bolt on ls1 vs bolt on 5.0
03-30-2014, 03:15 PM
#101
03-30-2014, 03:40 PM
#103
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One thing you guys have to udnerstand is there were ALOT of changes made to the LS1 through its years. All of which were a wash. No more then a 10hp spread (longblocks themselves... not different intakes, exhausts from factory). For example... look at the cam differences between a 98 and an 02. As far as comparing 241s to 853s... you are grasping at straws to say that the 241s flow better. You are talking such minimal cfm difference that the amount of oil in the runners have a bigger effect on the HP. The ACTUAL reasoning behind changing the top end was to duplicate the same top end power while making a bit more low end tq...which is why there is less cam and more cylinder head/intake in the later model ls1s. And to be quite honest... the FASTEST ls1 f bodies ive ever encountered/driven... were all 98-99s. Does that mean they are the superior motor... no. Just means the cleaner running motor with better ring seal was the stronger motor. Thats how little the changes effected everything. 2000 ls1s on the other hand were the transition year. There were all sorts of factory part combos in random motors produced through the year.
According to this list...
https://ls1tech.com/forums/drag-raci...1-74-bump.html
...there have been a total of 3. Gutted, non-street legal cars. My car has 500+ lbs. on those and I can drive down the freeway at 80 still getting 25mpg with the A/C blowing cold. The hard life of running a 3.31 rear gear.
Also, the top car there ran that time in -1K' DA, not +1,700' DA like the poor guy running his 5.0.
Here is the most complete bolt-on 5.0 list:
http://www.modularfords.com/threads/...Racing-ET-List
https://ls1tech.com/forums/drag-raci...1-74-bump.html
...there have been a total of 3. Gutted, non-street legal cars. My car has 500+ lbs. on those and I can drive down the freeway at 80 still getting 25mpg with the A/C blowing cold. The hard life of running a 3.31 rear gear.
Also, the top car there ran that time in -1K' DA, not +1,700' DA like the poor guy running his 5.0.
Here is the most complete bolt-on 5.0 list:
http://www.modularfords.com/threads/...Racing-ET-List
Saying your still running a 3.31 gear is a little misleading for some. Most don't understand that the gearing is more in the 6a trans and less in the rear for newer cars. It's a great advantage having that trans.
Of course I would be comparing auto vs auto and m6 vs m6.
The only options to really help power any came from SLP. Their exhaust and the black wing lid.
Last edited by HioSSilver; 03-30-2014 at 03:45 PM.
03-30-2014, 03:47 PM
#104
7 Second Club
03-30-2014, 04:11 PM
#105
So you're thinking a just over 1%. So realistically with ALL being equal a similar optioned/driven/track condition cars should run withing about .15 of each other.
Of course I would be comparing auto vs auto and m6 vs m6.
The only options to really help power any came from SLP. Their exhaust and the black wing lid.
Of course I would be comparing auto vs auto and m6 vs m6.
The only options to really help power any came from SLP. Their exhaust and the black wing lid.
03-30-2014, 04:54 PM
#106
Teching In
As I stated in the previous thread also, I'll take your word for it and give you the benefit of the doubt since this is your car and you would know what is done to it better than anyone. However, I still say those times are a little bit above average than most minimal bolt-on LS1s especially an A4 Camaro. I can understand the ETs since many things can be done to reduce that but the 113mph trap is hard for me to fathom. Regardless, with those traps and ETs you will put most light bolt-on 5.Bros in your rear-view mirror.
03-30-2014, 05:00 PM
#107
10 Second Club
Thread Starter
113 is easy to achieve with bolt on, but usually not that easy but I never seen what gears are in it. True full bolt on street ls1's mostly run in that 116-119+ range.
03-30-2014, 05:03 PM
#108
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It still looks like the old ls1 holds up well in comparison. The top 50 ls1 cars has a cut off at 11.73 with the majority of them being before 2005.....pretty impressive. The top 50 5.bros takes you to 12.29 which is why we see a pretty good battle between those 2 cars.
Saying your still running a 3.31 gear is a little misleading for some. Most don't understand that the gearing is more in the 6a trans and less in the rear for newer cars. It's a great advantage having that trans.
How's that for logic?
Saying your still running a 3.31 gear is a little misleading for some. Most don't understand that the gearing is more in the 6a trans and less in the rear for newer cars. It's a great advantage having that trans.
How's that for logic?
Speculation aside, I am comparing street legal cars to gutted race cars. Taking a 2011+ 5.0 to the track, cranking off 10's in sub-par conditions and driving back home with the A/C blowing while getting 25mph all stock block, N/A, is something that will never be seen by a comparable ls1 fbody car. That is how far apart the engines really are.
Regarding the 3.31...chalk that up to another win for Ford in this comparison. The flip side to the argument is how heavy the 6R80 is. Weight comes with that streetability.
03-30-2014, 05:22 PM
#110
Teching In
With three (3) bolt-ons and on a non-stalled A4? Guess the DA where I live does not support those ETs and traps.
Last edited by MACHXLR8; 03-30-2014 at 06:18 PM.
03-30-2014, 06:57 PM
#111
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Fastest ever stock A4 F-body trapped what, 108mph? Does nobody else have more than a little difficulty in believing that an LS1 F-body magically picks up a second and 5mph from just a lid, tune, and 3.73s?
03-30-2014, 08:54 PM
#118
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03-30-2014, 09:05 PM
#119
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Maybe you think a car 4-500lbs. lighter running in 2,700' better air doesn't make a difference? My math shows that would equal .6-.7+ tenths better in favor of the Coyote. We are talking a 9 second N/A car vs. a 10 sec. car at that point. At those times/speed it is a HUGE difference. Not even in the same ballpark.
Speculation aside, I am comparing street legal cars to gutted race cars. Taking a 2011+ 5.0 to the track, cranking off 10's in sub-par conditions and driving back home with the A/C blowing while getting 25mph all stock block, N/A, is something that will never be seen by a comparable ls1 fbody car. That is how far apart the engines really are.
Regarding the 3.31...chalk that up to another win for Ford in this comparison. The flip side to the argument is how heavy the 6R80 is. Weight comes with that streetability.
Speculation aside, I am comparing street legal cars to gutted race cars. Taking a 2011+ 5.0 to the track, cranking off 10's in sub-par conditions and driving back home with the A/C blowing while getting 25mph all stock block, N/A, is something that will never be seen by a comparable ls1 fbody car. That is how far apart the engines really are.
Regarding the 3.31...chalk that up to another win for Ford in this comparison. The flip side to the argument is how heavy the 6R80 is. Weight comes with that streetability.
I guess since the old f-cars are a little lighter you chalk up another win for Chevy.........cwhatididthere.
A lid will get you 1-1.5 mph, the 3.73 should get 1-1.5 mph. A solid no tq management tune should get near 2 mph. The car in question has exhaust work too. Seems pretty logical.
03-30-2014, 09:07 PM
#120
Teching In