Thinking 572
01-25-2009, 06:44 PM
#1
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Thinking 572 I am thinking about building a 572 low compression Dart M BBC.
Hydraulic lifters with 8.5-9 comp
What cam specs would be good if I just wanted to spin to 6500rpm max?
and What would be the best advantage a 10.6 or 11 tall deck?
What is a good high HP EFI for BBC?
I am thinking twin 67 or bigger in the future.
600-700hp NA and at least 1100hp on boost later on.
Hydraulic lifters with 8.5-9 comp
What cam specs would be good if I just wanted to spin to 6500rpm max?
and What would be the best advantage a 10.6 or 11 tall deck?
What is a good high HP EFI for BBC?
I am thinking twin 67 or bigger in the future.
600-700hp NA and at least 1100hp on boost later on.
01-26-2009, 09:45 PM
#2
A hydraulic big block wil probably only turn 5500 because of the heavy valvetrain mass. You can put titanuim retainers and keepers on the spring and gain a few hundred rpms The best way to go is most likely to go solid on the cam choice.
A cam for the turbo setup you are looking for you would want a good split and a wide lsa something around 114-115.
For high hp efi you might want to look for FAST or big stuff 3 and get an efi manifold for it.
A cam for the turbo setup you are looking for you would want a good split and a wide lsa something around 114-115.
For high hp efi you might want to look for FAST or big stuff 3 and get an efi manifold for it.
01-26-2009, 10:30 PM
#3
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A hydraulic big block wil probably only turn 5500 because of the heavy valvetrain mass. You can put titanuim retainers and keepers on the spring and gain a few hundred rpms The best way to go is most likely to go solid on the cam choice.
A cam for the turbo setup you are looking for you would want a good split and a wide lsa something around 114-115.
For high hp efi you might want to look for FAST or big stuff 3 and get an efi manifold for it.
A cam for the turbo setup you are looking for you would want a good split and a wide lsa something around 114-115.
For high hp efi you might want to look for FAST or big stuff 3 and get an efi manifold for it.
I cant find any EEFI manifolds for a BBC
BS3 is my choice of computer
01-28-2009, 05:32 PM
#4
You can be streetable but you have a narrow powerband with only being able to rev to 5500. A hydraulic will be reliable but will not rev how you want it to. Let me make sure we are on the same page as we are talking about a hydraulic roller and not a hydraulic flat tappet cam?
Edelbrock makes big block efi intakes. They have a super victor and a victor jr
Here is the link :http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive_...fi_chevy.shtml
Take a look at some other fuel management systems before just being dead set on BS3. FAST, Motec, Accel DFI, Megasquirt and one system you dont have to tune because it tunes itself ,Mass-flo efi. Check out their website.
One other thing is that with the power goal you have set you can reach that with a big inch smallblock instead of a big block. There are guys in the forced induction section on here pushing 1000 rwhp on 408 ci motors. One other thing to look at is Nelson Racing Engines. They built a 1500 hp 406 Gen1 smallblock with twin turbos.
Edelbrock makes big block efi intakes. They have a super victor and a victor jr
Here is the link :http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive_...fi_chevy.shtml
Take a look at some other fuel management systems before just being dead set on BS3. FAST, Motec, Accel DFI, Megasquirt and one system you dont have to tune because it tunes itself ,Mass-flo efi. Check out their website.
One other thing is that with the power goal you have set you can reach that with a big inch smallblock instead of a big block. There are guys in the forced induction section on here pushing 1000 rwhp on 408 ci motors. One other thing to look at is Nelson Racing Engines. They built a 1500 hp 406 Gen1 smallblock with twin turbos.
01-28-2009, 10:36 PM
#6
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You can be streetable but you have a narrow powerband with only being able to rev to 5500. A hydraulic will be reliable but will not rev how you want it to. Let me make sure we are on the same page as we are talking about a hydraulic roller and not a hydraulic flat tappet cam?
Edelbrock makes big block efi intakes. They have a super victor and a victor jr
Here is the link :http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive_...fi_chevy.shtml
Take a look at some other fuel management systems before just being dead set on BS3. FAST, Motec, Accel DFI, Megasquirt and one system you dont have to tune because it tunes itself ,Mass-flo efi. Check out their website.
One other thing is that with the power goal you have set you can reach that with a big inch smallblock instead of a big block. There are guys in the forced induction section on here pushing 1000 rwhp on 408 ci motors. One other thing to look at is Nelson Racing Engines. They built a 1500 hp 406 Gen1 smallblock with twin turbos.
Edelbrock makes big block efi intakes. They have a super victor and a victor jr
Here is the link :http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive_...fi_chevy.shtml
Take a look at some other fuel management systems before just being dead set on BS3. FAST, Motec, Accel DFI, Megasquirt and one system you dont have to tune because it tunes itself ,Mass-flo efi. Check out their website.
One other thing is that with the power goal you have set you can reach that with a big inch smallblock instead of a big block. There are guys in the forced induction section on here pushing 1000 rwhp on 408 ci motors. One other thing to look at is Nelson Racing Engines. They built a 1500 hp 406 Gen1 smallblock with twin turbos.
Plus I like the sound of the engine and It just looks so nice under the hood.
Yes with my combo I want 2500hp realiable and only run 1000ish hp for longer life. Im open to any EFI system I jsut couldnt find one advertised to support 1500hp. BS3 just seems realiable as well but anyhting that is good works.
01-28-2009, 10:55 PM
#7
In your first post you state you want 600-700 the 1100 with boost later on, now you say you want to run 1000 for the street and 2500 for race. You have to pick your goal and start there. For what you are talking about now is at least 60k to build considering the turbo system motor build and fuel management. Then the car would have to be setup for that kind of power and now were talking around 5k-10k and thats not including the rest of the drivetrain. As far as the motor that is going to need solid roller, period.
You are stepping into a whole new ballgame now.
You are stepping into a whole new ballgame now.
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01-29-2009, 06:45 AM
#8
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In your first post you state you want 600-700 the 1100 with boost later on, now you say you want to run 1000 for the street and 2500 for race. You have to pick your goal and start there. For what you are talking about now is at least 60k to build considering the turbo system motor build and fuel management. Then the car would have to be setup for that kind of power and now were talking around 5k-10k and thats not including the rest of the drivetrain. As far as the motor that is going to need solid roller, period.
You are stepping into a whole new ballgame now.
You are stepping into a whole new ballgame now.
Its like driving a tank but never having the shell in the cannon.
I want a rock solid engine. Then later on in life if I want to convert to drag only car I just switch out cam injectors ect and up the boost/switch turbos and I can have a 7-8 sec car.
I would be happy with 550 on motor as I like tq alot more. If it doesnt have 600+ tq I wont be happy
01-29-2009, 07:08 AM
#9
Ok gotcha now, but the build would still be extreme even though you are not going to use all that power right away. Billet crank, Oliver rods and custom pistons thats somewhere close to 10k. You are going to need an aftermarket block and some really good heads. The valvetrain would have to be top notch such as a shaft rocker system and when you get a set of heads that people don't use everyday that shaft system wouls end up being custom thru Jesel or T&D. It just gets really expensive to try and make a motor reliable and withstand forced induction, but don't let that deter you.
Nelson racing engines has a vid that has a Pontiac Tempest that they built with a 5xx cube big block with twin turbos and it was on 10# of boost and it was blowing the back tires away in 3rd gear and they said it has roughly 1100 hp to the ground. They also said they could turn up the boost and run a 7 sec pass and drive it home on lower boost.
Nelson racing engines has a vid that has a Pontiac Tempest that they built with a 5xx cube big block with twin turbos and it was on 10# of boost and it was blowing the back tires away in 3rd gear and they said it has roughly 1100 hp to the ground. They also said they could turn up the boost and run a 7 sec pass and drive it home on lower boost.
01-29-2009, 09:37 PM
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Ok gotcha now, but the build would still be extreme even though you are not going to use all that power right away. Billet crank, Oliver rods and custom pistons thats somewhere close to 10k. You are going to need an aftermarket block and some really good heads. The valvetrain would have to be top notch such as a shaft rocker system and when you get a set of heads that people don't use everyday that shaft system wouls end up being custom thru Jesel or T&D. It just gets really expensive to try and make a motor reliable and withstand forced induction, but don't let that deter you.
Nelson racing engines has a vid that has a Pontiac Tempest that they built with a 5xx cube big block with twin turbos and it was on 10# of boost and it was blowing the back tires away in 3rd gear and they said it has roughly 1100 hp to the ground. They also said they could turn up the boost and run a 7 sec pass and drive it home on lower boost.
Nelson racing engines has a vid that has a Pontiac Tempest that they built with a 5xx cube big block with twin turbos and it was on 10# of boost and it was blowing the back tires away in 3rd gear and they said it has roughly 1100 hp to the ground. They also said they could turn up the boost and run a 7 sec pass and drive it home on lower boost.
I figure a 15-20k engine without turbos
that tempest is exactly what I want
01-29-2009, 11:27 PM
#11
You are going to have to figure a lil more than that. Those heads you want are 6400 for the set and that is bare. You will have to set up the whole valvetrain of the head and that cost a lil change. Those heads also come 18,14, and 11 degree and that is going to require a sheetmetal intake because nobody makes an efi intake for that degree of head that I know of. You would be better off just upping your cubes and use a conventional big block head from Brodix or Dart.
01-30-2009, 08:11 AM
#12
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You are going to have to figure a lil more than that. Those heads you want are 6400 for the set and that is bare. You will have to set up the whole valvetrain of the head and that cost a lil change. Those heads also come 18,14, and 11 degree and that is going to require a sheetmetal intake because nobody makes an efi intake for that degree of head that I know of. You would be better off just upping your cubes and use a conventional big block head from Brodix or Dart.
01-30-2009, 02:49 PM
#13
Well using some AFR's is a step down but they still have the potential that you are looking for. You are probably going to want to go for the 357cc or 375cc head and complete they cost 3400 for the set. The head is still a 24 degree conventional big block design. You might be better of calling an engine builder and get a long block already made for boost. It is usually cheaper that way than putting it together yourself.
01-30-2009, 04:03 PM
#14
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Well using some AFR's is a step down but they still have the potential that you are looking for. You are probably going to want to go for the 357cc or 375cc head and complete they cost 3400 for the set. The head is still a 24 degree conventional big block design. You might be better of calling an engine builder and get a long block already made for boost. It is usually cheaper that way than putting it together yourself.
If I can find a 8.0 or 8.5 cr 565 or 572 Dart M I would just on it but they all seem to be big stroke and small bore. I like big bore and short stroke.
a 4.25 stroke with a 4.6 bore is a nice 565 and not have very fast piston speed so it will last longer in my eyes.
01-30-2009, 08:05 PM
#15
Scott Shafiroff has a 540 long block capable of handling 1500+ horsepower and it is a low compression motor for 15 grand. I think that would keep ya satisfied for awhile but we all want more power sooner or later.
I would go with that with some twin 88's and have fun.
I would go with that with some twin 88's and have fun.
01-30-2009, 08:23 PM
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Scott Shafiroff has a 540 long block capable of handling 1500+ horsepower and it is a low compression motor for 15 grand. I think that would keep ya satisfied for awhile but we all want more power sooner or later. I would go with that with some twin 88's and have fun.
I would go with that with some twin 88's and have fun.I am almost positive "I" can build it cheaper. But hell this wont be a budget project and things will escalate quickly. As I have become attached to c3 corvettes and know of one locally that could be the transplant victim I will need to upgrade the rear to handle over 1000tq.
How much hp can a 8:1 cr 565 with high flow heads and a semi track cam make NA? I like to take my driving power at levels. I have ~375-400 rwtq and dont want to jump straight to 800-1000
But I want a murdered car so no cost for paint n such but black rims/lights/interior will be a must
01-30-2009, 09:03 PM
#17
15k is a lil steep if you ask me
I am almost positive "I" can build it cheaper. But hell this wont be a budget project and things will escalate quickly. As I have become attached to c3 corvettes and know of one locally that could be the transplant victim I will need to upgrade the rear to handle over 1000tq.
How much hp can a 8:1 cr 565 with high flow heads and a semi track cam make NA? I like to take my driving power at levels. I have ~375-400 rwtq and dont want to jump straight to 800-1000
But I want a murdered car so no cost for paint n such but black rims/lights/interior will be a must
I am almost positive "I" can build it cheaper. But hell this wont be a budget project and things will escalate quickly. As I have become attached to c3 corvettes and know of one locally that could be the transplant victim I will need to upgrade the rear to handle over 1000tq.
How much hp can a 8:1 cr 565 with high flow heads and a semi track cam make NA? I like to take my driving power at levels. I have ~375-400 rwtq and dont want to jump straight to 800-1000
But I want a murdered car so no cost for paint n such but black rims/lights/interior will be a must
Crank the compression up, when you are ready for boost then swap the pistons, you will shoot yourself in the foot with that compression untill you boost it.
01-30-2009, 09:13 PM
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Then a quick tune and 12-15lbs and its drag strip time.
Im not the best driver but I can hold my own with the power I have now. I would surely KILL myself jumping from my old *** vette with nothing above 4000rpm to a monster that makes the same power I make at top end at 2500rpm
