fly boy_1

iTrader: (4)

Last night I installed some double adjustable LCA's, LCA relocation brackets, and an adjustable PHB (all midwest chassis, and founders brackets). The wheel hop I had is gone, but now traction is significantly worse both in turns and in a straight line, is that normal? I set the PHB and LCA's to factory length, used the upper hole on the LCA brackets, also have strano lowering springs, Koni SA shocks and I'm on nitto NT05's (non drag radial). Any ideas what I might have screwed up, or is that normal? Thanks,

Eric

UMI Sales

iTrader: (1)

Can you try a lower hole on the relo brackets?

I'm assuming the lowering springs were in there before this installation?

When the car is at rest with you in the car are the arms downward towards the rear?

Your combination sounds like it should work.

ramey

fly boy_1

iTrader: (4)

Yes, there is another hole lower than the current one that I can try too. A previous owner of the car did the spring and shock install, so I have no idea what they are set to. I believe they used it in more of an AutoX fashion so maybe I should make an adjustment there?

Called MWC and talked with them a bit, they feel its more of a tire issue at this point. Temperature outside also isn't helping any. Sounds like some kind of DR is in order. Maybe a TA too, but that will wait till I can get a 9" rear.

UMI Sales

iTrader: (1)

If you're sure they're Strano springs, I'd give Sam a call and ask him what setting would be best for the shocks. Make sure you know your sway bar size and other specs.

We can help you with the proper torque arm. What's a DR?

ramey

fly boy_1

iTrader: (4)

Pretty sure they are strano, don't have the receipts unfortunately. Its also supposed to have strano hollow swaybars, dunno what size though. Sorry, when I said DR I meant drag radial, currently on street tires.

fly boy_1

iTrader: (4)

So I went and measured the swaybar and it is 22mm so its a strano. I also checked the LCA angle, with no one in the car they are ever so slightly angled down towards the rear, maybe 10-20* past parallel. Sound like I may want to drop the LCA's to the lower hole then? I'd imagine with a driver the angle would change and the rear end would be higher than the frame end?

BMR Tech2

iTrader: (5)

I agree with Ramey, try using the lower setting on the relocation brackets to help with your traction issue. The more aggressive control arm angle helps straight-line traction, but some have reported it binding with the relocation brackets at the lowest setting.

fly boy_1

iTrader: (4)

I figured I'd try the upper hole first, will move it to the lower one next. With rod ends will there still be potential for binding?

UMI Sales

iTrader: (1)

Oh, sorry for the DR. Duh.

Up toward the rear is the kiss of death for traction. If the car squats plus driver weight you could be significantly up.

Your approach is a bit different as most customers go for the bottom adjustment hole to start.

You should be bind free with rod ends (or Roto-Joints). Poly can bind at high bar angles due to roll steer making the diff skew more than when arms are close to parallel. We can solve this by lubing properly.

Keep us posted on how it goes.

Ramey

fly boy_1

iTrader: (4)

OK, I'll swap to the low hole tonight. While I'm in there I was wondering if it'd be worth pulling the shocks out and resetting them? I have no idea where they are set, and being that it was purposed for autox I might want to soften the rear end up some I'd think?

Sam Strano

iTrader: (41)

It's cold... tires have no traction when it's cold. And contrary to popular belief around here and other forums, you just don't magically add traction. If the tires can't stick, I don't care what suspension mods you have, the car won't hook. And fwiw, soft compound summer, or even worse, race tires, HATE the cold.

UMI Sales

iTrader: (1)

Here's how to set them:

http://www.koni-na.com/adjustment.cfm

You could try full soft to see how it works. Whatever you do, take good notes.

You could also try these: http://chickenhawkracing.com/products.php?m=0&d=3

Ha Ha

ramey

fly boy_1

iTrader: (4)

Thanks for all the help guys, I have some results from my tweaking of it tonight. Car is lowered with Strano springs which are a 1.2" drop. So I added the Founders LCA reloc brackets, MWC double adj LCA's and PHB with rod ends all the way around, all at the same time yesterday. I set the LCA's and PHB to stock length. I put the reloc brackets in, and used the uppermost hole for the LCA's as I read somewhere that the upper hole is more autox oriented while the bottom is more pure drag performance.

As it turns out, that is NOT the case with the FOUNDERS LCA brackets on lowered car. With the upper hole it cured my wheel hop issues however traction went out the window. Felt like the car had 600hp the way the tires were hooking. Handling was also downright dangerous, the rear would break loose with very little steering input. Having read all of the replies in this thread I went back and put the LCA's in the bottom hole and OMG totally new car! A LOT of the noise from the rod ended parts is gone, traction is even better than before I put all the stuff in (as it should have been lol), and the rear end feels much more predictable during aggressive cornering. This is what I was hoping for, and I have it now.

This leaves me wondering though...

When I put the LCA brackets in, even the upper hole is a good inch and a half or so lower than the stock LCA location. As it turns out the LCA's were not angled down towards the rear enough, but they were closer to optimal than stock yet I lost a LOT of traction? Before I put the parts in it'd spin a good bit in first, second and would chirp the tires into third. After the brackets I no longer had wheel hop, but traction disappeared to the point just creeping from a stop sign you'd spin. Thoughts on this?

fly boy_1

iTrader: (4)

FWIW, I've driven the car in colder temperatures such as I'm seeing now, and yes it has less traction than is say 60*+ weather but not like it was with the upper hole.

UMI Sales

iTrader: (1)

What LCA's were on it before? Factory with rubber bushings? I'm wondering if the rod ends took away all the cushion (of course they did) enough to cause the traction issues.

Did it have bad traction say from 20mph through 60mph, not necessarily from a dead stop?

Quite honestly if the first hole gave you a slight downward angle toward the rear, traction should be available as normal. This is actually kind of a weird problem.

How much engine do you have?

ramey

fly boy_1

iTrader: (4)

Originally it had the factory lCA's with rubber bushings. Before I put the PHB LCA's and brackets on traction was hit or miss after first if you really got on it. With all that stuff on, but using the upper LCA bracket hole traction was gone pretty much any gear all the time. As of now with the lower hole, traction is notably better than before the brackets and everything else.

Car is m6 laying down a whopping 360hp/357tq with 3.90 gears in the rear. I agree, the issue I had was very odd.

VinR1

iTrader: (17)

Street tires + cold pavement = no traction

Sounds like you have a kick-*** setup as it is...try stickier tires (you'll need them anyway) like Sam suggested before you start swapping out one perfectly good part for another

fly boy_1

iTrader: (4)

Maybe I didnt make myself clear, having driven the car in cold weather before the swap, traction wasnt horrible but I got wheel hop, as I did in summer. The issue here isnt that i need more traction now, but why the upper hole on the lca reloc bracket had worse traction than stock did, even though the geometry should have been better. With the bottom hole on the lca bracket it did exactly what I had hoped for. Tires aside I was just curious why on the one setting traction was worse than stock.