Anyone driving with a Watts Link?
#2
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There are several threads, perhaps older, of answers to this. Yes I have one on my 4th gen. It's definitely an improvement. Not as dramatic as new shocks were. But makes the rear end feel more confident in general. The only downside is the increased weight, but really that's not a real concern for the improved handling you gain. Oh and if you need to replace your gears or diff it's in the way. Fays2
I say do it.
I say do it.
#3
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I had a custom made Watts linkage on a mid 1970's Olds Cutlass many (30+) years ago.
It always adds a lot of weight. If you set it up like that Fays2 setup, at least it's mostly sprung weight on the chassis/body.
What car are you putting this on, @GM02ceta? Don't most 4th Gen F bodies have a stock panhard rod? IIRC, the mounting points (chassis and axle) on that setup are pretty strong. The bar itself is a little on the flexible/wimpy side. But it would be trivial to get some 1" ID tubing and some threaded bungs and rod ends (either spherical bearings or poly bushings) and make a stronger rod that fits the stock mounting points. Speedway Motors has all the hardware for that. DM if you need a parts list.
It always adds a lot of weight. If you set it up like that Fays2 setup, at least it's mostly sprung weight on the chassis/body.
What car are you putting this on, @GM02ceta? Don't most 4th Gen F bodies have a stock panhard rod? IIRC, the mounting points (chassis and axle) on that setup are pretty strong. The bar itself is a little on the flexible/wimpy side. But it would be trivial to get some 1" ID tubing and some threaded bungs and rod ends (either spherical bearings or poly bushings) and make a stronger rod that fits the stock mounting points. Speedway Motors has all the hardware for that. DM if you need a parts list.
#5
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I pretty much just autocross my car now. But, the Watts link is a huge improvement and critical if handling alone is your goal. I have a Fays 2 on my car now for about 4 years. It is less isolated, so more noise (I have all rod ends so everything makes noise), and can get in the way. I wouldn't consider the weight a problem for the performance gain.
#7
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I pretty much just autocross my car now. But, the Watts link is a huge improvement and critical if handling alone is your goal. I have a Fays 2 on my car now for about 4 years. It is less isolated, so more noise (I have all rod ends so everything makes noise), and can get in the way. I wouldn't consider the weight a problem for the performance gain.
00PewterSS, installing one seems fairly straight forward but did you install it yourself and if so was it difficult to center rear and adjusting the rods?
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#8
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I think if you have a stock rear suspension in the car it would be no trouble. I did have some trouble trying to fit everything because I had a Ford 9", with larger bar and UMI coilovers and 3" exhaust. It does fit, just took a bit of effort. It is not difficult to get the rear centered. Just follow the instructions or you could cause it to bind. I usually use ratchet straps to move the rear... but I also did this work on a 4 post.
I did talk to UMI when they were developing their Watts link and I'm sure it is good, but I have no experience with it. The midwest products I also have no experience with, but it seems on the light duty side. I likely would still purchase the Fays 2 setup, since I have had good luck with it.
I did talk to UMI when they were developing their Watts link and I'm sure it is good, but I have no experience with it. The midwest products I also have no experience with, but it seems on the light duty side. I likely would still purchase the Fays 2 setup, since I have had good luck with it.
#9
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The customer service is great at Fays 2 as well (as it is at UMI too) - I needed some swaybar mount spacers that weren't listed on their site and Jim immediately responded to my email and sent them out quickly. No input on driving impressions, it's still sitting on a shelf beside the car.
#10
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I have the UMI watts like on my Camaro with 9" and all the usual suspension parts. It feels so much better and just more like it should. Since I did the axle at the same time and went from 3.73 back to 3.40 gear, it's hard to compare times but I dropped around 2 seconds at VIR full course. Part of that is driver mod and just more confidence in the car.
The UMI watts only adds 10-15 pounds which is mostly spring weight and is on the right end of the car, definitely nothing to worry about. The setup takes a little time and patience but again well worth the effort. Also I have a 3.5" single pipe exhaust and it fits fine.
The UMI watts only adds 10-15 pounds which is mostly spring weight and is on the right end of the car, definitely nothing to worry about. The setup takes a little time and patience but again well worth the effort. Also I have a 3.5" single pipe exhaust and it fits fine.
#13
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I have the UMI watts like on my Camaro with 9" and all the usual suspension parts. It feels so much better and just more like it should. Since I did the axle at the same time and went from 3.73 back to 3.40 gear, it's hard to compare times but I dropped around 2 seconds at VIR full course. Part of that is driver mod and just more confidence in the car.
The UMI watts only adds 10-15 pounds which is mostly spring weight and is on the right end of the car, definitely nothing to worry about. The setup takes a little time and patience but again well worth the effort. Also I have a 3.5" single pipe exhaust and it fits fine.
The UMI watts only adds 10-15 pounds which is mostly spring weight and is on the right end of the car, definitely nothing to worry about. The setup takes a little time and patience but again well worth the effort. Also I have a 3.5" single pipe exhaust and it fits fine.
Thanks for any info you may have.
#14
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This does most of the work of the Watts without the cost and complexity.
https://www.umiperformance.com/home/...-leveling-kit/
https://www.umiperformance.com/home/...-leveling-kit/
No, not really. If the only goal is to lower the roll center a lot, then your statement would be correct. But that is still a PHB, still asymmetric. And the roll center on that is always lower than you have to option to run on a Watts link.
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Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
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www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
#15
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I am a Fays2 and UMI dealer both. I've used both and both work well. There are some cost differences, there are some differences in setup and exhaust clearance too. There are some differences in how they adjust, how easily that's done. A few others make them too, but often details are missed. It is critical the length of the arms is the same, and the angle of the arms is equal but opposite, otherwise you induce a bind, and many people are unware of this.
When a watts is done right, it adds a level of stability to the back of the car that allows more tuning options in springs, bars and shock damping to be used. Not having the car wiggle it's *** all over as it's moving up and down changes the behavior of the car a lot.
When a watts is done right, it adds a level of stability to the back of the car that allows more tuning options in springs, bars and shock damping to be used. Not having the car wiggle it's *** all over as it's moving up and down changes the behavior of the car a lot.
__________________
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
#16
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I am a Fays2 and UMI dealer both. I've used both and both work well. There are some cost differences, there are some differences in setup and exhaust clearance too. There are some differences in how they adjust, how easily that's done. A few others make them too, but often details are missed. It is critical the length of the arms is the same, and the angle of the arms is equal but opposite, otherwise you induce a bind, and many people are unware of this.
When a watts is done right, it adds a level of stability to the back of the car that allows more tuning options in springs, bars and shock damping to be used. Not having the car wiggle it's *** all over as it's moving up and down changes the behavior of the car a lot.
When a watts is done right, it adds a level of stability to the back of the car that allows more tuning options in springs, bars and shock damping to be used. Not having the car wiggle it's *** all over as it's moving up and down changes the behavior of the car a lot.
i would assume Fays2 has less clearance than the umi for exhaust. i am about to try and fit a 2,5 true dual set up from Hooker with my fays... do you think it will clear?
#17
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__________________
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
#18
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for those of us with the MWC 9" is there a Fays2 or UMI watts link that works otherwise the obvious answer is to use the MWC watts link. Think i was reading there may also be the need to buy adapters for the rear swaybar (stranos and other aftermarket) for clearance with 9" rears like the MWC
looking just at MWC watts vs UMI they look substantially different in construction.
looking just at MWC watts vs UMI they look substantially different in construction.
#20
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There isn't a lot of room for a 3" pipe, I can't imagine a 4" would have any clearance at all. It could fit, but it is going to likely hit both the Watts link and the heat shields. IDK about that true dual either since I think on that system both 2.5" are trying to share the same space as the 3" pipe normally.