Odd Steering Problem
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Odd Steering Problem I just bought a used 98 Camaro a few months back as a daily driver run around type car. This car does something I've never experienced before and I've owned about 10 newer fbodies. The steering rocks back and forth on slightly bumpy roads, you can feel it in your hands and if you let go of the wheel you can see it rock back and forth with the road??????
Now I'm a experienced Mechanic-Engineer and it has me stumped which direction to go with this. The shocks are kind of weak but I wouldn't say they were worn out. Tires are road force balanced and dead smooth on a smooth road. But even a smooth road with slight ripples in it will cause this crazy rocking steering wheel.
Its almost like one frt wheel is ahead of the other one contacting the road and as you drive one side rolls over a bump in the road then the other one does. I checked the distant between the wheels side to side and there is about 1/2 inch difference wheel to wheel side to side. Its easy for me to change that using the caster adjustment but I really don't think it will help anything.
I drove my TA today on the same roads and while you can feel the roads imperfections in the steering wheel it doesn't ever do the rocking thing. The TA wheel to wheel side to side has about 1/4inch difference.
Please don't post up the obvious or stupid crap. If you have some real experience with something like this please post up. Thanks
Now I'm a experienced Mechanic-Engineer and it has me stumped which direction to go with this. The shocks are kind of weak but I wouldn't say they were worn out. Tires are road force balanced and dead smooth on a smooth road. But even a smooth road with slight ripples in it will cause this crazy rocking steering wheel.
Its almost like one frt wheel is ahead of the other one contacting the road and as you drive one side rolls over a bump in the road then the other one does. I checked the distant between the wheels side to side and there is about 1/2 inch difference wheel to wheel side to side. Its easy for me to change that using the caster adjustment but I really don't think it will help anything.
I drove my TA today on the same roads and while you can feel the roads imperfections in the steering wheel it doesn't ever do the rocking thing. The TA wheel to wheel side to side has about 1/4inch difference.
Please don't post up the obvious or stupid crap. If you have some real experience with something like this please post up. Thanks
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After finding a few similar posts on this site I found its probably worn lower A bushings. Monday I'm going to give it a good inspection and see what I can find. Car is low mileage but sat a lot and I noticed the rubber on other parts were is bad shape. Probably old and crack. I also didn't notice at 1st but now after 4k miles its slowly getting noticeable. Dam its a bitch when your rubbers are cracked.....
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This shake is that bad @45mph it starts to hurt your wrists only on vertain roads. other roads its dead smooth. I'm 99% sure its a caster setting problem. The right frt tire is leading 1/2 inch ahead of the left frt tire. On a newly paved road with slight ripples in it the wheel shakes hard back and forth, come off the newly paved road onto another road without ripples and its completely smooth. Its not a tire issue I'm sure.
I'm going to reset the caster this morning so both sides are within a 1/4 inch and see where it goes. My guess is the right frt tire hits the ripple 1st then the left hits it causing the wheel to oscillate back and forth. I'll post back up after I set it.
I'm going to reset the caster this morning so both sides are within a 1/4 inch and see where it goes. My guess is the right frt tire hits the ripple 1st then the left hits it causing the wheel to oscillate back and forth. I'll post back up after I set it.
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Changing the caster didn't help at all, took the car back to the tire shop and had them rebalance the tires. Helped 90% of the shaking is gone, so its in the tires. Fairly new Firestone Affinity 225/60/16. Their road force machine was down broken so they offered when it gets repaired in a few days to come back and try that.
The frt springs are 20 years old and the frt hangs low, I'm thinking that may be part of the odd feel this car has. My 01 TA still sits up high in the frt and drives like new.
The frt springs are 20 years old and the frt hangs low, I'm thinking that may be part of the odd feel this car has. My 01 TA still sits up high in the frt and drives like new.
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Original factory shocks, they seem very stiff and the frt end doesn't move easily if you push on the body but they do seem to float a bit as they rebound where the TA just rebounds solid. Probably a good place to start, I'm going to change them.
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Drove it today and it started shaking again on every newer paved road. Older roads it doesn't do it. Really crazy if you ask me. I have no ideas WTH is going on a this point. It doesn't shake out of control but just shakes the wheel back and forth hard enough that you can't stop it. Very Odd
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I can't find anything wrong at this point, I'm going to go back over it again and really check everything closely. What blows my mind is after they rebalanced the tires it seemed fine? It only does this if there are ripples in the road and newly paved roads cause it to do it the worst. I drove my TA on the same roads, in the TA you can feel the ripples through steering wheel but it doesn't shake back and forth to them
I'm a experienced mechanic and have seen it all till now. I have never had a car do this crazy thing. There is no play, the car handles great. Why would a ripple in the road cause the steering wheel to move?
I'm a experienced mechanic and have seen it all till now. I have never had a car do this crazy thing. There is no play, the car handles great. Why would a ripple in the road cause the steering wheel to move?
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I solved the problem by reducing the negative camber on both sides and toeing it in a 1/32. I think it was actually hunting back and forth?
Now I can feel the shocks are a little weak and the tires are a tad bouncy(oversize 225/60/16) but it doesn't shake the steering wheel any more!
Now I can feel the shocks are a little weak and the tires are a tad bouncy(oversize 225/60/16) but it doesn't shake the steering wheel any more!
Yea. Our springs are so stiff that the old "compress and step back" test doesn't work very well. (like on a sedan) We could probably debate all day if your shocks are "bad" but there's no way the rubber seals inside are fully intact after all these years - so they definitely aren't close to 100%. If the shocks are struggling, I would think they would exaggerate whatever problem you were having.
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Yea. Our springs are so stiff that the old "compress and step back" test doesn't work very well. (like on a sedan) We could probably debate all day if your shocks are "bad" but there's no way the rubber seals inside are fully intact after all these years - so they definitely aren't close to 100%. If the shocks are struggling, I would think they would exaggerate whatever problem you were having.
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Yep Joe, my WS6 isn't happy unless I give it a little toe in.
To sum things up after a LOT of looking at things here's the final solution on this. 1st is the springs are SHORT and STIFF, that alone adds to the feedback into the steering PLUS I found both frt brake calipers were slow to release. So the entire time the brake pads were dragging on the rotors, the rotors being some what warped were adding a slight shimmy to the steering all the time. Then add in negative camber with zero toe and you get a rocking steering wheel on rippled roads.
It works nice now, no steering wheel shake at all, you can feel the road in the steering wheel but no shaking. So Camber is near 0 and toe is 1/32, both frt calipers replaced. This was stressful to fix but I didn't give up trying, nothing ventured.....nothing gained I always say.
To sum things up after a LOT of looking at things here's the final solution on this. 1st is the springs are SHORT and STIFF, that alone adds to the feedback into the steering PLUS I found both frt brake calipers were slow to release. So the entire time the brake pads were dragging on the rotors, the rotors being some what warped were adding a slight shimmy to the steering all the time. Then add in negative camber with zero toe and you get a rocking steering wheel on rippled roads.
It works nice now, no steering wheel shake at all, you can feel the road in the steering wheel but no shaking. So Camber is near 0 and toe is 1/32, both frt calipers replaced. This was stressful to fix but I didn't give up trying, nothing ventured.....nothing gained I always say.
Jack car up on whichever corner it is you need to check the brakes on and chock the other wheels. sit in and start the engine, hand brake off and in neutral. Press the brakes hard and then release. Whilst you are releasing have your friend try to spin the wheel. As soon as you're fully off the brakes there should be no binding. The release should be practically instant. If the caliper is slow you will know it straight away because it will still be hard to turn the wheel for a few seconds even after you're fully off the brakes.