thanks jmd. The FRA-450 flex plate is cheaper but it is not SFI approved where as the Jegs flexplate is. I should have double taked on those ARP fasteners though. They were the same price as the OEM ones but better material. I will probably order those bolts when I switch over to the 6.0 when I plan on making some serious power.

abdulb011

Sorry about the long delay! Been busy with the new house... havnt touched car stuff in a while. A lot of changes going on right now... but I was able to hit the garage tonight so I thought I'd update you guys. That flexplate and spacers did come in the mail. Had a little bit of issues with jegs getting the bolts for the spacer but they worked it all out for me. I took the transmission cross member out because I could not get the engine sitting in the car all the way on the motor mounts. Once I took the cross member off I was able to wiggle the motor right in. Perfect fit. So far the engine is looking great with great clearance. With the cross memeber off I cut off the mounting bracket and tried reinstalling the cross member to see where I could weld in a new mounting bracket to the cross member to bolt the 4l80e to. I will definantly have to drill new holes into the subframe. About 3-4 inches back from the existing holes... I might even try to think of a way to use the stock cross member and the stock holes somehow.. hate to drill anything. I'll keep you guys updated if I come with anything. I'll take better pictures later.

I was also able to pick up some weld wheels for my Mustang for a killer deal this past week. Took it to the track at Milan drag way right before the end of their season. Ran a 13.99 sec pass with it... I know slow.. it was faster before I swear lol. Hopefully I can make the firebird much faster.

Oh yeah! And dog tax lol

abdulb011

Worked on the car a bit more today. Took the cross member off, cut it up, smacked it with a hammer, and got the bracket on where I estimate it to be and tacked it in place. The transmission mount I went with is an autozone part number 2811. It's from a 2003 Chevy Silverado 2500 2WD. Seemed to be the best one for the job. My dilemma is right now if I was to drill and mount the cross member where it is clamped down, getting the transmission off in the future would be a pain in the rear because all the tolerances are so tight... to take the engine/trans off as a combo I would need to take the cross member off or take the trans and engine off separately because the trans does not have enough room to pivot to allow the engine to clear the engine mounts when pulling it out. I wish I could find a company that makes a cross member for putting a 4l80e into a 2nd gen f body... I'm going to call the guys at Holley tommorow and see if they have any idea where I could get one. Another issue with this method is having to drill new holes blindly unless I remove the sub frame from the body and drill from the top down... any suggestions from fabricators would be really appreciated lol. Also if anyone else has done this before please let me know.
Thank you