strut tower brace
03-12-2006, 05:37 PM
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strut tower brace hotchkis is not the same on lt1s and ls1s right? i saw some pics of the ls1s curve away from the engine? the lt1 is straight across?
am i correct? i dont want to go thru the hassle of removing my BMR just to find out it doesnt fit.
my car is a 98 z with ultra z hood.
am i correct? i dont want to go thru the hassle of removing my BMR just to find out it doesnt fit.
my car is a 98 z with ultra z hood.
03-12-2006, 06:02 PM
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I would think the LS1 "curved version" is not nearly as strong!
It looks great.. just a little lacking in terms of design. if your trying to brace 2 points, the easiest way (and strongest) is straight across. the curved beam would have to be eleventy billion (scientific estimation) times heavier to equal the strength of a straight beam. Plus it has "pin" joints as opposed to rigid joints of other designs...
Now if someone has access to a compression tester and 2 spare STB's we can put this matter to rest...
It looks great.. just a little lacking in terms of design. if your trying to brace 2 points, the easiest way (and strongest) is straight across. the curved beam would have to be eleventy billion (scientific estimation) times heavier to equal the strength of a straight beam. Plus it has "pin" joints as opposed to rigid joints of other designs...
Now if someone has access to a compression tester and 2 spare STB's we can put this matter to rest...
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03-12-2006, 06:41 PM
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Originally Posted by H8 LUZN
I would think the LS1 "curved version" is not nearly as strong!
It looks great.. just a little lacking in terms of design. if your trying to brace 2 points, the easiest way (and strongest) is straight across. the curved beam would have to be eleventy billion (scientific estimation) times heavier to equal the strength of a straight beam. Plus it has "pin" joints as opposed to rigid joints of other designs...
Now if someone has access to a compression tester and 2 spare STB's we can put this matter to rest...
It looks great.. just a little lacking in terms of design. if your trying to brace 2 points, the easiest way (and strongest) is straight across. the curved beam would have to be eleventy billion (scientific estimation) times heavier to equal the strength of a straight beam. Plus it has "pin" joints as opposed to rigid joints of other designs...
Now if someone has access to a compression tester and 2 spare STB's we can put this matter to rest...
Ive read/heard somewhere that the bends help make stronger
03-12-2006, 07:40 PM
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Originally Posted by LS1SpeedAddict
I have to disagree and agree with you at the same time. I agree that using the pin joints as opposed to welds makes it weaker but I dont think using the curved design makes it weaker for its purpose. Look at all sway bars on F-bodys.
Ive read/heard somewhere that the bends help make stronger
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Ive read/heard somewhere that the bends help make stronger
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The Strut tower brace is preventing the strut towers from getting closer together. and there is NO WAY a bent bar is stronger in compression than a comparably sized straight bar... especially being jointed the way it is and allowing rotation about the bolt.
I can do the math.. but its quite obvious.
For example... take a 1" metal tube and bend it into a U shape and take another 1" metal tube made of the same material. Take both ends of each bar and put one end on the ground and the other up in the air. Put weights on the top end on each one progressively... tell me which one fails first. It wont even be close.
03-12-2006, 10:15 PM
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I never said it would be stronger or as strong in a compression test. "I dont think using the curved design makes it weaker for its purpose". It obvious that the hotchkis is weak looking. Either way If I bought a strut tower bar I wouldnt get a hotchkis.
03-12-2006, 10:54 PM
#12
The fastener is a real problem. Since you have to be able to get the bolt into the joint there must be a tolerance between the bolt and brace. Just because there are two joints in that brace you are going to have a lot of movement where one side of the car can get closer to the other. Too bad they don't have a solid brace.
I think the joints are going to cause more flex than the bars giving under compression.
Too bad neither bar is tired into the firewall.
I am not sure about the bend in the bar. If you bend a bar its strength will actually go up. Strain hardening... It should be more resistance to bending if the bar was bend THAN a bar that was cast in a bent shape. Isn't there a difference there???
The straight bar is also going to bow out. It isn't magically immune to bending because of its straight shape.
Can you guys help me out on these couple of ideas? I am a little confused on what is actually going to happen and how much flex there is in this part of the body on our cars!
I think the joints are going to cause more flex than the bars giving under compression.
Too bad neither bar is tired into the firewall.
I am not sure about the bend in the bar. If you bend a bar its strength will actually go up. Strain hardening... It should be more resistance to bending if the bar was bend THAN a bar that was cast in a bent shape. Isn't there a difference there???
The straight bar is also going to bow out. It isn't magically immune to bending because of its straight shape.
Can you guys help me out on these couple of ideas? I am a little confused on what is actually going to happen and how much flex there is in this part of the body on our cars!
03-12-2006, 11:23 PM
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Originally Posted by 2002_Z28_Six_Speed
The fastener is a real problem. Since you have to be able to get the bolt into the joint there must be a tolerance between the bolt and brace. Just because there are two joints in that brace you are going to have a lot of movement where one side of the car can get closer to the other. Too bad they don't have a solid brace.
I think the joints are going to cause more flex than the bars giving under compression.
Too bad neither bar is tired into the firewall.
I am not sure about the bend in the bar. If you bend a bar its strength will actually go up. Strain hardening... It should be more resistance to bending if the bar was bend THAN a bar that was cast in a bent shape. Isn't there a difference there???
The straight bar is also going to bow out. It isn't magically immune to bending because of its straight shape.
Can you guys help me out on these couple of ideas? I am a little confused on what is actually going to happen and how much flex there is in this part of the body on our cars!
I think the joints are going to cause more flex than the bars giving under compression.
Too bad neither bar is tired into the firewall.
I am not sure about the bend in the bar. If you bend a bar its strength will actually go up. Strain hardening... It should be more resistance to bending if the bar was bend THAN a bar that was cast in a bent shape. Isn't there a difference there???
The straight bar is also going to bow out. It isn't magically immune to bending because of its straight shape.
Can you guys help me out on these couple of ideas? I am a little confused on what is actually going to happen and how much flex there is in this part of the body on our cars!
The only time I've ever seen any of the STB's fail is from a front broadside collisions or a head collision, otherwise never seen any of them fail, on the street or the track. Also be advised that several 4th Gen F-body AX and RRers around don't use them and for the ones that do don't really feel that they are performing what they purport to do. I had both a 2-point and a 3-point at different intervals, only for a few thousand miles each and ever since I've had the car, I've barely had them on there. I only dry fit every now and them to see if the fit would be different, and it isn't. Most of the fit problems are usually a result of manufacturing tolerances (either car or STB) and not gradual tower flex.
03-13-2006, 04:03 PM
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[QUOTE=Havok2]
according to the hotchkis official site, top one is for lt1s minus ram airs/ss's and the bottom is for ls1s
guess i got the wrong one [/Q
The straight ones fit all 93-02 v8 f-body's except for the 96-97 camaro SS, and the curved type will fit all 93-02 f-body's regardless of engine.
according to the hotchkis official site, top one is for lt1s minus ram airs/ss's and the bottom is for ls1s
guess i got the wrong one [/QThe straight ones fit all 93-02 v8 f-body's except for the 96-97 camaro SS, and the curved type will fit all 93-02 f-body's regardless of engine.
