JGA

Hi

Yes, they are welded every few inches along the length to the bottom edge of the pinch. ALso, you cannot see it, but flat pieces are welded between the rear subframe and control arm mounts to support the control arm mounts a little.

Sorry I do not have better photos. By the way I have both Spohn and BMR components on my car and there all good. Everyone has a preferance, but if you look closely its all nice stuff. It's great to have a car that is so well supported by the aftermarket.

JA

joecar

Hmmm... I'm about to do headers, but I do have my eye on the UMI SFC.

joecar

Yes, it is amazing and great how extensively our cars are supported.
Two thumbs up to all the businesses that make quality parts for the F-body.

joecar

Foxxton,

Good advise on springs/dampers; I do like the idea of adjustability;
I understand that the spring rate and damper rate must work together
(general "control system theory" (everything is a control system) if you're an engineer).


Yes, it's great when the sponsers chime in, they have execellent info.

Hmmm... 1LE bushings, I like the idea of a firmer rubber bushing, I'll do a web search on these
(where do you get these and what do you ask for...?).

So poly is ok for street use on engine, trans, torque arm mounts...?
Or is there a 1LE eqivalent for these...?

Strut brace: interesting info, the F-body is stronger than we think.

It is a lot of info, but do I enjoy researching the options before making a move
(I'm pretty patient, I look things up, and I take my time),
and I do appreciate other people's experience and comments.
Nah... my intelligence doesn't get hurt feelings, I'm pretty easy going,
and I like to hear what people have to say.


Yes, too right, Brisbane's nice, eh mate...

SD can be fun, keep your pecker up and don't let life get you down;
when it seems dull, there's always your car to work on (...have you seen EFILive...?), or there's lovely beaches.

I've been here in Or.Co. for 15 years and I've met a some nice people that have went out of their way to help me out.

Ha ha ha, I'm bi-lingual, I spell both ways without realizing it...

Cheers
Joe

damon_Z

Here's a list of part numbers for all 4th gen 1LE suspension parts and bushings:

https://ls1tech.com/forums/showpost....7&postcount=28

Polyurethane is not the way to go according to this site, http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/1...rethane%20good. Here are the reasons why (according to the site):

Why isn't Polyurethane a good bushing material?

* "...virtually no deflection..." (cut and pasted from their web page). As mentioned above, the engineers that design these cars employ rubber bushings because deflection is required in most locations.
* "But I lubed them well, or I used Polygraphite® bushings": You are asking the poly material to act like metal bushings, and it can't. Lubing will temporarily reduce the squeaking and stiction. The graphite-impregnated versions are just 'pre-lubed', and once the graphite has worked its way out, the bushings will squeak and require regular lubing like the others. Lubing does nothing for the binding problem.
* "They get quieter over time": Poly will cold-flow, meaning it will deform under pressure and not return to normal, as it lacks the elasticity of the rubber bushings. Over time, they will loosen and then rattle. Check out the shape of your swaybar's poly end-link bushings after only a few months. This cold-flow issue can also lead to alignment problems on the front control arms, as the bushings deform.
* "But everyone sells them". Well, yes, and the manufacturers of Slick 50 and the makers of 'ultra/super white' bulbs could line up a long list of satisfied customers, but what would that mean?
* "Testimonials are everywhere!" but they don't convey the facts. Don't' believe everything you read in a glossy brochure or web page. Ever watch those late night infomercials? Like those other automotive miracles, wouldn't the large manufacturers pick up on this stuff if it really lived up to all it's claims?
* "But lots of other people use them!" As mentioned above, trailing arm suspension requires deflection in order to work, and when poly bushings are used, the required deflection is still there -- in the bending of the arms, mounting points, and flex of the rear tires. This is why these bushings appear to work fine for street applications.

One of my factory rear lower control arms was bent; I wanted the bind-free 1LE bushings; and I didn't want to pay for the extra labor of simply installing new 1LE bushings and then reinstalling the control arms. Therefore, I ordered the factory 1LE rear lower control arms for $67.34 each from Dal Slabaugh. PM me for more info regarding Dal as I don't think he's a sponsor here.

I've also heard that Moog makes hard rubber bushings equivalent to the 1LE bushings. I know that Sam Strano sells Moog bushings and he is a sponsor here.

joecar

damon_Z,

Cool, thanks, I take it that these parts also work on 2000-2002 F-body also.

Hmmm... good, specific reasons against poly-u and poly-g;
I suspected they might be hard, but I never knew they had no deflection/compliance and that they cold-flow;
it makes sense: when cornering, one side goes up, other side goes down,
need some deflection at the bushings otherwise rear lower control arms will twist.
Excellent info.


This also tells me that poly for engine, trans, torque arm mounts is not good either, since want some movement/vibration soaked up.


How did your rear control arm get bent...?

Cheers
Joe

damon_Z

Somebody used it as a jacking point.

Foxxtron

iTrader: (1)

Well, in short yes poly isn't great for our cars, however I noticed that my rubber tranny mounts kept tearing after a while, so I went with an ES poly trans mount. It sure was noisy at first, but after about 3000 miles, it was quiet again. but yes, for ease and comfort if your rubber mounts are okay, then there should be no reason to upgrade them. Bushings on the other hand definitely could use upgraded rubber.

Oh yes, and as damon mentioned about his control arms bent, keep an eye on those technicians if you decide to have someone else do it. I hate to add in another dimension to this varied thread, however I notice a lot of techs use jack points other than what the factory manual advises, and that's a no-no as far as I'm concerned. An F-body should only be lifted safely by either it's wheels on a safe flat surface, or by its jack points ONLY. I know that there are those who say, "ahh hell, that stamped steel is so tough, it ain't gonna budge." For these reasons, a few national chains have lost my business. Paranoia, I don't know, but better safe than sorry AFAIK.

If you shall install subframes, make sure you install them while loading the suspension on all four tires. It is a bit ****, however as you know, even though the 4th gen chassis is pretty stiff, it doesn't help to take a short cut just to get them on the vehicle. Someone here is going mention that a drive on lift is too expensive or not readily available however it isn't necessarily needed, but highly advised due to its safety and quickness. If it is done with care and patience then a regular jack lift will suffice with some sort of blocks for the four wheels to rest on.

http://www.umiperformance.com/images/garage8.jpg
http://www.umiperformance.com/images/garage4.jpg
http://www.umiperformance.com/images/garage9.jpg

In essence these are pics of how it could be done, however me being a saftey freak I would do some things different, such as:

1. keep the jack stands positioned at the jack points and lowered slightly to serve as some thing to catch the body, and move them out of the way when I have to work at or around the jack points.

2. I would use a lot more blocks around the blocks that are already placed in the pics, so I can give more flat surface if the vehicle somehow decided to roll.

3. Since I would use more blocks to give more of a flat surface around the wheels, I would also use some sort of chock blocks to better ensure the wheels are immobilised.

I know that I'm probably going to be fried and flamed here for this critique, but I'd hate to have a 3300-3600 lbs. vehicle to come down on me or anybody else.

Sorry for the long winded hijack fellas, but I haven't seen any of these details readily mentioned after performing many searches.

BTW Joe, I'll send you a PM with some info.

joecar

Yes, I do all my own work since I'm not happy with shops.

Saftey is important.

I would use 4 Rhino ramps (I have 2 already);
I agree, the mono has to be in it's "at rest" state.