Since everyone said you can't have both I'm just wondering how bad a launch will be with a car set up to handle good. I'm planning on geting koni's and strano springs for my car. Everything that I have read on that combo says it will make the car handle damn good. I'll have 315 bfg drag radials for the strip. How bad will it launch??

 

Not too good. I would expect 1.9-2.0 60fts with that setup.

 

I completely agree. I think stock shocks/springs, and add LCA's, panhard, good torque arm, and subframes and then put slicks/skinnes at the strip and good handling 17" tires on the street. Probably the best of both worlds that would be possible. And you won't have a ton on money in shocks/springs.

 

Whoa there people....

First of all, NOBODY can predict what a car can cut for times with ANY suspension, and that is simply down to the surface. I've seen cars with drag radials and "drag" suspension cut worse times than cars with "handling" suspensions on the same tires. I've seen stock cars out launch cars with a zillion parts.

I have customers with no compromise handling setups pulling 1.7's on DR's. And that's without unhooking a front bar, dropping rebound in the Koni's, softening springs, anything. Just slapping DR's on the car.

My springs are not at all hugely stiff in the rear. Actually there are more springs that are stiffer ultimately than are mine so weight transfer is quite good still.

Assumptions are bad things. But you can have a decently launching car that handles. You really can't have a is setup with a drag suspension and expect any kind of decent handling. Drag setups are 180 degrees away from what we want to make the car go where it's pointed. Drag setups are easy, make the suspension work like a wet noodle in the front, let the mass rise like it was on a Saturn rocket. Not good for street control.

Here's the question, pure and simple: Do you want the car do go like hell in a straight line only? Or be able to do that well and deal with all the other things you see day to day. After all, I can't think of too many places the roads are dead flat, dead straight, have no bumps or dips and that it's not windy (stability, which is part of handling).

 

Kansas. Just got to Kansas

 

I spend a week and a half a year in Kansas... It's plenty windy, and the roads aren't glass smooth either.

 

Jesus Sam get sense of humor. It doesnt have to be all serious all the time

When I drove through you could see on side of the state from the other on the interstate. It was flat as hell and looked like a giant square grid.

 

I have a sense of humor.... And I saw your , but I deal with people who are all too willing to believe just what they read. That's all, I got the joke.

 

Hey Sam, this thread got me thinking, and maybe some advice could help out others on here as well...

I've got Koni SA's (4th gen all around) but I'm using the stock springs. Would it be beneficial at all to change springs to one's that are a little softer to get a little better weight transfer? I drive with the shocks set all the way soft most of the time. Can you give me a quick overview of what softer springs would do? Are there any that you would recommend or would I have to get them custom?

Thanks!

 

right on

 

This is getting way too complicated. If you think about it, the answer is in plain sight.

GM paid a lot of money to a group of people with more years in college than I have been alive to come up with the solution to the problem that were trying to figure out on this thread. If you want a good compromise of everything, stock suspension is the key, thats what it was designed for. To be a good "all arounder" without being biased towards either side, drag or handling.

Everything is a compromise. The car would prolly hook fine on Strano's suspension and handle like a ****, but it'll cost more. Stiffer rear suspension pieces will always help but you'll give up a little factory smoothness.

My personal experience is that a handling car won't hook worth a damn on the street with street tires compared to a stock or drag suspension. But on the track with a sticky tire the handling suspension will hook about as good as stock suspension. Sometimes slightly better due to stiffer rear bars and the ability to control wheel hop.

 

That's very short sighted.... Really. GM historically does a TERRIBLE job on things like shocks. And cars are not just designed by engineers, but by accountants. And often neither of them have a clue about how things *should* work. I know GM, Daimler-Chrysler, and Ford engineers. Some are very smart, some are clueless. And I get to hear stories about how what they wanted got nixed because of money, or how a clueless bastard didn't know better.

Further, you must quantify what "stiffer" is, what "hooking" is. What "street" tires are. No a Pep-boys tire won't grab very well in general, but it will hook better on concrete than a Drag radial will on slick asphalt. There is a reason I don't do any setups online, and I want to TALK to people. Assumptions are horrible and lead folks astray. And often times they need a little help to acutally figure out what they REALLY want.

To say that the best answer is stock is no answer at all IMHO. The driveability of the car stock sucks. And we can make that a lot, LOT better without any change in traction (also likely better), and with an improvement in both ride and stability.

 

No but you can reasonably predict what a car SHOULD 60ft like given a certain suspension setup. OBVIOUSLY there are many other factors involved such as track prep, driver competence, etc. Thanks for oversimplifying things Sam. We all know that you aren't going to endorse stock suspension for any reason because you don't sell stock suspension. But that is fine, I understand that the main focus of your business is to sell suspension products and we all appreciate the products you have that make f-bodies handle really well.

A few of us were just trying to point out that if you don't want to spend alot of money and want to do both effectively, ("effectively" being a subjective term), that stock shocks/springs can work well.

 

You obviously don't know much about me. I'm pretty well known for NOT selling as many parts as I DO sell. If a stock suspension is what someone needs, I'll tell them that.

And "reasonably predicting" has another other names, like assuming, or guessing. While I will agree that stock springs can work very well in many cases (and often tell folks to stay on them INSTEAD of buying mine or some other springs we sell), the stock shocks are horribly terrible. If you could find 1 out of 100 folks who didn't find ANY shock to be better than stock, I'd be amazed.

 

It is the opinion of myself and many others here that the stock shocks aren't any good when they are new. Mine came off within weeks of driving my car home from the dealer. The valving is off, really off. GM put a ton of compression damping in these shocks and not enough rebound. They contribute to a harsh ride over some types of bumps and road surfaces and a floaty feeling at speed and during transitional maneuvers. You can do a lot better than the stock shocks without trying too hard, and you can do far better than that with a bit of effort and money.

The stock springs aren't too bad though...

 

I currently have stock spring/shocks/swaybars and can tell you that until i had ridden in a car w/ aftermarket suspension i was totally happy w/ stock. But I cant believe some of you guys are arguing with Sam that the stock suspension is BETTER at some stuff. Like Sam already said, the stock suspension was designed by accountants. They didnt try and make the car the absolute best they could possibly make it or we would all be running around in a bunch of Dick Harrel look alikes.

haha and sam....you know what they say about what happens when you assume something

But guys seriously ive read alot of Sams posts and he never tries to sell you more than you need. Ive never dealt with him personally but i plan on doing so when i am ready for shocks/springs/swaybards.

have a good day guys

 

Hey Sam could you check out my question above? I don't need a huge explanation, just something quick to explain why this would help or not.

 

Softer springs.... The stock rears are only about 115 lbs each, most you can go down to it a V-6 spring that's about 95 lbs. Given the way you can push the rear of the car down now, I don't think it's worth the effort.

 

Just so I'm sure that I am clear on this though, you would only change the rears if you were going to do it? As in leave the stocks on the front and do V6's on the rear? What does softer front springs do?

Are you saying it wouldn't be worth it because it would make the car less drivable, not worth the money (can't you find these for next to nothing?), or what?

I mean, if they would help AT ALL and NOT HURT ANYTHING, I would probably change them out. I've got free time over winter break...

 

Try it. What better way to find out? I really think that if you don't like the ride, the springs aren't going to change it much. V-6's ride about the same as LT1 and LS1's do stock