5301113

iTrader: (18)

[QUOTE=NemeSS]THANK U

ponygt65

[QUOTE=5301113]
For what?....bad information? (see my reply to him)

Besides, you and I were talking about LS7 Z vs. GT500

5301113

iTrader: (18)

[QUOTE=ponygt65]LOL
You Love Mustangs
l love Vettes
Lets AGREE TO DISAGREE

PEACE

NemeSS

iTrader: (127)

[QUOTE=ponygt65]explain what u beleive is wrong?
tell me what i said wrong, i wasnt bashing the car, i think they look killer
but the a N/A LS motor is superior to a N/A mod motor, perhaps the 3v
mod motors will build some killer n/a hp, but till then.....
4.6 mod motors are square motors witha 3.552 bore and 3.554 stroke
i may know a thing or 2 about them since i have rebuilt and machined a few when i was working as a automtive machinist and engine builder, the 5.4 motors use a longer stroke at 4.165 with the same size bore of 3.552 in there stock form.where is the bad information?
a 3.552 bore is not where i would start to build a mean N/a motor
but it seems to work well with hi psi, but then again what doesnt??

NemeSS

iTrader: (127)

[QUOTE=04Terminator]i am familiar with the mod motors, i have machined and built a few, at my
previous employment, from where i stand, for a street/strip type
car, with a ls motor forced induction is not needed to run 10's and such
i dont think i could get a budget notch in the 10's with a 2v motor swap
without fi, however it is very realistic with ls power on motor. i am not arguing the capacity of the nmra type cars, but like i said they far from conventional, the ls1 is in its infancy compared to the mod motor in development, the mod has been around since really early 90's. but
perhaps with the current development of LSx motors they will be more widely accepted by hardcore racers, and we will begin seeing them in 7, 8 sec. cars etc. a oem 6.0 block has alredy seen the 6's but that was in a tube chassis,
lite weight, dedicated race car, as are all serious single digit cars.
those dam mach 1's do seem to hook, give em that

ponygt65

[QUOTE=NemeSS]Where were you wrong?.......First off....an Mach 1 has NO problem with LS1 fbods. Don't say an N/A mod 4.6 can't hang....cause that is JUST NOT true. Secondly.....In case you didnt' notice...THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A N/A 03-04 TERM. So OF COURSE you are not going to see one run 9s. Guess you dont' see too many complete terminator long blocks when you 'used to' machine the short blocks.....UH DUH. Thirdly.......if you dont' believe there are quick N/A mod motors...you obviously spend too much time machining vs. drag racing. I have NEVER disputed the fact that 4.6s can't see 500 hp without FI......NO ****.....at best they will see 400RWHP (cammed and all)..I am not stupid. HOWEVER........you can NOT compare motors and then back them up with ETs....what part of 'motors dont' race, cars do' do you not understand. Having said that....are we discussing motors or cars? Make up your mind.

4V's obviously flow better than 2V's that doesn't take a genious to figure out...but if you are going to bring that up, you better realize there is a difference even within the 4V's.........Not all of them are the same.

Now, I am done here...if you chose to be ignorant and not research 4.6 mod motors (4V and 2V's alike) and choose to argue your point by using ETs, and Machine work...that is your choice. But your reasoning for the LS being superior is just plain ignorant. Further more, if you were completely honest, you would agree that BOTH motor designs have their pluses and their minuses. One is not better than the other. THey were designed with different things in mind.

BTW......let's talk stock....since that is all we can really go on.
346ci (LS1).....(310/.85) 365 Crank HP = 1.055 HP/CI and 64.035/Litre
281ci (4V).......(285/.85) 335 Crank HP = 1.192 HP/CI and 71.276/Litre

Now please tell me how the LS is SOOOOOOO MUCH better than a mod motor?....mod's don't mean SHIAT, because that is nothing more than difference ways to make power, for different types of motors. That is enough for today....School is now out of session.

ponygt65

[QUOTE=5301113]
FWIW...I truly wasn't trying to argue with you....just trying to make some points. I didnt' mean to come across as being an ***.

5301113

iTrader: (18)

[QUOTE=ponygt65]IT's COOL
We both love our Cars
I was trying to make some points too.

TRMach1

Not to add fuel to the fire, but geez why is it that the Corvette, a purpose built, 2 passenger sports car, is always dragged into these comparisions with Mustangs, which are 4 passenger sport coupe pony cars that have actual trunks and back seats?? I'm sorry, but the Shelby GT500, other than being a rear wheel drive, 500hp V8-powered vehicle, really has nothing in common with a Corvette. You might as well compare the 'vette to a Lexus or a Mercedes, they have about as much in common as the Mustang does, give it a rest.

As for the auto machinist that compares the little 281 cubic inch mod motor to the 347 cubic inch LS1, simple math; smaller engine equals smaller combustion chamber equals less air/fuel equals less power than the larger motor with the larger combustion chamber. The only way to overcome this deficiency is to either make the smaller motor bigger, or cram more air/fuel into the combustion chamber, thereby increasing the power. On a stock for stock basis, however, I'll put up the 4V DOHC mod motor in my Mach 1 against the bigger, more powerful LS1 any day.

5301113

iTrader: (18)

Because A LOT Mustang owners say how Superior the GT 500 is COMPARED TO VETTE's. Alot Mustang owners get upset when people talk about mustangs, machs, shelbys. They go on and on about GT500 are better in every sinces compared the vette's (chevy flagship). Mustang is ford flagship(KIND OF).

Nobody can say anything about Mustangs, Mach's ,(Corba's) without get some upset.

Your proved my point your Putting your Mach(4 passenger sport car) up against anyone (vette's 2 passenger sport car) to show how superior the mustang is. You run 9 sec
Two cents
The End

Irunelevens

Well this thread turned into a giant clusterfuck... but FWIW, there are N/A 2V 4.6s with 400rwhp or VERY close to it. Talk to Ken Bjonnes about that. Now will a 4.6 (4v or otherwise) get to 500rwhp N/A? Not likely. But it takes a decent amount of money to get 500rwhp N/A out of an LS1... it's not like you can just do some bolt-ons and be there.

Quickin

Its marketing. Rousch knows there's enough morons in this country that will fall prey to such a cheezy and easy marketing scam. Nothing illegal, but it certainly has the morons rushing to the dealership so then the sales people can do their magic.


.

darcar1

[QUOTE=ponygt65]First off I wouldn't say NO problem. Get real the Mach 1 has it's hands full with an LS1 just as the LS1 has it's hands full. I'm not magazine racing this because my brother has one and I know first hand it's a drivers race.


[QUOTE=ponygt65]Little magazine racing there?

MUSTANGBRKR02

iTrader: (91)

well i saw the tag it said 48,xxx so it was 50g's either way more than i would spend on a car that does 13.50's and he had a hand held tuner on it and exhaust but thats all i could get out of him.

KingCobra02

[QUOTE=ponygt65]1) WTF??? Im not even going to comment on the " motors dont race, cars do" comment. Im not a brain surgeon by any means but.... the mach 1 is still a 4.6 right? No matter if if has dohc, sohc, or 8 cams with 86 valves.... its still a 4.6. Therefore not being anything special.

2) Im sure he meant " n/a cobras" no need to be a **** about "what name he called it"

3) Lets talk power per cubic inches(since you brought it up) assuming your math is correct... your .14 more horsepower per inch sounds great on paper, but your still lacking 65 inches, therefore still being down on power...and the ls1 still makes MORE power. What was the logic behind your statement?

4) As for the "Mods dont mean SHIAT" comment - You are exactlly right. Stock for stock a 37xx pound car with 270 rwhp wont hang with a 37xx pound 315 rwhp car, no matter what brand it is. Stock ls1 vs. built(or S/C) 4.6 might be a different story.

What chapps my *** about this, is that the "mustang" crowd says that their here to learn and/or teach....but 75% of them are here to troll and/or bitch. To the 25% that are cool and open minded "PROPS" to you. To the others, if you dont like what you hear, fact or opinion.....remember YOUR ON AN LS1 SITE!

uno

since hp/liter is the end all. maybe we should all trade in our cars and buy honda s2000's. since they are 2.2 liters and have 237 hp.

allngn_c5

iTrader: (3)

[QUOTE=KingCobra02]How about 490 rwhp 445 rwtq LS1 highly modded H/C car professionally tuned by LG Motorsports VS a stock c6 Zo6? Why does one put a car on me and another I put a car on ? Both cars were driven by comprable drivers but car A. wins by a car, and car B. loses by a car. I should mention this though, the races with Car A. were only to 130-140 vs Car B. we ran to 165-175. No traffic for the races with car B. Sorry no video to show, I forgot my camera and the driver of Car B's camera took a crap on him.

KingCobra02

[QUOTE=allngn_c5]what????? Wtf are you talking about????

I like cheese!!!

allngn_c5

iTrader: (3)

[QUOTE=KingCobra02]

I am talking about I lost to a lesser powered car (stock c6 z) similar weight by a length or less, and then beat another c6 z driven by someone else by 1 car or so. I think it boils down to a drivers race. 40 hp can be made up on a perfect launch and perfect shifts. just my 2 cents.

ponygt65

[QUOTE=darcar1][QUOTE=ponygt65]

First off I wouldn't say NO problem. Get real the Mach 1 has it's hands full with an LS1 just as the LS1 has it's hands full. I'm not magazine racing this because my brother has one and I know first hand it's a drivers race.


Your right about the first part.......I shouldn't have said NO problem. That indicates the mach is faster (I realize that now that you commented). I meant it as it has no problem competing..as in driver's race.

But the second part?..how is that magazine racing? Maybe you missed my point. He brought up 4.6s can't compare to the LS1s and he knows because he has machined them. We can't talk modifying here, so I went with stock. He says one motor is better than the other.....his proof? - ET's......I backed up my reply of the motors can indeed compare...and I showed REAL proof on how.....by talking about the ACTUAL motors, not ETs or top speeds, or trap speeds. The only way you can compare the stock motors (since modding, it is anyones game) is by comparing the stock specifications.......and the power of which they both have stock. THAT is what I did.